269 Tie ... What If?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by gibbz, Sep 23, 2008.

  1. gibbz macrumors 68030

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    #1
    I know this is highly unlikely, but it is certainly plausible that there could be a 269-269 electoral college tie in the general election.

    The scenario is outlined here.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #2
    If it goes to a tie and to the senate/whoever decides, i am 100% sure it will be Mccain/palin. They have a tendancy to want to screw over america when it comes down to the wire. (Bush)
     
  3. JG271 macrumors 6502a

    JG271

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    #3
    I had thought of this... it would definitely be interesting, and might finally make the case for reforming the voting system, although that would mean a constitutional amendment.

    Would Libermann definitely vote republican?
     
  4. atszyman macrumors 68020

    atszyman

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    #4
    If it's a tie Obama wins. A tied Electoral college goes to the House where the Dems have a much better majority, and I assume it would end with a complete party line vote.

    Here's a link to the Twelfth Amendment if you want to double check.
     
  5. swiftaw macrumors 603

    swiftaw

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    #5
    Wouldn't it have made sense to design the system with an odd number of electoral college votes so that this couldn't happen?
     
  6. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #6
    Seeing as the Dems dont want him anymore (and didnt he give a speech at the GOP convention?:confused:) id say yea, hes gonna vote for the man he stands behind at his speeches (i saw him there yesterday i think).

    You'd be suprised how many people here in CT hate libermann now. They see that hes only interested in being in office (as demonstrated by his, i didnt get the democrat approval so ill run independant).

    Reminds me alot of Mccain, anything to get in office.
     
  7. Much Ado macrumors 68000

    Much Ado

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    #7
    Sense in the electoral system? Are you joking? ;)
     
  8. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #8
    Does it? (im not up to snuff on my voting processes). Thats good news at least.

    Hopefully Obama takes Pennsylvania so it wont come down to this.
     
  9. atszyman macrumors 68020

    atszyman

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    Even if he did, we might be able to get Chuck Hagel and maybe another Republican or two to cross party lines in order to maintain some faith that the system works.

    We'd need to add a representative to the House to make that happen, and then all it takes is some third party guy to take one EC vote away to get us back in the same predicament.

    OK with a little more reading/research the original article talked of an EC tie which goes to the House to decide President and the Senate for Vice President. So Obama would get the top spot, but there's a possibility of Palin getting the VP spot. This would not necessarily be a bad thing since even though she'd be a "heartbeat away" from the presidency, we'd have a President who was much more likely to serve out his term without incident.
     
  10. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #10
    Oh god, could you imagine an Obama/Palin ticket?
     
  11. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #11
    They had, but it was suited for back at that time where there wasn't an even number of votes in the Electoral College. But when new states joined the union, for the 1800 election, there was an even number.

    The saving grace is that the 12th Amendment states that the House of Representatives, not the Senate, will choose in case of a tie in the Electoral College. So Lieberman is not a factor at all (thank <insert diety here>), and the House is odd (in numbers as well).

    BL.
     
  12. atszyman macrumors 68020

    atszyman

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    #12
    But they do state that the Senate gets to choose the VP, which would put Lieberman into play. It could get worse if the House manages to deadlock the Senate's VP choice would become acting president. Luckily the House has a solid majority, and there are people like Hagel who have questioned Palin's experience already who could prevent the nightmare.
     
  13. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #13
    Umm, no it doesn't.


    The 12th Amendment didn't do away with the Senate's role in choosing the VP in the event of a tie. If Obama wins 269 electoral votes, then by logical default, Biden also wins 269 votes, which results in both of them being chosen by the appropriate houses of Congress.

    In any event, I doubt Palin would be chosen by the Senate. One or two Republicans would decide that it would be in the best interest of the country for the executive to be united, just like 10 Republicans decided not to vote for Clinton's conviction; not everything is always overly partisan (or at least we hope).
     
  14. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

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    #14
    it's a bit complicated.
    if the election says it is a tie, it goes to the great electors who will vote in january. If all of them abide by what the election result was, then it is a tie and it goes to congress, however they do not necessarily have to and even a single 'faithless elector' could decide the presidency. "faithless votes" have occurred before, but never in decisive situations.

    if it still a tie, the president is decided by the house, the vicepresident by the senate. it is unclear to me, by the wording of the amendment, if it is the new or the old congress in charge (most opinion i've read think it would be the new congress.

    in the senate it is a straight vote, so if it is the new senate, where dems should have a clear majority regardless of lieberman, the chosen VP would likely be Biden. If it is the old (current) senate it could come down to lieberman vote to tie and cheney to decide for Pailin.

    it is more interesting in the house for the presidency:
    here the vote is not a direct vote, but it is by delegation, that is every state gets one vote, regardless of size. In the current house, the dems have a majority of delegations, but it is a slim margin: the current delegations are dems 26, reps 21, ties 3. the ties and the few with a slim majority could switch in the next election so, although the dems are favourites, it is far from certain that it is a lock.
    Add that there might be some pressure on the delegation from red states to reflect that at that point, especially if McCain wins the popular vote.
     
  15. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #15
    That would be a giant fustercluck.

    Yes. He's in the tank for McCain.
     
  16. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

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    #16
    in any case, the sooner we move to popular vote, the better.
     
  17. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    #17
    I'm under the impression that it would be the NEXT House & Senate, not the current versions, that do the deciding in case of a tie.....so Libermann may not be so much of a factor after all.

    also, I think that in selecting a president in the House, that each STATE gets one vote, not each member, so the House delegation from each state votes on how their state will vote and then each delegation casts one vote......or so I'm remembering
     

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