Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Ugg, May 19, 2005.
Believe it or not, this is accurate. With few exceptions that I can think of in the last few years (Rajnishi deployment of Salmonella, Bomb planted at Atlanta Olympics, DC Sniper, Oklahoma City Bombing) Groups like ELF, ALF and others have burned, bombed and sabotaged their way past anyone else. Any given Law enforcement or Firefighting agency will stiffen if you mention ELF in their territory. They're even well ahead of Evangelical asassins out to kill women and doctors.
It's true but surprising to some i guess. It's not all activists, theya re just saying the violent extreme ones, like those people that torched those SUVs a year or so ago (yay ).
I'm not supportive at all of these groups, but it's important to note this point from the article:
Brackets imported from earlier in the article to explain who he is.
If you are going back as far as Atlanta, I think you have to include 9/11...and you have to include the fact that in most of the other visible cases of terrorism on the United States, you can not make the claim that real restraint was used with respect to bloodshed.
What would you rather have at the top of your list? People who cause property damage or people who kill people?
I don't support these groups, I support the environment. Your last line is what i think though. If the aggression is inevitable, it's better to take it out on inanimate objects rather than people. That's my 2 cents.
I believe the article stated DOMESTIC terrorist threat, 9/11 not eminating from the US, unless you consider the fact that we trained many of the terrorists/sold them weapons etc.... hmm maybe you are right.
Yep, it's a domestic list they're talking about.
It's important to note that far and away more terrorist acts in this country have been perpetrated by Americans than by foreign, International Terrorist Organizations or foreign nationals.
If you're unaware of the Rajnishis, they're the only group other than the as yet at-large Anthrax Mailer to deploy weapons-grade biologicals as a terrorist act in the United States. All those who took part were Americans. Their lead scientist was an American and a woman. One might say this group defied all cuurent stereotypes save one: They were a religious organization.
Ok, eco-terrorists are no better than those they claim to be fighting. As most terrorists. But personally I'm a little more afraid of a suicide bomber blowing up the building I work in than some smelly college kid dowsing my leather jacket with red paint. Actually, there are others I fear more as well. The crazy homeless guy who attacks me because he can't get his meds, the desperate guy who mugs me because he lost his job, the wannabe gang-banger who shoots me for drug money, the religious fanatic who thinks I'm against their God...
In other words, the list goes on, and there are a lot more important things to fear in the world.
The FBI top my list of biggest US threats.
ELF might burn down your new ugly grey suburban house in the middle of construction (or is that house next door? wait, is this even your block? they're so similar).
PETA sneaks cameras into factory farms.
The FBI can wiretap your everything, scan your library records, kidnap you without telling anyone, then send you to Guantanamo where you're promptly transferred to a more torture-friendly abode and kicked to death.
But PETA takes videotapes of chicken abuse! Terrorists!
The article doesn't mention PETA.
But hyperbole is fun.
Actually ELF has the annoying tendency to use plastic 40 gallon drums filled with diesel oil. The diesel is lit off with a specially rigged floating wick that burns long and hot, eventually causing the drum to fail resulting in flaming diesel rushing outwards throughout the structure.
ELF are terrorists. The above is a felony under P.C. 451.
Smelly students with paint are just guilty of misdemeanor assault.
they sound more like arsonists to me.
i think the word terrorist is thrown around a little haphazardly. imo, terrorism includes an element of fear. while ELF's tactics may be alarming, i don't think they invoke the kind of widespread fear that, say, AQ does.
check out the wikipedia definition:
a number of those characteristics don't fit ELF.
Arson isn't the only method used, though it is their favourite. They were tagged as terrorists by the Fed. I can only assume that they use a more specific (read: broad) definition than the one you listed.
They are certainly using intimidation and wanton destruction to further political goals, ignoring or simply failing to use other means before violence. It is very likely that, at some point (if they haven't already) kill someone (firefighters) as "collateral dammage" in one of their raids.
i know i'm splitting hairs here, but the thing that (afaik) ELF is still lacking in order for me to term them terrorists is targeting civilians who have nothing to do with their agenda. afaik, ELF attacks property that is relevant to their agenda.
i can live my life, travel to london and new york, et. al. w/o fear of falling victim to ELF. i cannot say the same about AQ.
Are they really the "biggest" threat?
If this is so, than we ought not be in the middle east.
Again: This was about domestic terrorism. Here in California ELF is a big deal. They've torched entire development projects, labs and businesses.
American civillians are central to AQ's agenda. From their perspective we're all the same.
If you were to pre-buy a home in one of those developments or worked in one of those labs you'd certainly be effected.
I will agree however that in some cases the Fed takes the "Terrorist" label a bit far. Hacking is the classic example. When I was in High School it was fairly harmless (if felonious) to get into millitary and federal systems and poke around, now it's "Data Terrorism".