“TO PRODUCE AN UNAWARE AND COMPLIANT CITIZENRY”

Herdfan

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Apr 11, 2011
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Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:

And as I’ve mentioned, we’ve all been quite content to demean government, drop civics and in general conspire to produce an unaware and compliant citizenry,” he writes.

“The unawareness remains strong but compliance is obviously fading rapidly. This problem demands some serious, serious thinking – and not just poll driven, demographically-inspired messaging.”

To emphasize, Ivy admits that the left has ‘conspired’ to “produce an unaware and compliant citizenry” but that they’re not as easy to manipulate anymore and that this is a problem. He characterizes “unawareness” amongst the public as a positive thing for the Clinton campaign.
This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
 

thermodynamic

Suspended
May 3, 2009
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USA
Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:



This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
Only "the left", which he doesn't really describe apart from what he wants it to be, right?
 

Snoopy4

macrumors 6502a
Dec 29, 2014
661
2,921
Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:



This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
They are already complaint. They'll shrug this off and say nothing to see here.
 

citizenzen

macrumors 65816
Mar 22, 2010
1,433
11,628
Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged. ...
About being called compliant? You need more than that.

What do you think is actually being done to make us compliant? If (as in my case) it's having a nice job, a lovely home, and plenty of leisure time, then I plead guilty for enjoying my captivity.

But please tell us what you think he means in that email.
 

Cartaphilus

macrumors 6502a
Dec 24, 2007
569
36
Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:



This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
[doublepost=1476159664][/doublepost]I don't think these words mean what you think they mean.
 

Limey77

macrumors regular
Apr 22, 2010
103
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Even more important, I'd very much like to see a link to the original email as this sounds very much like something taken out of context.
 

jerwin

macrumors 68020
Jun 13, 2015
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It's part of the genre. If you're going to critique cultural "decline", it's standard practice to graciously accept part of the blame, rather than foisting it upon your enemies. (We're not fascists).

So it's not an admission of some devious master plan-- it's part of the whole O Tempera, O Mores, style of fretting.

One could muse that people on the left are apt to dismiss civic education as mere indoctrination. But if a liberal state aims to move political power out of the hands of elite groups (plutocrats, aristocrats, bishops, etc) and into the hands of ordinary people, shouldn't it provide those ordinary people with the skills to better manipulate the levers of power for their own ordinary purposes?
 

Eraserhead

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Nov 3, 2005
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UK
Anyone involved in politics - whether on the right or left or in between - isn't compliant.
 

VulchR

macrumors 68020
Jun 8, 2009
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Scotland
The quote in the OP screams 'disinformation, with love, from Russia'. Again, there has been no confirmation about whether these e-mails are genuine.

Even if the quote is true, it clearly says that we all have been conspiring, not just the left. Namely, it recognises that our system has not educated people well enough to make informed decisions about public policy. The e-mail seems to imply a principled approach to changing the status quo in this regard rather than, say, using populism to exploit people. The e-mail is simply recognising the elephant in the room for which both main political parties are responsible.

I would have thought Trump supporters would have loved that somebody in the Clinton campaign recognises the need for fundamental change. To me that is the tragedy of this election - that a large segment of our population believes that supporting the party of conservatism, which is dedicated to minimising change or indeed even going backwards, is going to result in a political revolution. It won't.
 
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Thomas Veil

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Feb 14, 2004
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Link for these quotes, so we can see them in context? It's no secret that the people are fed up with politics as usual, and that thanks to the right wing media a huge number of people remain uninformed/disinformed. Is this what Ivy is talking about? Probably, rather than the sinister conspiracy the right would like to spin this as.
 
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rdowns

macrumors Penryn
Jul 11, 2003
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Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:



This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
Blah, blah, blah. Let's see it in context. Context is something your side doesn't seem to give a **** about. ANd seriously, how the **** are you so outraged over something you know no context about?
 
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DrewDaHilp1

macrumors 6502a
Mar 29, 2009
578
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All Your Memes Are Belong to US
Link for these quotes, so we can see them in context? It's no secret that the people are fed up with politics as usual, and that thanks to the right wing media a huge number of people remain uninformed/disinformed. Is this what Ivy is talking about? Probably, rather than the sinister conspiracy the right would like to spin this as.


Cause the democrat controlled media informs.
 
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bent christian

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Nov 5, 2015
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Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.
Is this the same Wikileaks that has been caught fabricating supposed Clinton-related emails as late as just a few days ago?
 

DrewDaHilp1

macrumors 6502a
Mar 29, 2009
578
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All Your Memes Are Belong to US
[doublepost=1476193129][/doublepost]
....Are you aware of who actually owns the 6 companies that own 90% of the mass media outlets? Last I checked Rupert Murdoch was no democrat.
He owns NBC, MSNBC, CNN, ABC, CBS, HUFF PO?
[doublepost=1476193188][/doublepost]
Is this the same Wikileaks that has been caught fabricating supposed Clinton-related emails as late as just a few days ago?
"Caught" by whom?
 

NT1440

macrumors G5
May 18, 2008
12,141
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[doublepost=1476193129][/doublepost]

He owns NBC, MSNBC, CNN, ABC, CBS, HUFF PO?
http://www.businessinsider.com/these-6-corporations-control-90-of-the-media-in-america-2012-6

I'll leave it to you to dig up the political affiliations of the top executives of these 6 companies. You'll be upset to find that they're almost exclusively conservative, corporate, or libertarian minded.

The mass media is in it for corporatism, which allies itself neatly with the political aims of the right. There is no left mass media in this country. You won't find MSNBC reporting on things like net neutrality because Comcast owns them.
 

Thomas Veil

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Cause the democrat controlled media informs.
Whatever you mean, the mainstream news outlets -- ABC, The Washington Post, NBC, PBS, the AP, Reuters, CBS, The Guardian -- are a damn sight more informative and reliable than Rush Limbaugh, Breitbart, Fox and the like, yes.

And we still have no context.
 
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NT1440

macrumors G5
May 18, 2008
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Whatever you mean, the mainstream news outlets -- ABC, The Washington Post, NBC, PBS, the AP, Reuters, CBS, The Guardian -- are a damn sight more informative and reliable than Rush Limbaugh, Breitbart, Fox and the like, yes.

And we still have no context.
Comparatively speaking, sure.

That said, good luck getting most of them (guardian being the exception here) to report on the TPP, the current ongoing largest prison strike in US history, Net Neutrality, Mega Mergers in almost every industry, ongoing US wars in Yemen and Somalia, our building of a drone base in Africa, the fact that the US is militarizing against Native Americans for a clear cut violation of a treaty (which under our constitution is actually equal law to the Constitution) so a ****ing pipeline can be built for the benefit of a foreign corporation, etc.

There is a corporate lens that all of this goes through, which is most cases causes a complete lack of reporting on the subjects. But you know, something happens to a Kardashian and it's on all the networks for the day...
 

Thomas Veil

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Feb 14, 2004
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EDIT: Never mind. I'm getting this confused with the OTHER Wikileaks Hillary-taken-out-of-context thread...and this slow as hell POS waiting room public network I'm on isn't sure helping me load this site. :mad:
 
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Peace

macrumors Core
Apr 1, 2005
19,467
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Space--The ONLY Frontier
Ok, this was part of the Wikileaks dump either today or Friday, but if it turns out to be true, every single American should be outraged.

It is part of an email to Podesta from former Clinton admin official Bill Ivy that reads:



This to me is far worse than anything Trump has ever said or anything Bill Clinton ever did to interns. This is Jonathan Gruber on steroids.

If you are not outraged, then I will be outraged for you.
Outraged about a guy that in his own words and from that email said :

"I will attend the Clinton fundraiser here next week but as I can only afford the low level of participation may just get to wave without a "hello."


Ya man that Hillary is something else.

What the hell does this have to do with Clinton ?

It's an email from a guy that used to work for her but can't even get close to her.

Furthermore the thread title implies it was a scandalous email from Hillary Clinton.

It is not.
 

jerwin

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Jun 13, 2015
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I think this reflects a deeper distrust of liberal culture. Liberals like to think of themselves as being interested in new ideals, in novel ways of thinking about the world. So, given free time and resources, liberals will attend social events centered around books. Cocktail parties, book signings, lectures. It's sort of like revisiting the time you spent at university, except without the exams, and with better food.

This sort of willingness to engage with the intellectual world is distorted by the conservative imagination into a conspiratorial network of revolutionary cells intent on throwing the world into chaos.

And so, John Podesta receives emails about editing the germline. And you guys go ******* because you're compelled to read it as proof of some new world order conspiracy.
 
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