A Poll for our Forum Members Who Are Not U.S. Citizens

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Huntn, May 28, 2017.

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Watching the US Political System, where else can you get this kind of Reality TV?

Poll closed Jul 28, 2017.
  1. This is the most fantastic Reality TV I've ever experience.

    10 vote(s)
    25.0%
  2. This is the most horrifying Reality TV I've ever experienced.

    16 vote(s)
    40.0%
  3. I'm fearful of the U.S.

    12 vote(s)
    30.0%
  4. I'm fearful for the U.S.

    21 vote(s)
    52.5%
  5. Republicans will fix the U.S. (not sarcastic)

    3 vote(s)
    7.5%
  6. Republicans are ruining the U.S.

    10 vote(s)
    25.0%
  7. Democrats will fix the U.S. (not sarcastic)

    2 vote(s)
    5.0%
  8. Democrats are ruining the U.S..

    9 vote(s)
    22.5%
  9. The U.S. is self destructing

    18 vote(s)
    45.0%
  10. The U.S. will fall down and pick itself back up.

    15 vote(s)
    37.5%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Huntn, May 28, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #1
    I'd like to know where else can you get this kind of entertainment? And just how concerned are you?

    I acknowledge that the poll is not going to reveal an answer because it will be polluted by U.S. participants. Oh well. It will be interesting all the same. :) And I ran out of poll answers. :(

    For clarification, feel free to post and describe your answers if you want to.

    Unlimited replies.

    Update: Based on question asked in this thread, Ill clarify that I am equating US politics to a form of Reality TV. :oops:
     
  2. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
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    #2
    Missing option:

    We need more recipes, midget!

    :p :D

    BL.
     
  3. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #3
    The US is basically turning into Mexico where you have a two party monopoly in politics.
     
  4. Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #4
    I agree more choices would be good, but there should be some barrels to jump over to get into the contest. Looking at this link, it appears that it's up to each State to determine ballot access including partitions consisting of numbers representing 2-3% of the last vote. My suggestion would be to drop that much lower and to have federally standardized requirements and one process not 50 to get on ballots in 50 states. Of possible interest see the Other Obstacles section of that link.
     
  5. zin macrumors 6502

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  6. Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #6
    • I'm not surprised, this comment comes from you.
    • I ran out of poll answer slots.
    • Please describe the bias you detect.
    • Feel free to describe your preferred answers.
     
  7. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #7
    None of your options answers the question posed in your title.
     
  8. Huntn, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #8
    Technically correct, but I was using this poll as a sounding board about how people who are not from the US, feel about The US's political environment, hence the first poll (I remember posting) that allows multiple answers.
     
  9. nebo1ss macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2010
    #9
    I love comedy and with the material that is being gifted to the late night hosts i am really enjoying it. It is the only American TV that I watch other than the NBA.
     
  10. Scepticalscribe, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #10
    I don't watch Reality TV and - as someone who is not a citizen of the US - I am not in a position to vote for either of the two great parties that are found in the US.

    In fact, I agree with @skunk in that I would argue that none of the poll options address the question asked in the thread title.

    To the post of yours - @Huntn - that I have quoted above, I would recommend that you add the verb "to think" to accompany the verb "to feel".

    As to my own feelings about the US and its political environment? Words can barely begin to describe my appalled and transfixed horror at what is happening before my eyes.

    And, as for my thoughts. Well, by profession, I am a political analyst: I expect that in the future, the US will get its very own special section in political science text books that describe political systems and political cultures, one well removed from the fat section on 'western democracies', and in a unique section of its own in the book, adjacent to, but separate from, the part where you will find descriptions of countries that have 'presidential systems and semi-presidential systems that struggle with democracy and democratic concepts.'
     
  11. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

    Joined:
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    #11
    I don't really see any bias. Perhaps the final two...
     
  12. Huntn, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #12
    Thanks for the critique, I'll try to improve that statement.

    It's possible I don't need to clarify this, but this poll was something new for me. In the poll question, I was equating the political news coming out of the US to a form of reality TV, attempting some sarcastic humor, and inviting participants to respond with input, not intended to answer the question, as much as reflect your feelings about the state of the U.S. if I have failed in this regard, I'll try harder next time.
    --- Post Merged, May 29, 2017 ---
    I admit, the last two choices in the poll exposes a pessimistic bias, although the last one is a counter to the choice that comes immediately before it, offering hope and does not project how far the US will fall before it recovers.

    And if I go out on a limb, I feel very confident that the overall view of the US both internally and externally is that the US is sinking, not rising, while acknowledging that internally, politically the reasons stated for the decline will be diametrically opposed, almost down the Middle. This is why we are in deep trouble.

    Edit: Grammer and typo
     
  13. Scepticalscribe, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #13
    Candidly, - and I used to write a lot of political satire (which was frequently published in student magazines) as an undergrad while at university - I don't think Mr Trump is funny.

    I have taught politics (and history) and have worked in dysfunctional countries, destroyed countries, war-torn countries, countries that were trying to develop and rebuild after conflict, collapse, or civil war or revolution.

    Politically, I thought I had seen it all, (or, a lot of what there was to see) but I have never before witnessed a first world country - one which served as a beacon to so many countries and people in so many ways for so long - devour itself and traduce its reputation and institutions so thoroughly and completely in such a short time as has happened with the United States under the uniquely dysfunctional and disgraceful administration of Donald Trump.

    For all of his many faults - not least that the reality could never live up to the hope embodied by the dream - and I am not blind to his faults, for the most part, Barack Obama had a thoughtful and incisive intelligence, prudent judgment, a serious work ethic, an ability to seek out and heed intelligent and informed advice, an ability to work with those who differed from him, an ability to withstand sustained pressure with grace and dignity, a refreshing capacity for bridge-building, an understanding that treating your interlocutors with respect in international relations is not a sign of weakness, and a capacity to express himself eloquently in both speech and in writing.

    And - with all of that in his favour - it took him almost two years to repair the reputational damage done to the US by the presidency and policies of George W Bush, a man who was personally decent, and manifestly not insane, - something that - unfortunately - can not be said with any degree of certainty about the current incumbent.
     
  14. Huntn, May 29, 2017
    Last edited: May 29, 2017

    Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #14
    Your truth is throughly depressing and tastes aweful, but we really need this kind of medicine, so I hold my nose and say thank you, may we have another? :oops: I never imagined my country could unravel this far, this fast, and I try to remain hopeful that sanity will be recovered by more than half of the thinking, participating populace.

    Trump is an ongoing disaster of a President, the absolute worse choice of a leader brought about by disillusioned, possible suicidal voters who for whatever the reason, can't see a decent future for themselves and were either protesting, clueless, or gullible. My analogy is that if you are unhappy living in the basement of the mansion, will your situation improve by alighting it on fire?
     
  15. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    UK
    #15
    I think there are a number of issues with our democracy that Trumps election has highlighted in a positive way.
    • I think it has taught us that things really can be worse with the ridiculous level of corruption and incompetence coming out of the White House itself.
    • I think our town councils and other low level political institutions had become ossified and full of people obsessed with single issues or who were unrepresentative of the community. I think more activism is probably a good thing that will help revitalise those things.
    • I think far too many voters refused to change their minds which parties they supported. I think Trumps campaign attempts to actually understand ordinary Americans concerns and his racism have helped shift people out of their party silos. This is good. You can see similar things in the UK election - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/may/28/uncertainty-politics-u-turns-polls.
     
  16. juanm macrumors 65816

    juanm

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    #16
    Duopoly.
     
  17. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #17
    It's been a duopoly for 200 years...
     
  18. cube macrumors G5

    Joined:
    May 10, 2004
    #18
    No, it has been turning into Argentina since at least the eighties.
     
  19. Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #19
    I just hope that the world can maintain some perspective about the Trump led United States. This morning in the latest tweet frenzy, he attacked a statement by the Mayor of London regarding the lastest London terror attack and let the truth be known, he considers his policy that was not a travel ban, really is a ban. Good luck with that in court Bozo. :oops:

    Anyway, I digress. He by no means represents the plurality of the United States thinking on just about any topic. It was mentioned this morning on MSNBC, (my paraphrasing and embellishment) that despite the tragedy of the Trump Presidency is inflicting on the country, the biggest gift he's offering is his ineptitude and inability to push through the vast majority of his and the GOP's terrible ideas. :oops:
     
  20. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #20
    Yes. The poll QUESTION asks this:

    Watching the US Political System, where else can you get this kind of Reality TV?​

    And since there where no place names offered, I say maybe flashbacks to times in Uganda and Dominican Republic, when Idi Amin and Trujillo, respectively, were ascending to power. That’s assuming one could have obtained news trailers from then that were not just government propaganda. But after all, both those guys knew they had to get grip on the media first so as to keep them from making trouble later on.

    Countries with strong man governments are interesting. A lot of such governments come up as revolts against status quo, and then become perverted as the "rebels" become drunk with power. Some, however, come up intending to abuse power. Trujillo was one thing the first time around, and was credited with some reforms, but when he came back again he came back with a vengeance that made him notorious as an abuser.

    “Trump as Reality TV” is what’s wrong with the picture in the USA to begin with. He’s not reality TV, he’s the real deal. But, among his followers the ones who delight in the chaos he’s creating at home and abroad seem to consider his ultimate impact on their own realities no more damaging than the clanging sort of hangover one can get from a particularly obnoxious or ludicrous episode of some reality TV show.

    Meanwhile the rest of us still reside in a real world where a real Donald Trump is leaving negative footprints of himself and the US wherever he goes, possibly excepting Saudi Arabia, the Philippines, the Palestinian Authority and the living rooms and smartphones of those who regard his reign as if it were a TV show.

    OK so let’s say it’s a TV show. I think we should cancel it.
     
  21. Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #21
    Thanks and outstanding post. :) It (the poll question) was intended as a self answered question, not really asking where else, but an opportunity to make observations about the U.S. in it's current state. :)
     
  22. Scepticalscribe, Jun 5, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017

    Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #22
    @LizKat: Great post.

    Now, as you know, I have worked in countries where "strongmen" have ruled.

    If anything, over time, they become more repressive, more intolerant of difference and dissent, more narcissistic, more deluded and more insistent in their demands of increasingly outrageous demonstrations of how much their subjects truly love them.

    They see no need to be constrained by the rule of law - the law is what they say it is, an infinitely flexible tool which means nothing other than something to further their power and cast a spurious legality over the stench of their corruption and bottomless abuses of power.

    Death is what finally separates them from power, either naturally, in their beds, or forcibly, in a coup, or revolution, either at the hands of their intimates, or the put upon population, or some mix of both. They are rarely removed by legal means - elections or impeachment.

    And then, very often, a further task awaits the revolutionaries, or their successors in government: The families - or Families - of the Strongman - who have become monstrously and obscenely wealthy - also need to be prised loose from the levers of power and privilege and unearned and undeserved and often quite corruptly acquired wealth.

    Given his clear and overt contempt for the courts, constitution, administration, governing bodies, government departments (such as the that of the Secretary of State), intelligence services, and institutions of the US, - can anyone observing this dysfunctional debacle from near or afar really persuade themselves that Mr Trump will willingly quit office, if and when he is obliged to do so?

    Increasingly, I am beginning to doubt it, as he harbours no respect whatsoever for the institutions, traditions, and organs of government of the United States.
     
  23. the8thark macrumors 68040

    the8thark

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    #23
    This is why I abstain from partaking in the poll. Whether you think politics in your nation is a farce or not, it's still your government and you should respect the government and the office of the president.

    I am not an Obama fan at all, quite the opposite, but I respected the fact that the US nation voted him in and he held the office of president. Trump is also not perfect but again I respect the office of the president. You all as a nation need to work with the president (democrat or Republican, doesn't matter which side) to improve the nation. It's no different to my Australian PM. He's far from perfect but I do want to see him the best PM he can be because I respect the office of the PM.

    People need to realise that liking or hating the President is not the same as respecting the office of the President. Someoner can hate the president but still respect the office of the president.
     
  24. Huntn thread starter macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #24
    Trump rules (as a set of rules, not as a King rules)- he makes them up as he goes along.
    Rule 1: Fool'm at any cost.
    Rule 2: Hide the true agenda.
    Rule 3: Sneak past the law and if caught mitigate the outcome with some lies, and hope those enforcing the law are pliable or incompetent.
    Rule 4: Tell a lie, and when it does not work, throw all of your people who have been lying for you under the bus.
    Rule 5: Never keep a secret when you can impress them with what you know.
    Rule 6: ___________________________- (fill in the blank).
     
  25. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #25
    Excellent post.. . it's why the GOP should stop hoping they can get a tax break under Trump's pen hand. The cost might be too dear. The longer he's there, the more entrenched he becomes just by virtue (hah) of having got away with it all so far. Let Mike Pence sign that tax legislation if they can even get it off the ground. Meanwhile they should impeach their dear leader and remove him, peacefully, legally under the Constitution.

    The longer the guy sits there flaunting his apparent untouchability, the more also the hangers-on will crowd up to get their piece of the pie because hey, this could be the last chance for the big grab, and Trump's the guy they've been waiting for to flip us to kleptocracy. Just now I was reading that a couple Western states have written to Trump's Interior secretary, asking to be able to resume mining uranium near the Grand Canyon.... this despite the sickness from pollutants that afflicted indigenous tribes during previous mining, which was the reason it was halted to begin with...


    My concern with Trump is that if the GOP doesn't impeach and remove him, he'll be impeached and removed anyway, but by moderate Republicans and a whole bunch of Democrats, which may not sit very well with the Republican electorate even if they themselves no longer think Trump fit for office. And that the next version of this GOP administration might then take the possible violence of ensuing protests and counter-protests as an excuse to declare martial law, etc. And so down some other rabbit hole. Mr. Pence must be wondering about some of this stuff himself. Mr. Ryan must sometimes be wishing someone else was Speaker and he just another GOP Congressman waiting for instructions. The problem is, Mr. Ryan too seems to be waiting for instructions...

    Ugh, I am no longer sure why I checked off "The U.S. will fall down and pick itself up". First we have to manage to live through the rest of the falling down process.
     

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