Why Apple Haters are taking over MR

Discussion in 'Site and Forum Feedback' started by Consultant, Dec 13, 2011.

  1. macrumors G5

    Consultant

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    #1
    Paul Graham via Gruber:

    Happening a lot with anything that mentions Android / iPhone.

    As a long time Macrumors reader and more recently forum member, I am seeing more trolling happening in the past years. Perhaps MR needs to enforce the rude comment rule (perhaps calling someone fanboy = 1 warning then ban).

    I've also seen examples of some users who are perpetual liars not being banned yet.
     
  2. macrumors 604

    chrono1081

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Location:
    Isla Nublar
    #2
    I have seen a lot of this too. This forum has gone down a lot in the past few years and it mostly is in the iPhone forums.

    I also think the word fanboy should get people banned. The only reason to use that word is to insult other members either directly or indirectly.
     
  3. arn
    macrumors god

    arn

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2001
    #3
    There's definitely been a bit more contentious vibe to the major comment threads these days, and I'm not sure the best way to combat it.

    It's unfortunately a side effect of popularity.

    I know some people object to the voting buttons, and like I said when we started it was a bit of an experiment, to get more data. I think we could go further with it, but there are those that seem opposed to it.

    arn
     
  4. macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #4
    So what are we calling trolling? People who don't agree with everything Apple does, or people who think Apple is god and won't see the other side of the argument?
     
  5. macrumors 6502a

    sand_man

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2011
    Location:
    Johannesburg, South Africa
    #5
    I'm a fanboy and proud of it. Since when is being brand loyal something to be ashamed of?
     
  6. Moderator

    dejo

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2004
    Location:
    The Centennial State
    #6
    What leads you to believe we are not enforcing the current rules, as best we can? There are more than 10000 forum posts per day. The moderators cannot read them all so they rely on members to report problem posts that they encounter. Calling members fanboys or trolls is against the rules but we can't deal with violations unless we know about them. And thanks to all those who do report violations.
     
  7. arn
    macrumors god

    arn

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2001
    #7
    The troll/not-troll line is necessarily biased towards the forum topic. That is due to the intention of the person trolling, who wants to strike up an argument or get on people's nerves.

    A person who posts about how much Motorcycles suck might be seen as a troll in a Motorcycle forum, whereas it would be hard for a someone who loves Motorcycles to be seen as a troll in the same forum.

    arn
     
  8. macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2003
    Location:
    The Amalgamated States of Central North America
    #8
    While I disagree with the premise that haters are taking over MR, I would say that what you notice probably has to do with Apple no longer being the underdog darling of the industry. Apple was once a company for "the rest of us." It is now a company for all of us—it is a consumer electronics company that created or changed a few industries (computing, smartphones, tablets). In those industries, Apple is mainstream and going against mainstream competitors. The days of being a Mac evangelist and getting giddy over Apple making a move like putting an ad in a glossy magazine or being excited that Sears might finally have one Mac on display are kind of over. The company that people formed such an allegiance around and cheered on today would be more equivalent to Palm if it hadn't shut down. I can't think of a company that has the underdog, darling feel that Apple had—maybe Microsoft if it heads south for a few more years.

    I think for that reason Apple isn't viewed by its users in the same protectionist, apologist way it was in the past--a time when evangelists were needed and a small group of loyal users kept the company alive.
     
  9. macrumors newbie

    #9
    Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_4 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8K2 Safari/6533.18.5)

    I've been reading the forums for a few years now and the flame throwing exists but it's way worse on other tech sites.  I actually don't mind being called a "fanboy".  I really am one of those creative types and people hire me to do creative things with media.  The Apple ecosystem has always allowed me to get that done with ease, and now I can do a Ton of tasks from my pocket.  I have some good friends that call me a fanboy but they do it out of respect, because they know I can produce.

    OK, I even keep the MR app, the TUAW app, the AppleInsider app, the Tech Crunch app, a Gizmodo link, 9-5 Mac, Mactracker, the Apple Store app, "", "" in an iOS folder called "Fanboy".

      I am a Fanboy.  
     
  10. macrumors 68000

    maril1111

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2010
    Location:
    Denmark
    #10
    Not a fanboy but i appreciate the apple products, although i think the haters on some other forums have been/are much worse.
     
  11. macrumors 603

    saving107

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2007
    Location:
    San Jose, Ca
    #11
    How does one decide to become a Troll? (is it a conscience decision or accidental?)

    I'm only 26, but growing I have always wondered why so many people get bothered by someone else's choice of anything other than what they like and why they feel the need to argue bullet points and try to "convert" that person to the "better choice".

    "Well my android phone has quad super duper cores with 4.5 inch supercalifragilisticexpialidocious display and lightning bolts speed LTE HSPA++ running ice-cream sundae with a cherry on top OS" (this is how it sounds in my mind :D)

    In the tech community it used to be PC vs Mac, now its iOS vs Android. Another comparison is Sport fans and their choice of team they prefer, it baffles me.

    I very much agree with my signature (thats why I have it) "Let's just say it: If someone else's choice of computing platform makes you angry and agitated, there's something wrong with you."

    If someone is bothered enough of someone else's choices and feels the need to go out of their way to not only post "trollish" post in a forum, but to dedicate so much effort in doing so is troublesome. I get that a majority of those "people" are under the age of 15 and have nothing better to do online, the sad fact is that real life "trolling" does occur as well when someone at a coffee shop notices and says "Oh, you have an iPhone".
     
  12. macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    #12
    The reason can be summed up in one word: Android

    I think the people reading this thread are smart enough, and perceptive enough, to understand the unique combination of technical, commercial, and societal factors that have brought this situation about.

    When (to cite but one example) a major Android maker basically endorses and encourages this sort of obnoxiousness, its not hard to see where the problem comes from.

    What, if anything, can be done about it is another matter entirely.
     
  13. macrumors G3

    roadbloc

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2009
    Location:
    UK
    #13
    I think if you're that phased by the word 'fanboy', you shouldn't be on the internet in the first place. Its hardly offensive.

    People have different opinions. Not everyone on this site has to love Apple. Despite being a user of their products, I am certainly not loving Apple at times. If someone prefers Android over iOS, it doesn't mean they are automatically a troll.
     
  14. macrumors newbie

    #14
    "I could never get a Samsung, I'm creative." Now I feel really lame for calling myself a creative in my earlier post... LOL. It is an ad that hits a little too close to home for some of us, and that really does make it pretty funny. It's just not effective. Insulting your target audience should be left to the political spots.
     
  15. macrumors G5

    yg17

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2004
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    #15
    Give me a break. For every Android user on this forum (btw, Android user != Apple hater) who calls an Apple person a fanboy, there's an Apple person who calls an Android user a fanboy.
     
  16. macrumors 6502a

    MrNomNoms

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    #16
    One could also argue that robust debates make for an interesting community - God knows I don't want to be in a forum where everyone is patting each other on the back telling how much they agree each other on a particular topic. There needs to be robust discussions that are based on facts and/or a well reasoned argument rather than just simply 6 word sentences that address nothing in the original post being made.

    The bigger issue though are the 'one post wonders' or those who make the same stupid post over and over and over and over again and no matter how many times that person's post has been corrected that same person will post the same statement again in reply to a new news article on the same given topic. I've just recently had had an exchange with OllyW in regards to RichardBeer persistent posting about OpenGL 3.2 not being in Mac OS X Lion and no matter how many times multiple people have politely corrected him he still keeps posting the same stupid post to every new Mac OS X article that appears - behaviour like *THAT* should result in an automatic ban.

    The whole purpose of a forum is a two way dialogue - you make a statement, I critique that statement and then you reply back critiquing my critique whilst maybe bringing in more information to further your case. That is how a dialogue should occur and not this 'one post wonders' and idiots who come in, post the same stupid disproven garbage never to be heard form again.
     
  17. macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    #17
    This is true. As the Rules for Appropriate Debate state:
    Every time I've reported such a post, it's dealt with. My hat is off to the moderation team for patiently handling all my post reports! They are very consistent in enforcing the rules, but you have to let them know by reporting offending posts.
    That could get you hog-tied, stomped and dragged in the Harley forum! :D
     
  18. thread starter macrumors G5

    Consultant

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    #18
    I have submitted indisputable evidence of some compulsive liars, the last user I noted is still around.
     
  19. macrumors G3

    roadbloc

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2009
    Location:
    UK
    #19
    God help us. Somebody lied on an internet forum. Are you sure they're lying? Or maybe they are just misinformed. Say I was told that iOS was based on Android, and then made a post about it at some point. Does that make me a compulsive liar? No, it makes me misinformed.

    Accusing people of lying is a rather large claim. I hope your evidence is indisputable, and not something that could be seen as someone's lack of knowledge. Having a lack of knowledge is something you certainly cannot talk about as I've corrected plenty of your misinformed posts over the time I've posted on this forum.
     
  20. macrumors 604

    chrono1081

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Location:
    Isla Nublar
    #20
    I think what he is talking about is the people lying in order to "stir the pot" so to speak which is trolling. This forum has a lot of trolls and I'm personally glad to see I'm not the only one reporting it.

    This forum was much different 4 years ago when I first started coming here and I'd love to see it go back to what it was.
     
  21. macrumors G5

    yg17

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2004
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    #21
    [​IMG]

    And there are plenty of Apple fans who compulsively lie about Android on this forum. They're no better. But I doubt anyone's reporting them.
     
  22. macrumors P6

    Weaselboy

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    #22
    I think the voting buttons would be very ineffective at policing the forums in any way and will lead to a "Reddit like" hive mind here. How would the system discriminate between a well thought out but unpopular opinion that gets downvoted and a post with downvotes due to name calling for example.

    I think the current post report system works well for the worst offenders. I can only think of a couple posts I ever reported that a mod did not act on, the rest were quickly deleted. I suspect many users don't use the "report" button?

    ----------

    Something something something your mom. :p
     
  23. macrumors 68040

    decksnap

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2003
    #23
    I've pretty much stopped posting here in the last year or two. Really it's because there used to be a lot of reasoned discussion and debate in any given topic, with a large group of seasoned Apple users setting a civil tone and giving meaningful takes on the news of the day.

    These days it's like reading youtube comments. Frankly anybody using the term 'fanboy' doesn't seem to have the mental capacity to articulate their own thoughts, or entertain the thoughts of others.

    Ban 'em all. :D
     
  24. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    #24
    The term fanboy, while rude, is not even an insult in my book. It just means that the other person believe you have a bias toward Apple, and can't take your argument seriously. The term troll, when used too excessively and incorrectly like I've seen is an ACTUAL insult. It basically says that a person doesn't belong here, and their opinion doesn't matter. I've been called a phandroid, and it didn't phase to me at all. On the other hand, being called a troll for criticizing Apple and their all too loyal fans, now that stung.
     
  25. arn
    macrumors god

    arn

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2001
    #25
    Are you of the opinion that such a system not better than what we have now?

    arn
     

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