Virtual Console on Euro wii.

Discussion in 'Games' started by MRU, Dec 7, 2006.

  1. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #1
    Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its black borders all round :eek:

    Why have they given us the crappy 50hz versions.

    Sonic looks crap, even the sega classics collection was better than this.

    Bad enough our wii points & console cost more than the states, but then for
    the vc games to be the old 17.5% slower and 1" border debacle is really annoying.

    Feel like I''ve wasted my money on a wii points card.
     
  2. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #2
    meh, so long as they're like the classic games I once played I'll be alright. Never played an American Mega Drive.
     
  3. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #3
    So your willing to except and pay for a half assed version which has no reason to exist when the wii is more than capable of playing the VC games in 60hz mode ?

    It's not just megadrive games, Mario 64 has massive borders too. When they can make the game for the DS full screen it's simply not acceptable to have ***** pal conversions on todays wii hardware.

    Seriously Jimmi just because it's got a nintendo badge doesnt make it ok.
    If Xbox Live Arcade titles were as poor as this youd no doubt be giving out about them.
     
  4. Sky Blue Guest

    Sky Blue

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    #4
    That news was making the rounds last week.
     
  5. Sky Blue Guest

    Sky Blue

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    #5
    A Genesis?:p
     
  6. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #6
    I never had my Wii last week and I havent been following this board for a week or two.

    :rolleyes: Sheesh.
     
  7. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #7
    Sonic doesn't wear a Nintendo badge, he's in the club but not a badge holder. I'm used to the speed of Sonic, I played that more than any NES Mario game. I want the speed, but how are the borders? they could be a problem. Basically though I just want an exact system emulation even down to the bugs, if it replicates it properly (Can't remember if my Mega Drive had borders) then it saves me having to dig out my old machines.
     
  8. Spanky Deluxe macrumors 601

    Spanky Deluxe

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    #8
    I haven't heard about this but that's aweful!
     
  9. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #9
    the borders are bad man. Seriously it's bad and remember if you do hook up via composite, stretching the image to fill up those borders on a tv makes the picture really washed out and bad.

    Worse still hook up by component to vga box and you wont be able to stretch them (unless your monitor supports major vertical stretching), but a lot of HDTV's wont when connected via component.

    Mario 64 is noteably slower than the DS title. I played the 2 side by side.

    It's just very dissapointing and should not be excepted.

    At 800 points for sonic and 1000 for mario64 that's nearly 2000 points at £20/€30 and its NOT CHEAP.
     
  10. BoyBach macrumors 68040

    BoyBach

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    #10

    That's SOOO 1990's! ;)

    You'd think they would "remaster" the games though, 'tis a shame.
     
  11. Sky Blue Guest

    Sky Blue

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    #11

    Sometimes the NES VC games don't work and you have to blow into the Wii Disc slot and turn it off/on a few times.
     
  12. Chrismcfall macrumors 6502

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    #12
    Good Joke, made me laugh! I remember having to do this quite a lot with my NES, but it was worth it to play home alone!
     
  13. aidanpendragon macrumors 6502a

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    #13
    Sorry to hear about this. I understand need for translation, localization, etc., but if NA gets a fully-featured product...I guess you can't just run that program on PAL machines (or maybe you do and that's precisely what creates the problem). Hearing all this talk about 60Hz & scart cables is like another language.

    But - am I correct in assuming that NTSC/PAL differences disappear with HDTVs, since resolution and hertz are part of the HD standard? 480P or 720P are the same (by definition) everywhere? So would this problem affect a Wii outputting via component to HD? Would it be an issue at resolutions higher than 480P?

    Regardless, sorry again.
     
  14. Spanky Deluxe macrumors 601

    Spanky Deluxe

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    #14
    Yeah, HDTV standards are different, as are DVD standards. Its to do with the standard television signal. Over here, we have 576 line signals at 50Hz, whereas you guys have 480 line signals at 60Hz. I think its basically 576i@50 or 576p@25 or PAL vs NTSC's 480i@60 vs 480p@30. Basically, our standard SDTV signals have a lower refresh rate but a higher resolution. The refresh rate isn't really noticeable though but the resolution is.
     
  15. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #15

    Pretty much they dissapear yes. The majority of 360 games for example are 60hz ONLY so there is no pal in the equation.

    Whats annoying is you can run any emulator these days and stretch the image. So why didnt they merely stretch the pal games, it would at least make them look good, as it stands Mario looks like the dwarf in WoW...
     
  16. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #16
    perhaps not everybody wants a streched image i don't know


    that aside the games have an "update" button besides them and in the help it says that it might be used for improvements free of charge ..so perhaps they are working on those issues
     
  17. FleurDuMal macrumors 68000

    FleurDuMal

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    #17
    Hehe. But if it was Sony it would be a prime example of the European market having the piss taken :rolleyes:

    That really does sound like Nintendo is taking the mickey. Given that VC is one of the main reasons I wanted to get a Wii, I'd have to reconsider if Nintendo don't pull their socks up.
     
  18. Haoshiro macrumors 68000

    Haoshiro

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    #18
    As I am not in the UK, does this mean you are getting PAL versions of the games rather then NTSC? Or vice-versa?

    It seems logical that Nintendo/etc would just release one version of the game on VC across both NA/UK...
     
  19. Spanky Deluxe macrumors 601

    Spanky Deluxe

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    #19
    Hold on, I'm confused now, which versions are we getting, PAL of NTSC? Personally I'd want the 50Hz 576i versions because the refresh rate doesn't bother me and I'd like the higher resolution. What are we getting exactly? Are we getting 50Hz 480i versions, hence the black borders? Did Nintendo sell all PAL games on the N64 and SNES as 480i with black borders to get the resolution of PAL? If that's the case and these are simply the PAL roms then it doesn't really matter. I'm using my Wii at 576i PAL anyway. I set it to 480i@60Hz for a while but didn't really like it since the resolution was lower.

    I guess Nintendo should really have built both PAL and NTSC roms into each download so that the Wii chooses the best one for the output method that that individual Wii's set up for.
     
  20. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #20
    It technically wouldnt be a stretched image, it would adjusting it to the correct ratio :rolleyes:

    The orginal image is full 4:3

    When they are on a Pal screen they are squeezed / flattened to 14:9 dimension making all the charcters fat little blobs and a 1" border top and bottom.

    Having the option to correct the screen is common in emulators.
     
  21. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #21
    It's time for another game of help the luddite.

    I've been running my Cube in 60hz on everything, but 50hz has a higher resolution? I might have to switch back (of course, RE4 and MP2 were both 60hz only and had better graphics than everything else, not possible in higher resolution?)
     
  22. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #22
    We are getting the old bolloxed conversion ones with the thick borders top and bottom.

    Remember it was only a handful of N64 titles that were properly converted, all Snes & Megadrive/Genesis games were not, so the likes of Sonic, Zelda Mario 64 have the massive borders top and bottom.

    What's really annoying is they can make Zelda full screen when it was bundled as the freebie bonus disc to some gamecubes and with the original wind waker, so why have they given us these heaps of crap ?

    As I say the simpliest thing they could have done, was give us a menu in the virtual console so we can stretch screen and put the ratio back to normal.

    We might still be at pal 17.5% speed reduction, but at least we'd be at full screen.
     
  23. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #23
    Not hugely different to be honest.

    Remember pal games are 17.5% slower too

    So the tiniest increase in resolution (and we are talking tiny) is still degraded by that nearly 20% speed deduction.

    60hz all the way...........
     
  24. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #24
    so 50hz= higher res, VAT identical speed slower,
    60hz= lower res, regular speed.
     
  25. MRU thread starter macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #25
    Yes & No, because there is another factor.

    Nearly all games are made with NTSC in mind and so are nativly 480i

    Yes pal adds more lines but they arent really there to be made up, thats why we get borders top and bottom. Even on optimised pal games all they do is artifically stretch the image and not add more lines of information, which is then worse.

    So actually technically PAL is higher resolution if material was native PAL resolution,
    But in nearly all cases the source material is NTSC 480i, the higher res of pal isnt going to make Jack Poop of a difference.

    Bascially NTSC 60hz is best, as its what the games were developed for and not ported too.

    It's a case of where somthing in theory (here pal) is better than it is in practice (compared to NTSC games)
     

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