Aint that a shame

[Ensign Paris]

This was just reported on MacMinute:

Apple executive: No new hardware for "some months"
February 11 - 08:50 ET: Having refreshed its entire product line in the last two months, Apple is not planning to update any of its hardware for some time, according to MacCentral, ruling out the possibility of updated hardware being introduced at Seybold New York next week or Macworld Expo Tokyo later in March. "We're not planning to introduce any new CPUs at Macworld Tokyo, as a matter of fact, we're set for some months now," Greg Joswiak, Apple's senior director of Hardware Product Marketing said.

Lets just all hope that it was a way of diverting our attention from the new G5s?

 

[jefhatfield]

if the g5 comes out sometime this year, that will be good since it seems like apple quieted down a lot of criticism by coming out with the dual 1 ghz powermac

on the consumer end, the imac will keep the home users very happy

one thing apple needs to do is get a g4 processor into the ibook and that will probably happen before we see a g5 because would apple allow three processors to be in its lineup?

 

[Falleron]

I believe that the ibook will be with the G3 for some time! At least until they reach 1Ghz which is possible now if Apple wanted to use IBM's new chips.

 

[Ensign Paris]

is that jefhatfield i see back? what happened to networkman!

I think that there is a possibility of a G4 iBook before the end of the year with pBooks reaching 1ghz before the end of the year.

Guy

 

[keithcobbett]

I think that we'll see 1GHz TiBooks before we see G4 iBooks. Apple won't put them both on the same chip until the G5 comes out for portables. They don't even have it available for the Desktop yet. Maybe next year a G4 iBook will come out. I think we will see a good amount of hardware at NY though. Updated TiBooks and G5 Desktops. Maybe even a speed bump with the iMac and iBooks.

 

[ftaok]

Not necessarily ...

Originally posted by keithcobbett
I think that we'll see 1GHz TiBooks before we see G4 iBooks. Apple won't put them both on the same chip until the G5 comes out for portables.

That's what some people were saying about the iMac and PowerMac lines. And they're both using G4s right now.

Personally, I think that Apple's gonna do away with the G3 all-together and rather quickly. The first G4 iBook will start at 650 (or so for the hi-end) and the TiBook will be running at 800 (low-end) by then.

Hey, just my guess.

 

[eyelikeart]

I don't think the G3 is going away anytime soon. From other articles we've read it seems there are plans for the processor still.

I'd like to see a 1 Ghz PowerBook come about...but it took so long for the towers to reach that speed I doubt we'll see it anytime soon...

 

[spikey]

There is no need for a G4 in the iBook. It is a consumer portable, with the 750FX it would be fast enough for the consumer. It will be fast enough for OSX.

The iBook is already very popular, so they might aswell put in a 750FX, and drop the price of it a little, possibly putting a G4 in the 14" to bridge the gap between ibook and powerbook. that would be the ideal consumer portable.

 

[spikey]

The reason apple put a G4 in the imac was because they expected the consumer to do more with their imac, hence needing a G4.

But with the iBook people are content, they dont need the power of altivec yet, but they do need the power increase of which the 750FX has.

 

[ftaok]

Who says???

Originally posted by spikey
The reason apple put a G4 in the imac was because they expected the consumer to do more with their imac, hence needing a G4.

But with the iBook people are content, they dont need the power of altivec yet, but they do need the power increase of which the 750FX has.

Who says that they don't need a G4 in the iBook. Right now, the iBook is the only Mac that's not capable of running Apple 4-part Digital Hub Suite. iDVD will not work on an iBook (or DVD Studio Pro) because it lacks the G4. If Apple is serious about it's iSuite for everyone, the iBook needs a G4 (and fast).

Right now, I'm content with my G3 iBook 500, but in a year or so (when we can get a portable sized Superdrive), I'm gonna want to be able to edit DVDs and burn them as well.

 

[Ensign Paris]

There is non reason for the iBook to support iDVD because it doesn't support an internal superdrive, although it could support DVDStudio pro but if you bought that would you not have bought the Titanuim?

I personally like the idea on a G4 processor in the 14", G3 in 12" and G4 Apollo Portable in the Ti.

 

[ftaok]

Originally posted by Ensign Paris
There is non reason for the iBook to support iDVD because it doesn't support an internal superdrive, although it could support DVDStudio pro but if you bought that would you not have bought the Titanuim?

I personally like the idea on a G4 processor in the 14", G3 in 12" and G4 Apollo Portable in the Ti.

Yeah, right now, there's no reason for iDVD on an iBook, but in a few months, we may see SuperDrives small enough to be put into a portable. Wouldn't it be nice to have a G4 iBook to go with it.

Anyways, I got the iBook because it was the perfect form factor for me. It's a true, all-in-one portable. I suppose that if I really wanted to do DVD movies, I would have gotten a TiBook, but it's a little too big and a little too fragile.

 

[Ensign Paris]

My Tibook goes to school and work with me every day (par weekends) and its surviveing but my previous iBook (Clamb) was more ruggid.

I would love a 12" or small iBook for school it would be much better that the PB, I constantly worry about damageing it!

Ensign,

 

[Rower_CPU]

We would have to see a Superdrive in the TiBook before you can even consider having one in the iBook line.


I'm on the fence as to this whole topic. I'm waiting 'til Apple updates to DDR before I'll consider buying a new machine. If it's a G5, great, if not, it's still great because then the Mac will have the memory bandwidth to really put Wintel boxes in their place.

 

[KingArthur]

I personally expect that the G3 will remain in the iBook line while we will see the G4 Apollo in the new TiBooks since the Apollo line uses considerably less power than the one in there now. The G3 is a solid processor for the iBook. It uses relatively little power and runs quite cool. The G3 actually runs faster Mhz to Mhz than the G4 in normal, nonSIMD tasks. This is ideal for the college student who just wants to be able to listen to music, game, and do homework. The only reason that the G3 chips in the iBooks are so slow is that Apple won't let their low-end computer have higher Mhz than their high-end computer. I bet that they could put at least 1Ghz processors in those iBooks, but as we have seen with PCs: Mhz matters and fewer people would buy the G4 machines if the G3s boasted faster frequencies.

As for the G5--let us just wait and see. I would bet that this will be like the transition from G3 chips to G4s. There were the G3 towers which were very powerful and then there were the G3 All-in-One desktops. It took awhile to get those towers to G4 and we saw a single processor in all desktops for a while there. I bet this will be the case with the new G5 transition.

 

[ftaok]

Again, not necessarily

Originally posted by Rower_CPU
We would have to see a Superdrive in the TiBook before you can even consider having one in the iBook line.

The iBook had the Combo drive way before they put one in the TiBook. I can see them putting in a SuperDrive in the iBook first as well. At least, that's what I'm hoping for.

 

[ftaok]

But OS X is G4 optimized

Originally posted by KingArthur
I personally expect that the G3 will remain in the iBook line while we will see the G4 Apollo in the new TiBooks since the Apollo line uses considerably less power than the one in there now. The G3 is a solid processor for the iBook. It uses relatively little power and runs quite cool. The G3 actually runs faster Mhz to Mhz than the G4 in normal, nonSIMD tasks. This is ideal for the college student who just wants to be able to listen to music, game, and do homework.

But with Apple going towards OS X completely, they need to either (a) put the G4 in all Macs or (b) optimize OS X for G3s as well. My guess is G4s for everyone.

The only reason that the G3 chips in the iBooks are so slow is that Apple won't let their low-end computer have higher Mhz than their high-end computer. I bet that they could put at least 1Ghz processors in those iBooks, but as we have seen with PCs: Mhz matters and fewer people would buy the G4 machines if the G3s boasted faster frequencies.

Are IBM's 1GHz G3s being used in anything yet? I don't even know if they exist.

As for the G5--let us just wait and see. I would bet that this will be like the transition from G3 chips to G4s. There were the G3 towers which were very powerful and then there were the G3 All-in-One desktops. It took awhile to get those towers to G4 and we saw a single processor in all desktops for a while there. I bet this will be the case with the new G5 transition.

I personally think that we'll see all Macs at G4s before we see the G5. Here's one thought that I've come up with. Perhaps Apple won't be using the G5 from Motorola at all. Maybe the G5 that they'll use will be an IBM chip. So we'll have the consumer chips by MOT and the pro chips by IBM. Just a thought.

 

[spikey]

"But with Apple going towards OS X completely, they need to either (a) put the G4 in all Macs or (b) optimize OS X for G3s as well. My guess is G4s for everyone. "

No no no. If the 750FX is put in an ibook then it will perform well enough for OSX, altivec or no altivec. Hence no need for a G4 for OSX in a consumer laptop.



"Are IBM's 1GHz G3s being used in anything yet? I don't even know if they exist. "
They do exist, ity is called a 750FX, look it up on IBMs website. But no they are not being used by anything yet.


The reason why the ibook doesnt need a G4 is because, out of all my friends with an ibook (there are alot of them), none of them use any altivec enabled appz, and none of them want to. If you want a portable to use iDVD then you should use what most people use which is a Tibook. That is what the Tibook is for, hence the nice big screen which can have nice big resolutions for nice appz like iDVD. The ibook with a smaller screen would detract from iDVD.
Also If the G3 750FX was put in the ibook it would be able to run consumer based appz faster than the G4 would be able to, hence making it a better consumer protable.



"I personally think that we'll see all Macs at G4s before we see the G5. Here's one thought that I've come up with. Perhaps Apple won't be using the G5 from Motorola at all. Maybe the G5 that they'll use will be an IBM chip. So we'll have the consumer chips by MOT and the pro chips by IBM. Just a thought."

As much as i would like to see that it aint gonna happen, Apple has accepted motos design of the G5. But that doesnt mean to say that IBM fabbing the chips aint gonna happen, it is very possible seeing as moto is
a) ****
b) looking like its going under/ cant be bothered with its powerpc

 

[ftaok]

Originally posted by spikey
No no no. If the 750FX is put in an ibook then it will perform well enough for OSX, altivec or no altivec. Hence no need for a G4 for OSX in a consumer laptop.

Sure it may be able to run OS X now, but how about a few updates in after Apple starts optimizing everything for Altivec?

They do exist, ity is called a 750FX, look it up on IBMs website. But no they are not being used by anything yet.

Yeah, I wasn't sure if anyone used the 750fx. Thanks for the info.

The reason why the ibook doesnt need a G4 is because, out of all my friends with an ibook (there are alot of them), none of them use any altivec enabled appz, and none of them want to. If you want a portable to use iDVD then you should use what most people use which is a Tibook. That is what the Tibook is for, hence the nice big screen which can have nice big resolutions for nice appz like iDVD. The ibook with a smaller screen would detract from iDVD.
Also If the G3 750FX was put in the ibook it would be able to run consumer based appz faster than the G4 would be able to, hence making it a better consumer protable.

I would have gotten a TiBook, except that it's too big. I love the 12" iBook's size, but I wish that it had a little more oomph. Personally, the only Altivec optimized app that I use is OS X. And in the future, more and more apps will become Altivec optimized as the majority of the Mac line will be Altivec enabled.

As much as i would like to see that it aint gonna happen, Apple has accepted motos design of the G5. But that doesnt mean to say that IBM fabbing the chips aint gonna happen, it is very possible seeing as moto is
a) ****
b) looking like its going under/ cant be bothered with its powerpc

Where did you see that Apple has accepted MOT's G5 design? Motorola's latest PPC roadmap doesn't show a desktop G5. And I don't believe the article on "The Register". Until I see a Motorola Press Release on the matter, I'm assuming that there's no Motorola G5 on the horizon.

 

[spikey]

"Sure it may be able to run OS X now, but how about a few updates in after Apple starts optimizing everything for Altivec? "

A few updates in the future, it should still run OSX well. Especially seeing as this 750FX is meant to have a very fast fsb. OSX will not get any slower for the G3 in the future, if anything it should get faster with OSX 10.2.
I also doubt apple will optimize anything else for altivec, it is meant to be pretty hard to create an altivec enabled app.


"I would have gotten a TiBook, except that it's too big. I love the 12" iBook's size, but I wish that it had a little more oomph. Personally, the only Altivec optimized app that I use is OS X. And in the future, more and more apps will become Altivec optimized as the majority of the Mac line will be Altivec enabled. "

I think though that this is not the point. The point is, does the consumer use altivec enabled appz i think the answer is no. Also most of the fundamental appz made by apple are altivec optimized, so anymore altivec enabled appz in the future wont do much for the consumer who wont use them.
Also whether or not the app is altivec enabled, the 750FX would be able to run it reasonably well, it has a hellishly impressive bus, it is a fast cpu, and it is a G3 which is by no means a dead design of a cpu.



"Where did you see that Apple has accepted MOT's G5 design? Motorola's latest PPC roadmap doesn't show a desktop G5. And I don't believe the article on "The Register". Until I see a Motorola Press Release on the matter, I'm assuming that there's no Motorola G5 on the horizon."

Motorola owns the licensing **** for altivec.
IBM doesnt won the licensing rights nor does apple.
So if apple did go with IBM a few months back then they would have been going with a cpu with no altivec, which would be a bit strange seeing as apple loves altivec and also the G4 would have it and the G5 wouldnt.
there have been rumors about IBM being anle to simulate altivec, but i doubt very much that this would be efficient.

So apple has to go with Motos design if they want altivec for now. Until ofcourse moto goes under, in which case the doors are wide open for IBM to make it.



I think though the biggest point in this is being missed, The 750FX will run more consumer appz faster than the G4 will. And seeing as alot of appz wont be altivec optimized (due to the difficulty of it, and the laziness of software developers) then there will be more non altivec enabled consumer appz than altivec enabled consumer appz. Also the 750FX should be cheaper, and also it would have a much brighter future seeing as IBM would be developing it.

 

[spikey]

Although the ibook will one day need altivec, i doubt it needs it now.
Probably because most consumer appz arent altivec enabled, and they wont be for a fairly long time. That G3 would rip the pants off alot of cpus in non altivec appz, whereas the G4 wouldnt.

i think i would rather see IBM develop the consumer chip, it means that in non altivec appz, apple has at last got a cpu which kicks PC cpu arse. And they atleast have IBM on their side.

 

[ftaok]

Spikey,

You say that consumers don't run Altivec apps. Hey, I'm a consumer and I want to run iDVD. Where does that leave me?

Yeah, sure, get an iMac. But I want a portable for the times that I do travel (or go to my GF's house).

Yeah, sure, get a TiBook. But I don't want that big a laptop.

This is what I want. I want something the size of an iBook (12" screen) with the capability to run iDVD. A G4 iBook seems to be the answer for me, and I suspect many other people as well.

 

[jefhatfield]

come on, where is that 1 ghz 750 fx mobile g3 chip i have heard rumors about?

it would be perfcet for the ibook and i don't think it would cannibalize the g4 powerbook sales...even if the powerbook is planned to only go somewhere over 800 mhz

people would be buying the two different portables for two different reasons

 

[DakotaGuy]

I love my iBook! As far as a new one coming out anytime soon...probably not...I think this summer however we will see a speed bumped G3. The problem that I see with a G4 at this point is price and the fact that the Powerbook has a G4. If the Tibook has a G4 and the iBook has a G4 and they have the same MHz...what is the difference and why would you pay $600-$1,000 more for a TiBook???

I think that Apple will probably leave the G3 in the iBook until they can move the TiBook to a G5 in the future. I could see the iBook getting bumped to 800 and 900MHz this summer or 900Mhz and 1GHz. Again the only problem with that is...even though there is a thing called "Mhz myth" how would it look if the iBook is running at 1GHz and the TiBook is running at 667MHz? Just some of my thoughts. Many will point to the fact that the iMac is now a G4 as well as the towers being G4's...I think notebooks are a different deal however. They serve more of the same market share then a tower and a consumer desk model does. Expandability is limited in any notebook and now that Apple is moving the iBook's screen size up...if both the iBook and the TiBook are G4's but the iBook is priced the way it is now...what have you done to your TiBook sales? The other thing is what if the G4 added cost to the iBook and it ends up costing about the same as the TiBook...then what have you done to iBook sales...and sales to schools etc?

I say look for a G3 packed with more power for this summer.

 

[ftaok]

No one ever said that they'd have the G4iBook and G4TiBook running at the same speed. You could put a 650mhz in the high-end i and an 800mhz in the low-end Ti. That should put enough of a gap between the two lines. Plus, the extra features in the TiBook would account for the higher price.

And who's to say that the 1 Ghz 750fx G3 chip from IBM isn't cost prohibitive for Apple to use? Could the price that IBM wanted for those chips have been the reason that Apple has moved towards the G4?

I'm not sure, but I've heard that the current Apollos in the Towers are priced very reasonably by Motorola.