An open letter to Apple: here's what you can do to clean up the Mac Mini mess


SuperChuck

macrumors 6502
Nov 15, 2003
299
0
Chucktown, SC
Yes, Apple. You have released a computer that is built around 2-year-old technology that pales in comparison to anything else in your lineup and the media are tripping over themselves to talk about how revolutionary it is.

The New York Times has done three pieces on it already.

Clearly, you have made a terrible mess.
 

varmit

macrumors 68000
Aug 5, 2003
1,830
0
Yes, lets write the company that is releasing something. Tell them that they are stupid to release a broken product, saying its under powered and all. Please don't do it the way you are doing it, do it my way.

Signed, Idiot that could never make something that small and fast.
 

thequicksilver

macrumors 6502a
Sep 19, 2004
769
0
Birmingham
I don't agree with the man's opinions on the Mac mini, but give him his due - a lot of what he writes here (notably the PS2->USB converter and the number of USB ports on the mini) make very good sense.
 

daveL

macrumors 68020
Jun 18, 2003
2,425
0
Montana
If you don't like it, don't buy it. My 1 GHz G4 PB has been serving me well for over 2 years. I can't see why the Mac Mini would be anything but *more* capable than my PB, for a lot less money.
 

LimitedEdition

macrumors member
Jan 14, 2005
60
0
People are a lot smarter than this guy gives them credit for, they can grasp the concept of BYODKM and they don't need stickers to learn a few new keys.

If people were as stupid as you think you might have a point Mr. Palmer, but they simply are not.
 

MacNeXT

macrumors 6502
Jun 21, 2004
258
0
While I don't want to discourage criticism, I don't give much credit to this Bill Palmer figure. First he was ABSOLUTELY SURE that the headless mac rumour was FAKE, because, according to him, it was an incredibly dumb thing for Apple to do. Then when it turned out to be true, he put up a very long rant on why he was disappointed and a lot of reasons why it would fail, and now he tries something like this.

I don't understand how someone can put so much negative energy into something that 1. He doesn't have to buy and 2. A lot of people are very happy about. He sounds like a very frustrated guy.

Edit: another thing: I always like it when feedback is publicized, but that long list of only-positive reactions smells fishy...
 

Chubypig

macrumors 6502
Aug 30, 2004
275
0
I think what everyone (critics included) must remember is that this is a BUDGET machine. It was not made to be a super duper powerful computer. I have never heard of a critic complain about dell's or hp's or gateway's budget computers. They are meant for light users.
 

Chip NoVaMac

macrumors G3
Dec 25, 2003
8,889
25
Northern Virginia
Some people just don't know what goes in to a product design and rollout. Sure there have been mistakes by most companies, and the ones still around have learned from them.
 

yippy

macrumors 68020
Mar 14, 2004
2,087
3
Chicago, IL
People aslo forget that the $500 PC you buy at Best Buy are also 2-3 year old, underpowered machines. There isn't much difference except the mini looks better and has a real graphics card.
 

madmaxmedia

macrumors 68030
Dec 17, 2003
2,923
32
Los Angeles, CA
MacNeXT said:
While I don't want to discourage criticism, I don't give much credit to this Bill Palmer figure. First he was ABSOLUTELY SURE that the headless mac rumour was FAKE, because, according to him, it was an incredibly dumb thing for Apple to do. Then when it turned out to be true, he put up a very long rant on why he was disappointed and a lot of reasons why it would fail, and now he tries something like this.

I don't understand how someone can put so much negative energy into something that 1. He doesn't have to buy and 2. A lot of people are very happy about. He sounds like a very frustrated guy.
My sentiments exactly. I mean when most of the world and press is praising the machine, you'd think that he would at least attempt to understand why others might see things differently than him. Instead he dismisses anyone who likes the Mini as an Apple fanboy.

Besides, what "mess" is there right now? At least give it a couple of months of sales before you go proclaiming yourself Mr. Right.
 

madmaxmedia

macrumors 68030
Dec 17, 2003
2,923
32
Los Angeles, CA
The other thing I remember reading from this guy was he was going on an on about how confusing Apple's lineup was- how there were both consumer and pro models with and without monitor. As if it's that hard to see a model in a store and deduce whether you need to buy a monitor for it.

He also suggests offering the eMac without keyboard and mouse. Well why would you do that, if you're so against the Mac Mini not including a keyboard and mouse?

Some suggestions are not bad, such as having low priced CRT (or LCD) options in the Apple stores. For LCD's, just small 15" models that don't compete with the Apple displays. They wouldn't take up too much space and don't weigh a ton.
 

jeremy.king

macrumors 603
Jul 23, 2002
5,478
1
Fuquay Varina, NC
Dear Bill Palmer,

Please refund my 3 minutes for reading that crap you consider a legitimate gripe with Apple.

Sincerely,

kingjr3

PS. My pc only has 2 USB ports. Damn crappy IBM laptop...
 

gwangung

macrumors 65816
Apr 9, 2003
1,106
19
madmaxmedia said:
Some suggestions are not bad, such as having low priced CRT (or LCD) options in the Apple stores. For LCD's, just small 15" models that don't compete with the Apple displays. They wouldn't take up too much space and don't weigh a ton.
Yeah, but the margins on them are awful. Not worth Apple's time.

You should think VERY carefully about when and where to release a product with razor thin margins. In the case of the mini, it's obviously to capture a SPECIFIC segment of the market. In the case of displays, Apple does not have a compelling interest in capturing the low end display market [nor would it have a compelling product like the Shuffle to capture it with]. People keep on forgetting that the personal computer is an aberration; in every other industry, Apple's margins of 25-30% are NORMAL (not fat!).
 

3Memos

macrumors 6502
Jan 12, 2005
460
0
You need to cut costs on the eMac in order to lower its price? Then consider making moves such as downgrading the 5400 RPM hard drive in the eMac to match the 4200 RPM hard drive in the Mac Mini. If 4200 RPM is fast enough for the Mini, then it's fast enough for the eMac.
Doesn't the eMac use 3.5" HDs? Then how does Apple plan on finding 4200RPM 3.5' HDs for use in the eMacs? If true, Bill Palmer is a bigger idiot than first perceived.
 

DanTheMan

macrumors member
Jun 21, 2004
36
0
Los Angeles, CA
kingjr3 said:
Dear Bill Palmer,

Please refund my 3 minutes for reading that crap you consider a legitimate gripe with Apple.

Sincerely,

kingjr3

PS. My pc only has 2 USB ports. Damn crappy IBM laptop...
Completely agree. I have a PowerMac G5 and use a Logitech Keyboard and Dell monitors, why because I like using a two button mouse with scroll wheel contrary to what Steve Jobs thinks and for the price of one Apple 20" LCD display I can buy two Dell 20"' LCD displays (normal aspect ratio) that have a higher resolution.
 

dejo

Moderator
Original poster
Staff member
Sep 2, 2004
15,725
447
The Centennial State
DanTheMan said:
...I like using a two button mouse with scroll wheel contrary to what Steve Jobs thinks
Steve Jobs thinks you personally don't like using your two button mouse with scroll wheel? Wow, you must feel special! :D
 

cmvsm

macrumors 6502a
Nov 12, 2004
784
0
This guy certainly sounds like he's got a bug between the buns about something. The Mac Mini seems to be specifically marketed to lure unsatisfied PC users without the large investment and grant familiarity to the beauty of OS X over Windows. Then of course if that goes well, they may upgrade to a larger machine in the future and become permanent customers. The idea of course is to expand market share in the short and long term which I think Apple is doing pretty well with all of its product lines. Seems as if whenever there is a gripe or PC comparison, it always has to be about top of the line everything, when of course, most people don't need top of the line anything.

I hear people, mainly on this board, talking about these Dell monitors. They may be equivalent to the Apple's in screen quality, but man are they generic UGLY! If it were sitting on a shelf full of other Viewsonics, Sony's, Samsungs, etc, I never could tell the difference between any of them. If you are going to spend cash on an LCD, get the whole package...quality and asthetics. Hopefully the quality and resale on the Dell monitors are better than their computers. But then again, that's another story.
 

3Memos

macrumors 6502
Jan 12, 2005
460
0
Obviously this Bill Palmer guy is passionate about the Mac mini, since he devotes so much time writing all that garbage. Buy why is left for others to figure out.
 

daveL

macrumors 68020
Jun 18, 2003
2,425
0
Montana
Chip NoVaMac said:
I keep hearing people mention this, where is this info from Apple directly?
In their quarterly financial statements. It's a very significant number for any manufacturer. Just for comparison, Sun Microsystems, considered to be in the dumps the last 3 years, has a +40% margin, regularly. People point to Apple's margin because they are comparing them to Dell. Dell has *much* higher volume on *much* lower margin and, for all intents and purposes, no R&D. Dell doesn't innovate, they manufacture, period. I think Apple is right where they need to be.
 

jaromski

macrumors regular
Jun 18, 2004
150
0
zion
yeah this guys got more praise on his web site than jerry falwell on a sunday afternoon. oouuuh wee.

ok got that out of my system. this guy needs prozac. chill man. just wait a few months, watch the sales, and then let's talk.

plus apple has loads of savvy product people who i am sure kicked around all of these ideas before zeroing in on the mini mac and its place in the world. if you want to make a real difference bpalmer, go work for apple. then all your special knowledge can go to good use! douche bag.

jaromski
 

stcanard

macrumors 65816
Oct 19, 2003
1,490
0
Vancouver
Chubypig said:
I think what everyone (critics included) must remember is that this is a BUDGET machine.
I think you have hit the nail on the head.

When was the last time Apple released a budget machine?

The standard Mac reviewers are used to reviewing machines targetted at a mid - high end. They don't know what goes into a budget machine, and so have nothing to base their opinion on except that mid - high end.

That's why you see this really wierd situation where PC reviewers love it, and Mac reviewers hate it. PC reviewers have experience with the low-end budget system.
 

cmvsm

macrumors 6502a
Nov 12, 2004
784
0
daveL said:
People point to Apple's margin because they are comparing them to Dell. Dell has *much* higher volume on *much* lower margin and, for all intents and purposes, no R&D. Dell doesn't innovate, they manufacture, period. I think Apple is right where they need to be.
Good point about Dell. They are in the market of turns and not quality or R&D. Computer mill would be putting it mildly.
 

jaromski

macrumors regular
Jun 18, 2004
150
0
zion
cmvsm said:
I hear people, mainly on this board, talking about these Dell monitors. They may be equivalent to the Apple's in screen quality, but man are they generic UGLY! If it were sitting on a shelf full of other Viewsonics, Sony's, Samsungs, etc, I never could tell the difference between any of them. If you are going to spend cash on an LCD, get the whole package...quality and asthetics. Hopefully the quality and resale on the Dell monitors are better than their computers. But then again, that's another story.
Agreed. The bezel isn't much to look at but then again who cares about the bezel. You are looking at the panel most of the time anyway. I think if you were talking a difference of $100 or so then I would definately go apple. But...the 20" acd is $999 and the dell 20" equivalent is $680 right now. That is a big enough difference that I would be very tempted (if I were in the market for a new display) to go Dell.

I mean it makes sense to me to get the machine+osx because you can't get that from a different vendor. But a display is just that and who cares you still have an apple! (with an ugly dell screen, but $300 saved)

jaromski