US soldiers rape women prisoners

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by diamond geezer, May 20, 2004.

  1. diamond geezer macrumors regular

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    #1
    link

    It would appear that using a prisoners close relations to prise info is standard US practice.

    link

     
  2. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #2
    This report must be wrong, gasp! Because there were only seven cases of reported abuse!!!! Just another left wing conspiracy to discount the fine job that our military is doing in Iraq!



    It's only going to get worse.....
     
  3. Neserk macrumors 6502a

    Neserk

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    #3
    *sigh*
     
  4. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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  5. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #5
    A few frustrated kids and pranksters.

    Seriously, if I were an Iraqi, I'd want to kill us for this **** too.
     
  6. diamond geezer thread starter macrumors regular

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    #6
    Apparently, a poll of iraqis found the 9 out of 10 saw the US as occupiers, rather than liberators.

    And that was before the prison scandal.

    The only people who think that the US is there because it cares about Iraqi freedom is Mr "awesome article" (a-la Backtothemac) and other rose-colored spectacle wearers.
     
  7. Neserk macrumors 6502a

    Neserk

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    #7
    Operation Iraqi Freedom is another infamous Euphemism used by the military to try and make something sound like something it isn't.

    (does that make sense?)

    IOW, Its occupation but it is much easier to sell if we label it Iraqi Freedom.
     
  8. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    1939 saw Operation Polish Freedom From Bolshevism.
     
  9. Backtothemac macrumors 601

    Backtothemac

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    #9

    You know what. I would really like to tell you what I think. But since I have been a member here for three years, and have respect for the moderators. AND I don't want to get banned. I won't.

    So, what I will say, is don't try to put me into the crowd of morons that are defending the actions of some of the soliders in Iraq. That is bull****, and I have not. I have defended the overall action of the soliders there, and the mission. I have done so from the stand point of family that is there, and from an article that pointed the finger NOT at those that disagree with the war, but at those in the media that will ONLY report the negative aspects of the war. I may not agree with someone, but I will die defending their RIGHT to say what they want and to form their own opinons.

    So, again. Don't you lump me into that uneducated group of people that are calling this what it isn't.
     
  10. Neserk macrumors 6502a

    Neserk

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    #10
    This is the problem. How can anyone defend the "mission" which was Georgie's personal vendetta that he mananged to accomplish through lies?
     
  11. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #11
    Do you agree that it's possible for noble men to serve nobly and be stunningly victorious in battle yet still lose the war?
     
  12. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #12
    Do you agree that it's possible for noble men to be led ignobly into behaviour which is degenerate, callous, inhumane and criminal?
     
  13. radhak macrumors regular

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    #13
    this is where it hurts the most. starry eyed youngsters inducted with high faluting promises finally ending up in situations they can't control, changing their nature and behaviour forever.

    i personally feel most embarassed when having to defend indefensible actions by people i admire / like/empathize with.

    i never felt as outraged Saddam's abuses were reported. he was a tyrant and a thug, and needed to brought to justice.

    but though not an army person (none in my friends/family), i have had admiration for the people joining it, in general, and the US army in particular. brave, personal sacrifice, all that thing (obviously, i have had to gloss over the concomitant violence and death dealt out, but still...).

    so these recent reports of abuse by army personnel of ever increasing serious nature are frustrating, to put it mildly. to top that are the demands for '[blindly] support the troops', or even reports from the middle by army people that harp on the nobility of the operation and end with, 'support the troops, and the mission'. makes me wonder about this blatant propaganda, and doubt my earlier admiration : was it wholly misplaced?

    maybe mightier the army, the more the arrogance? after all, absolute power and absolute corruption, right?
     
  14. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #14
    Absolutely ;)
     
  15. poopyhead macrumors 6502a

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    #15
    sadly, I'm american and this makes me want to hurt americans. if this is true then I'm not so sure that I can any longer feel the outrage I have previously felt about the deaths, sometimes horrible, of american military personnel.
    certainly one can no longer claim that these are the actions of a few, these are starting to appear to be the actions of americans as a group
    I am slowly starting to feel that this is a culture I no longer want to be associated with
     
  16. diamond geezer thread starter macrumors regular

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    #16
    I would REALLY love to hear what you think. I take it you're talking about what you think of me, rather than your political views (we've all heard plenty of those).

    With regards to "putting you in with that crowd of morons", well i didn't. As far as i can remember, you've been as outraged as anyone at the treatment of prisoners, although likening it to your University hazing rituals was a bit off, in my opinion. I spose i shouldn't have mentioned your name in my post, as i was actually referring to the Major who wrote that article, your name was just included as a reference so people would know what article i was talking about.

    I wouldn't even put you in the category of the aforesaid "spectacle wearers" , as I'm sure that you know this war isn't about Iraqi freedoms or even combating terrorism.

    I am in agreement with you about TV etc showing negative aspects of the war, but it's not just about what sells, it's also about fixing what's wrong, which is why the reporting is necessary.

    Your major says "I am not ignorant of the political issues, either. But as a professional, I have the luxury of putting politics aside and focusing on the task at hand." Well this is a political forum and we have the luxury of telling it as we see it.

    Also his final statement "All we ask is that Americans stand by us by supporting not just the troops, but also the mission.", seems to me like saying "don't question the President about all the lies, and why we are really here"

    Good soldiers should always be able to unplug their brains and consciences, so they are able to concentrate on the task at hand. The last thing you need are niggling worries about why you're away from home and invading a basically defenseless country, whose population see you as an enemy.

    I know where your coming from regarding not wanting to get banned, as I have already been banned for a comment about your precious President and i didn't notice anyone putting their life on the line to defend my right to say it on this board.
     
  17. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #17
    I thought you were just on holiday. :)
    Must have missed it. What did you say? :D
     
  18. Rower_CPU Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

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    #18
    The 1st amendment doesn't apply to this board - certain types of speech are not allowed.
     
  19. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #19
    Ladies and gents, this might be a good time to remind ourselves to take a few deep breaths before allowing our fingers to make contact with the keyboard...
     
  20. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #20
    And wash your hands, too! ;)
     
  21. Backtothemac macrumors 601

    Backtothemac

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    #21

    Um, no, you did lump me into a group. You took a cheap shot at me and went off the topic of the thread. The thread was about Soldiers raping Iraqi women. NOT about how we are viewed in Iraq, and then you try to slap me. So, I slapped back. My opinion was of your comment, not of you, because I don't know you.
     
  22. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #22
    Maybe they should be subjected to a little neocon justice, ala John Podhoretz:

    These were acts of ritual humiliation, and everyone who did it should be photographed in the same positions they put other people in.​

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200405240003
     
  23. Backtothemac macrumors 601

    Backtothemac

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    #23
    Well, Rush's justification is just friggin stupid. I tried to call in and tell him how stupid he was. As someone that has been deployed, I can tell you that sometimes things happen. Mistakes are made. These were not mistakes, they were orders. Those soldiers did things that only highly educated people would know to do to humiliate the Iraqi's. I think it would be appropriate to see them tortured the same way, but that includes the rape of the women, and the sodomizing of the men. Followed by the death of the soliders to match the deaths of the Iraqis.
     
  24. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #24
    You started out so well, then... oh my. Americans are not supposed to believe in torture, they are supposed to believe in justice, and torture can never masquerade as justice. If we can demonstrate anything worthwhile to the Middle East about our values (and it's precious little anymore), it should be that justice, western style, does not countenance torture or revenge.
     
  25. diamond geezer thread starter macrumors regular

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    #25
    That was back in my "Pinto" days.

    Now I try to be a good boy.
     

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