2011 Black Friday Deals PRSI spin-off

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by r0k, Oct 27, 2011.

  1. r0k, Oct 27, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2011

    r0k macrumors 68040

    r0k

    Joined:
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    Detroit
    #1
    MOD NOTE:

    This thread spun out of http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=13694093 when that thread took a turn to PRSI topics. Please keep that thread on topic, but feel free to discuss this here.

    --------------------------------

    I disagree, Christmas themed advertising should not be allowed before Valentine's day.


    (Just Kidding) :D

    I saw them moving all the planters at Home Depot to make room for the Christmas trees. Christmas merchandise displays are already up at a lot of retailers with decorations to follow the day after Halloween. I enjoy Christmas shopping season because the store hours are finally long enough for even busy people like me to be able to take our time and not worry about closing time. Still, it bothers me that so many people (especially businesses) forget what Christmas means in the first place. Here's a little something to serve as a reminder...

    [​IMG]
     
  2. palpatine macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    #2
    I don't think this forum is an appropriate one for religious propaganda. More to the point, the holiday is a fiction that the Catholic church manufactured to replace a decidedly different kind of holiday (Saturnalia), and it was actually outlawed in America for this reason by Puritans. True story. These are facts. Ask a priest and he'll even be able to tell you the Pope who created it. You won't find it in the Bible! It only became a federal holiday in the late nineteenth century. So, I wouldn't call it especially Christian or American.

    But, like lots of traditions, we have it and there is no use me crying over spilt milk. Fortunately, we live in a society that tries to separate religious aspects of life from secular ones, and so we are free (somehow) to have a federal holiday for one religion (Christianity) that everyone can participate in as an opportunity to come together as a community (no matter your faith) and share gifts, family, and friends. I think that is pretty cool. And, you are welcome to interpret the holiday as you would like. But, please don't try to push your religious agenda and turn this into a divisive time.

    As for Black Friday, let's hope it is a good one for businesses this year, because we all need a bit of a boost (employers, employees, and gift recipients).
     
  3. swingerofbirch macrumors 68030

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    The Amalgamated States of Central North America
    #3
    And if it really is celebrating the birth of Christ, why isn't Christmas on January 1? If modern recorded time began with his birth, why would they start the calendar on Dec 25 and not the first day of the year?

    Anyhow Christmas for me is part of my culture, not my religion. I am happy for it to be many things to many people as long as I am not told I shouldn't celebrate because I am not religiously Christian, in the same way I don't tell religious Christians not to celebrate Christmas because the origins of Christmas predate Christianity. Moreover, I think the fact that it's a federal holiday gives everyone even more right to see it as secular holiday.
     
  4. palpatine macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    #4
    Agreed :)

    Another cool thing is that we have online opportunities. A lot of us will not see our families this Christmas because we live scattered around the world, but with the Internet we can easily give gifts. I have lots of Kindle books in mind, for example (thanks Amazon!).

    I sometimes see gift-giving purists (not necessarily associated with the Christmas reason-for-the-season crowd) whining about ebook gifts, ecards, and other nonsense. Grrr.... It irks me to no end when people try to shove their own manufactured righteousness down my throat, and to these people I want to ask: what about the troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, and elsewhere? what about the father who lost his job and had to move across the country to find work? what about the son who had to go overseas to find employment? what about friends who moved to another country? Celebrate however you want, but leave me alone.

    So, to all of you planning to spend some cash on Black Friday, I wish you all the best! Get those gifts out there! I've already packed a few boxes of goodies for my pals.
     
  5. r0k thread starter macrumors 68040

    r0k

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    Detroit
    #5
    The black friday deals sometimes get on my nerves every year because I perceive it to be a way to attempt to "take over" what in recent several hundred years is a religious holiday or at least time to focus on family and turn it into a time to focus on material possessions. The real meaning of black friday is that for many stores, they operate in the red until the day after thanksgiving and when they finally begin to earn a profit for the year it becomes black friday. But I must agree that we need a good black friday this year, especially with fears of the economy slipping back (further?) into recession. :eek:

    Apple has for years been able to rise above the fray and announce their products on a cycle that was largely decoupled from the "holiday season". This year, they announced not only the new iPhone 4S but new Macbook Pros heading into the holidays. It doesn't bode well for Apple to be on the "retail treadmill". They do their best work when they release their products on their own schedule so I hope the 3Q Apple product announcements this year are the exception. See the Macrumors Buyers' Guide pages for an appreciation of how "decoupled" Apple's product schedule has been from the rest of retail in years past.

    I agree that as a federal holiday, Dec 25 is a secular holiday. However it is blatantly revisionist to claim that the federal holiday was somehow derived from Saturnalia or winter solstice when Dec 25 became a federal holiday in 1870, just after the civil war. More here. BTW, when the time comes, please remember to testify "against" me for spreading Christianity. ;)
     
  6. palpatine macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    #6
    Personally, I think Black Friday is a blatant appeal by business to convince people to part with their money. They are taking advantage of our warm, fuzzy feelings for family and friends. We agree!

    But, I think it is a good thing, given the conditions.

    Fortunately, businesses are run by people, employ people, provide taxes to support people (with the exception of loathsome profitable parasites who somehow get away with receiving refunds!), etc. For better or for worse, we live in a capitalist economy that requires consumers and businesses to run at ever faster speeds on the economic treadmill. The more we buy into the system of exploitation the longer we can keep the beast alive. Such is life in our generation.

    Anyhow, I can't think of any major religion founders who would be pleased with the state of our society, not only because they lived within an ancient worldview, but the socio-economic outcomes would seem apalling to them. *sigh*

    I can't change the world, but I can at least help keep it propped up.

    Off Topic clarification
    ------------------------------
    I didn't claim that the federal holiday was derived from Saturnalia, though that would be an awesome thing.

    To clarify, I said the Catholic church co-opted the Saturnalia holiday by deciding that would be Jesus's birthday. As I said, there is nothing about celebrating his b-day in the Bible. These are facts. The page you cited supports my argument. Thanks :)

    Second, I said it became a federal holiday in the late nineteenth century in support of my point that it isn't some ancient American tradition, but rather a relatively recent manufactured holiday. The page you cited supports my argument. Thanks :)

    The holiday is neither "Christian" nor "American" in my opinion, but it is a "tradition," and I'm not a foot soldier in the so-called war against it.

    In the spirit of nitpicking, I have to say that it isn't spreading Christianity to promote a holiday that (in my opinion) has nothing to do with the Bible, any teaching of Jesus, or even anything promoted by his disciples. Don't give into medieval papal politics! Reclaim your religion :)
     
  7. Wrathh1965 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    May 15, 2011
    #7
    The "modern" calendar is the Gregorian Calendar (16th century). Prior to that, it was the Julian Calendar. The calendar has nothing to do with the birth of Christ.

    Just sayin'.
     
  8. scarred macrumors 6502a

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    Jul 24, 2011
    #8
    On black friday?
     
  9. r0k thread starter macrumors 68040

    r0k

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    #9
    Sure it might be on black friday... Or not...
    When the time comes, you'll know... ;)
     
  10. palpatine macrumors 68040

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    May 3, 2011
    #10
    LOL. Good answer. I hope everyone up there/out there reads these forums, has access to the servers, and connects your real name with your handle. Otherwise, this imaginary r0k guy is going to get all the credit :)
     
  11. r0k thread starter macrumors 68040

    r0k

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    #11
    Even if I post on the forums over at vatican.va using the same handle? :eek:
     
  12. scarred macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    #12
    That one guy thought he knew...

    Lets just say there is a greater likelihood of an apple black Friday sale then someone landing from the sky with four horseys.
     
  13. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #13
    Why does Joseph look like a stoner in that pic? And Mary in that position right after giving birth? More evidence that "faith" is estranged from reality.
     
  14. r0k thread starter macrumors 68040

    r0k

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    #14
    That's one of the first few pages of pics when you google for christmas. Let's not forget that in Christ's era, child birth wasn't something that meant lying around for 4 months of "family medical leave." So seeing Mary depicted by the artist in awkward posture for having just given birth by today's standards isn't so estranged from reality. Perhaps more ridiculous are the "swiss chalet" looking mangers with snow on the ground... in the middle east.
     
  15. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #15
    No, I think the most ridiculous thing is that a woman was impregnated by an invisible man in the sky while retaining her virginity ;)
     
  16. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    totally cool
    #16
    Its funny though, all the trolls come out after Halloween. Amazing! :)
     
  17. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2009
    #17
    To be fair, Mary easily could have used a turkey baster without "compromising her virginity", she would just have to get her hands on some fresh seed and have it somehow properly blessed by a holy man. Some sects go so far as to say that her virginity grew back after Jesus was born, and she remained a virgin to her dying day. Pure, I mean, not even so much as giving Joe a hand job.

    The really weird part is that, somehow, Mary was without "original sin". I am not sure how that would work. Original sin was acquired as a result of eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and became something like a genetic legacy of adam and eve. The only way I could imagine Mary having escaped original sin is if she was a drooling, slack-jawed ninny. Which might explain the turkey baster.
     

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