Your take on Piracy......

Discussion in 'Community' started by idkew, Jul 26, 2002.

  1. idkew macrumors 68020

    idkew

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    where the concrete to dirt ratio is better
    #1
    The Jaguar thread got me going on this one.

    Do you think it is ok in some instances to pirate software?

    I, for one, do. I am a design student and I use quite a few EXPENSIVE programs to learn my trade. It is not possible to do all my work on university cpu's. I pirate software and LEARN it. I do not see this as a problem. I am making no money from it.

    I like to use a cigarette analogy: Philip Morris gives you all the free cigarettes you want for four years. They get you good and hooked. When you graduate college, you no longer get free ciagrettes, so you have to start paying. Sure, the price might be a bit more to make up for the lost income on the free cigarettes, but as long as Philip Morris makes a good product, you will buy it since you are hooked on it. They will more than make up for the short term loss of income in the long run.

    Well, Adobe is hooking me on Photoshop, Illustartor, InDesign.... I can no where near afford these programs, but I will eventually pay for them for years when I am using them to earn a living. I see no problem in this.

    So, what do you all think?:rolleyes:
     
  2. strider42 macrumors 65816

    strider42

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2002
    #2
    Re: Your take on Piracy......

    I personally take the opinion that I don't mind pirating if its something thats not used very often. If I need a program to do one thing, one time, I don't have a problem getting ahold of the copy to do it. If it something I used all the time, like a game or a very useful program, I feel it would be better to buy the program.

    As for the college situation, I can definitley understand that. if you really don't have the money but you need to learn, then you do what you have to do. The minute you start making money with the program, people should definiltey buy it.

    Situation doesn't make it legal, its still stealing. The real problem with piracy is with those who steal programs they would have bought it otherwise. Thats where the developers lose money.
     
  3. ShaolinMiddleFinger macrumors 6502a

    ShaolinMiddleFinger

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    #3
    be warned...you are treading in flame territory
     
  4. MacAztec macrumors 68040

    MacAztec

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    San Luis Obispo, CA
    #4
    WTF? Nice touble post...heres my middle finger.

    I have the same thought of piracy as you strider
     
  5. mac15 macrumors 68040

    mac15

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    #5
    Hmmmm arn ain't gonna like this,

    we all have just keep shhhh about it
     
  6. mymemory macrumors 68020

    mymemory

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    #6
    Well, trading soft is a big issue. I do not care about buying something that I use, but there are serious problems related to piracy that are very hard to resolve.

    Software developers companies are letting people coping their software from one point of view. Just imagine, what if there is a imbulnerable copy protection of Photoshop? Almost no one would be able to get it, and what about foreing countries? The problems wold be worst than the solution, just because the US would be segregating the technical development of countries with incomes inferiors than the US.

    I mean, that would make the US goverment looks bad politically, even we know would be the right thing, imagine every single graphic designer from Colombia, Ecuador, Peru, Brazil, etc. complaining about the price (the won't call it piracy). I guess most of the developers are aware of those things.

    The other thing would be to sell the same software based on the country income, that way would be cheaper to get Photoshop in Venezuela than in the US.

    It is a big problem the piracy stuff.
     
  7. Mr. Anderson Moderator emeritus

    Mr. Anderson

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    Nov 1, 2001
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    VA
    #7
    piracy is stealing, period.

    to say that most users don't do it would be a lie.

    I've got several software packages (3) that require hardware dongles - USB plugs - in order to work. The price of software reflects somewhat the security used to keep it from being pirated. Dongles are the best way to insure against piracy - so, how come we don't see more apps going in that direction?

    Sure some, like Office for OSX and the Adobe Apps, won't let you run an app with the same serial number on two computers on the same network, but that's not an insurmountable problem. I think software companies take that into consideration as well, they'd do something about piracy if it really was taking its toll on their profits.

    Has anyone ever seen anti-piracy inforcement first hand? If you were dealing with one or two apps among friends that's one thing - resale for profit is another.

    I'm not condoning it, I'm just trying to discuss the issues.

    D
     
  8. Rower_CPU Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2001
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    #8
    Re: Your take on Piracy......

    Ever hear about educational discounts?

    The Adobe Design collections cost about $350 and include Photoshop and Illustrator, plus whatever apps are specific to the collection (web = GoLive and LiveMotion, etc.)

    If you get Financial Aid the software purchase is more than justified since you're using it for your studies.
     
  9. mymemory macrumors 68020

    mymemory

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    #9
    That would be a good price for soft, but that is only in the US.

    Just imagine, doing what you do with a 4th of your income? I'm not justifiying anything, my point is that there is a reason why developers do not protect the softwares at their 100%.

    My point of view (now that I'm in to international politics) is that 90% of the softwares are produced in the US. So, if every software company uses a 100% anti-piracy method, the US goverment is gonna looks very bad on the eyes of the rest of the world, as is going on with the globalization stuff.

    I think is gonna be a very slow process, getting people used to pay for what they use. And I'm sure developers are aware of everything.

    For example, there is no way to copy Final Cut Pro 3, why the rest of the developers are not using the same security system? There should be an advantage in piracy. Who knows.
     
  10. rainman::|:| macrumors 603

    rainman::|:|

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    Feb 2, 2002
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    iowa
    #10
    two words: dongle emulation :D

    I have to agree with what most ppl here have said... Piracy is overlookable in some cases, i think it's wrong to pirate software if you're making money using it, otherwise it's not hellfire & damnation or anything... it's not technically right or anything, nor am i trying to say it is, but come ON, we've all done it one time or another. hell, i was doing it before i knew what it was!! i agree with what mymemory said in another thread, software prices are WAY too high... $700 for photoshop might be fine for a graphics worker making $200,000 a year, but i'm not paying it just to be able to put my face on markie mark's body... hehe

    :)
    pnw
     
  11. idkew thread starter macrumors 68020

    idkew

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    #11
    Re: Re: Your take on Piracy......

    I can give you my info so you can PayPal me $350. Plus, I need Quark, and I will need the X version when it comes out. I also need Dreamweaver, Freehand... about every creatve app so I can learn them and be marketable. How does $1000 sound?
     
  12. Beej macrumors 68020

    Beej

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    #12
    I'd have to disagree on that one. Most coputer users hardly know how to turn their computer on, let alone find and register pirated software.

    The poeple on this site are a very different demographic to your average computer user. We care. Most people don't. We like technology. Many are annoyed by it. We know how to use our computers, where to get pirated software from, and how to register it. Most people don't.

    I think you get my point...
     
  13. menoinjun macrumors 6502a

    menoinjun

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2001
    #13
    Well, I agree with what was said before, but I come from a slightly different context.

    When I bought my mac, I went out and got the Adobe Design Collection for $400...well worth the money let me tell you.

    But now I can't afford the upgrades, and I want OS X compatability. So I pirate the upgrades, and I will buy the full versions when I am finacially capable. I don't completely see it as "ok", but at least I have given SOME money to the company.

    Also, the fact that I don't make money on the software is key. But that may all change soon.

    -Pete
     
  14. menoinjun macrumors 6502a

    menoinjun

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2001
    #14
    Oh yeah...I forgot...

    A coworker from CompUSA was selling illegal copies of Adobe products on Ebay for a while, and it took the feds over a year to catch him. He was procecuted by the feds, and almost sued by Adobe considering the amount of money he made and how much he "took" from Adobe.

    Luckily he made it out with a coupe hundred hours of commmunity service, probation, and no million dollar adobe lawsuit.

    Close call, but DONT PIRATE IF YOU CAN AVOID IT!!

    -Pete
     
  15. Rower_CPU Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

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    San Diego, CA
    #15
    Re: Re: Re: Your take on Piracy......

    *sigh* Students are always looking for a handout.;)

    The Macromedia Studio MX suite (Dreamweaver, Flash, Freehand and Fireworks) is $200 educational price.

    Like I said, Financial Aid...it's not just a concept. And then with all the money you make at your job later you can more than afford to pay back your loans. Think of it as an investment.
     
  16. idkew thread starter macrumors 68020

    idkew

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    #16
    Re: Re: Re: Re: Your take on Piracy......

    an extremely short term investment that gives a small rate of return, which is virtually obsolete within a few years. i am not going to get a job b/c of photoshop, but it may help if i know it, and a similar applicant does not.

    believe it or not, i can not get financial aid. the gov seems to think my parents can handle all the funding i need. while they may be able to, that does not mean they want to spend a grand on softwares, nor that they should.

    and no, i can't make a bunch of cash. i have been a full time student, for the past two years, through the summer and the school year. i work part time, but at minimum wage (pagination & ad design), it no where near covers my beer, not to mention any software.

    i do not think you get my point. no where am i saying it is legal or good to pirate, i just, at this point in time, i see it as just. whether the laws agrees does not matter. i don't sell it for profit, i don't profit from it at all.
     
  17. Rower_CPU Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

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    #17
    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Your take on Piracy......

    You're in denial and your priorities are in the wrong place if you're putting beer ahead of other things. ;)

    The feds wanted my parents to take out loans, just like your parents. My parents can't because they're still paying back their own loans.

    Guess what I did? I took out loans on my own. Shocking, isn't it? You have this option...it's a choice you make.

    I have graduated from school and have about $35,000 to pay back. I'm OK with that because I know that my education will provide me with a much better paying job in the future. It's not a negligible investment. It's concrete and statistically proven...it's just difficult to face when you look at the bill.
     
  18. arn macrumors god

    arn

    Staff Member

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    Apr 9, 2001
    #18
    Admin Note:

    You guys can talk about piracy in general terms... debate the ethics of it etc... but don't talk about personal specifics, and you're fine.

    arn
     
  19. Beej macrumors 68020

    Beej

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    #19
    Re: Re: Re: Re: Your take on Piracy......

    That's the definition of a student, isn't it?
     
  20. ShaolinMiddleFinger macrumors 6502a

    ShaolinMiddleFinger

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2001
    #20
    It's not a t(r)ouble post from me. I've seen alot of people talk about pirating software and they were flamed. It's not coming from me... I'm just telling him to watch out from the others. Sheez....
     
  21. big macrumors 65816

    big

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2002
    #21
    >Close call, but DONT PIRATE IF YOU CAN AVOID IT!!

    don't sell it..sheeeesh, that guy deserved what he got...How lame.
     
  22. Aquanaut macrumors member

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    May 10, 2002
    Location:
    UK
    #22
    I have borrowed and shared software with friends and colleagues in the past but there is nothing that I didn't end up buying - an extension of a try-out maybe. I don't approve of pirating - in fact I have made a large part of my living from music and have been ripped off by some pretty large corporations over the years so I can't condone it in anyway.

    I have just spent 10 days working in China and some of the street markets and shopping malls (indoor street markets!) there are incredible, especially if you want to buy cheap crap. This wasn't tourist China, more a frontier town kind of China. What shocked me is that I saw thousands of CDs, DVDs, Gameboy cards, computer software, etc. everywhere and not one item was clean. Piracy is massive in the far east and I don't see how they are going to get on top of this (they need to start with introducing some highway laws before they look at anything else). Giving copies to friends for free is small fry compared to where the real, very large scale, problem lies.
     
  23. amnesiac1984 macrumors 6502a

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    Europe
    #23
    okay photoshop is a lot of money, for personal use it is not worth it, if you could not pirate photoshop many ppl simply would not use it, they wouldn't buy it if you couldn't pirate it so Adobe is not loosing money from EVERYONE who pirates their software.

    It is even more relevant to music apps, they are also really expensive and so is all the music equipment you need. If you are setting up a studio and spending mega bucks on equipment then £500 for cubase or logic won't be too much to ask but for a student playing around at home both learning the packages and making some decent music then piracy is often the only option. If that student's music was then heard by some record company A & R man then the student got a record deal he would probably be given a budget of some kind or just paid enough to be able to really splash out on equipment and software.

    If it was impossible to pirate software then only the little spoilt rich kids would get even the chance to develop their potential talents leaving the poor kid to maybe never even discover his or her potential, and end up cleaning toilets or somehting. (No offense to any janitors out there) ;)
     
  24. amnesiac1984 macrumors 6502a

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    Europe
    #24
    in Russia, they had a stall selling obviously pirated CD's and DVD's for $2 IN OUR HOTEL. and this was a huge hotel in central St Petersburg!!!!

    Then in Moscow, just outside red square there is a massive underground shopping mall. They had a shop at the back selling CD's for $6 (I think they may have ben real tho, with Russia's economy in the states its in ppl could not afford to pay more for CD's so the record company's have to sell them cheap)
     
  25. Rower_CPU Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

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    San Diego, CA
    #25
    There's another option that people seem to forget:
    Taking computer classes.

    You can learn a program without having to purchase/steal it, oftentimes for free. Community colleges and centers provide many computer classes for people who are interested.

    It's always a choice to pirate. There are options.
     

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