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Verizion To Reveal Customers in Swapping Case!

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by MrMacMan, Jun 5, 2003.

  1. macrumors 604


    Well NYT has a story (free reg... as '/.' says 'yeah yeah yeah')
    Over Here (if no reg, read it below)

    My idea, what the hell RIAA do your own dirty work, seriously a person got a couple files, ---- off.

    They are picking on a user (now 4 users?) who swapped songs, god, please.

    RIAA is scanning everyone and everything, heck they even are sending people letters to cease-and-desist, the article says that the professor was scanned and sent this because there software doesn't even get the file, it scans the name.

    Gah, just so stupid, if they ever sue me for my location I will sue them for slander and prove that there are LEGAL downloads from un-signed bands or bands that put their works on P2P software!

    I sense a RIAA hacking in 3...2...1...
  2. macrumors 6502a


    Well, uh, look on the bright side; more iTunes Store sales.
  3. macrumors 6502a


    Re: Verizion To Reveal Customers in Swapping Case!

    LOL. the RIAA is screwed. they need to rethink their whole strategy. they will never make the same money they did in the price-gouging '90s. no amount of suing is going to change that. they could have made this work to their advantage, but they didn't, and now all they can seem to do is give more hackers more inspiration to do their stuff. i wonder what they've got in mind....

    <EDIT> i really can't spell.
  4. macrumors 604


    Re: Re: Verizion To Reveal Customers in Swapping Case!

    haha, so true: but remember
    They ARE running Windows 2000 and on a MS - IIS/5.0 Server, so once the next hack is out they will exploit.

    They keep over charging and over charging... do I want to spent $25 on my fav band, they are my fav but $25, I don't have a job that is a lot for me.
  5. macrumors regular

    This really sucks. I read today on C|Net that Verizon's request for a delay was denied. They have to turn over the guy's name immediately.

    This shoots civil liberties on the Internet to hell. Sure, what he was doing was illegal (if he was distributing copyrighted material), but it is not Verizon's job to police its subscribers and shouldn't be forced to comply with every request the RIAA or MPAA makes into its subscribers. It will make Verizon look like a rat, even if they are ordered by the courts.
  6. macrumors regular


    The RIAA want these people's names so they can sue them for massive and disproportionate damages like those college kids a while back. Then they'll settle for less, still probably too much, and set a precident to go after more people.

    As far as I'm concerned, this is little better than blackmail. The RIAA seems to be trying to get themselves law-enforcement status, but with no oversight.

    File sharing is wrong, yes. But I think that enforcing this should be the job of actual police and criminal courts, for several reasons.

    Like it says in the constitution, punishments should be reasonable. Also, due process sort of exists in criminal court. It isn't so much a matter of a private citizen vs a team of highly paid lawyers, so you at least get a chance to prove your inocence.
  7. macrumors 601


    nuts. i read the title and thought it was about wife swapping.
  8. Guest


    I'd like to offer the opinion that falling music sales have little to do with P2P and more to do with the quality (or lack of it) of most of the new music the labels release. I've only bought two or three CDs so far this year and I think only the Foo Fighters one was actually worth the money (it was £9 - $15 - the cheapest you can buy it)
  9. macrumors regular

    The odd thing about the music industry, unlike all others, is that the reduction in costs of production (CDs vs. tape, vinyl) has never been passed on to the consumer. My wife and I just bought a Honda Element, loaded with features that were previously only available on higher-end cars, due to consumer demand and the reduction in cost.

    Music has actually become more expensive for no change in the product. I hate to boil it down to classifying music simply as a product but that is how the RIAA seems to treat it. I want to see CDs with bonus tracks, outtakes, live cuts and other cool features that we see regularly in DVDs. We as consumers expect this and the movie industry complies. It seems to me that we have had such low expectations of the recording industry for 30 years that they have become complacent.
  10. macrumors regular

    I'm not sure how to feel about these people. Personally, i don't see a problem with downloading the occasional song to sample that helps you make a decision whether or not to buy an album.

    But these people who are recklessly collecting thousands of songs they didn't pay for and then distributing them to others. That seems pretty wrong and they should be punished.

    As for the RIAA. My work is 90% in the music industry and i know a few of these executives and big wigs. I think that file-swapping is a scapegoat for falling sales. There simply is not the level of creative executives in the music industry as there were in past. For every Avril Lavigne, there are 10 knock offs. For every Linkin Park, there are 20 knock offs. It's just a flood of muck. No originality. There are only a handful of decent bands out there and even they only produce a few really good songs.

    Really, only Eminem could put out an event album right now. Everybody else is to busy trying to find the new Eminem when they should be trying to find different types of talent.

    Innovate, lower prices, give us reasons to buy CD's again. The big five record companies should send there main people for a weekend at Steve Jobs house. Maybe they would learn something.
  11. macrumors 604


    To me the exectives think this is really hurting them, it aint, really.
  12. macrumors 6502a


    my roomate uses limewire a lot. he downloads lots of crap he never listens to and would never buy in a million years. is he hurting the artists? he's certainly not going to go pay $17.00 for Chet Atkins and Mark Knopfeler's album.

    i'm sure there are some people that steal stuff they actualy want, but the same thing could be said of CD burners and tape decks. The CD industry is really suffering becasue of two things right now:

    1. music sucks. how many boy bands can you buy before you get sick of it? how much interesting, new music is coming from the big 5 (sans radiohead)?

    2. people are done upgrading to cds. people spent tons of money buying old LP's on CD, and that trend is almost over. my dad has already bought a couple hundred cds he already had on vinyl. he has no plans to buy any more of his old albums on cd. and he doesn't have any p2p on his machine.

    they're (RIAA) probably really uncofortable knowing that they can make no more money by reselling AACs or MP3s to people who can just rip their own CDs. oh well, like i said earlier, the RIAA had seven good years to develop an online solution for music, but they prefered infighting and bickering, so the web comunity just provided for itself.
  13. macrumors 604


    Its not even that people are done upgrading, it is that people are being hurt by the economy.

    Seriously people don't need CD's it is an extra expense, so people cut it out of the budget, the RIAA doesn't get that.

    Why is there a slight downturn?

    No, its the economy stupid.
  14. macrumors 6502

    When I pirate songs, I always either buy the albums or delete them.
    Even before napster, I didn't buy CDs unless I was absolutely sure that I would like several of the songs. Since I found LimeWire, I have purchased many more CDs. When napster first came into existence, I had, in the past decade, purchased 4 CDs.
    Since then, I have purchased about 50. The record industry has sold (I figure) at least 46 CDs that they would not have if not for P2P.
    Declining sales could be because:
    -New Music Sucks (Opinion)
    -There is no longer the variety in music that there once was. 'Genres' no longer exist, really, because most of the music from the "Big 5" sounds pretty much the same. People who don't like the one style just don't buy their music.
    -CDs are ridiculously priced.
    -The RIAA has alienated their customer base by making themselves the object of hatred.

    It's worth noting that the first year that the RIAA started their legal maneuvering against napster, their CD sales actually Increased . Their overall profits went down slightly, but the only markets where sales went down were vinyl and cassette singles. Prior to their self-inflicted PR nightmare, CD sales CONTINUED TO INCREASE, despite the widespread use of P2P services.
    It's also worth noting that their signifigant declines in marketshare did not occur until after we started to see economic troubles and that the record industry's overall profits have not decreased signifigantly more than the average across the market as a whole.

    Whether they want to fight a battle of principle or not, I see P2P as a bad business move by the RIAA.
  15. macrumors 604


    I feel no guilt downloading the songs of people who have more money then is good for them. If I downloaded a whole album by a band that isn't mainstream then I would feel some guilt.

    RIAA sucks. :(

    - scem0 [​IMG]
  16. macrumors 65816


    Good for the RIAA... I don't feel there are any civil liberties infringements here. The RIAA went through the courts and got a court order (much stronger than a subpoena for this case. That is pretty strong. Now, does this set a precedent that will allow them to only use a subpoena in the future to get information on the user?

    Verizon did a great job in fighting the fight. They had to, since they know there are so many users who only get DSL so that they can use P2P apps. If the floodgates are opened on this, it will put alot of work on their staff to go through radius logs to find out which user was using which IP address at a specific time. I don't doubt that this will be a full time job, maybe more than one.

    If someone shoplifts music off the Internet, they should be prepared for the consequences when the owner gets mad and takes them to court. My guess is that they are going after people with large collections of music with fast internet connections.
  17. macrumors 604


    One person admited through anon that he downloaded 3 songs... 3 SONGS, and he was going to be charged... and he was.

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