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1. I didn't deflect. You are posing a hypothetical that will never happen.

2. 2/3's of Alligator Alcatraz's 1800 detainees have been purged off ICE's database and are missing persons. YOU do the math as to where they are. This is from MULTIPLE reliable sources.

3. If we don't lose a nuclear war with Russia the second the Epstein files and rape videos are released, it will be a miracle. Let alone getting to 2028 or the end of 2026 for that matter.
1. What will never happen? Trump not committing genocide or you being rational and objective should your assumptions prove false. It was a pretty reasonable question.

2. Are these the people you think have been subject to mass genocide? Here’s the extract from the Miami Herald…

“could mean that a detainee is still being processed, in the middle of a transfer between two sites or about to be deported.

It’s possible that some of the men who couldn’t be located were still at Alligator Alcatraz. Unlike most immigration detention centers, Alligator Alcatraz is state-run and detainees often do not appear in the database run by the federal agency.”
 
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maybe Apple is doing as little as possible to cooperate with Trump but it honestly won't matter at the end of the day. I believe Silicon Valley tech companies basically turned heel in 2025 because they have agreed to more or less sell their souls for contracts with the state.
 
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Because it will be used by presidents in the future. Unlike the basketball court.
What will be torn down on day one will never be used again. Much like the Hitler bunker ballroom it was based on. Only "uger" [sic].
 
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I’m signing off these forums. I have more important things to do than go back and forth with all of you. Good luck and enjoy.
If you think this is some kind of safe space because, “Apple”, then you don't understand consumers. Apple understands this to be sure.
 
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Apple, donating to this, looks bad, but if it keeps them exempt from the tarriffs and all that, then they got to bend the knee for the benefit of their costumers. I highly doubt Tim Cook personally likes trump or is eager to give him a single penny, but if he wants apple to continue to be the company it is and not have to raise prices on everything it makes, he has to bend the knee to trump for now, pure and simple, and if that means donating to this ego trip of a project, then so be it. I cant fault him for doing it even if i disagree with it.
The real politician here is Tim Cook. The way he’s been able to get out of these political squeezes, and political back-and-forths between Trump and other leaders is honestly impressive.
 
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The real politician here is Tim Cook. The way he’s been able to get out of these political squeezes, and political back-and-forths between Trump and other leaders is honestly impressive.

Not really. He just opens the wallet. Says some kind words. Not like Trump is hard to figure out.
 
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The real politician here is Tim Cook. The way he’s been able to get out of these political squeezes, and political back-and-forths between Trump and other leaders is honestly impressive.
It shows he loves his company and has its best intrists at heart. Deep down i highly doubt Tim enjoys being in the same room as Trump. I bet he personally finds him repulsive as a human being. BUT, hes the top dog at the moment with the power to really hurt apples bottom line, employees and customers, so throwing up a few million here, a few million there (which is pennies to apple) in the hopes that it keeps trumps greasy orange fingers away from grabbing apple by the stem as it were, is good for apple in the long run. They may look like they are kissing the ring of Cheeto Corelone at the moment, but when hes eventually gone, Tim Cook can come out and say we did what we had to do in order to protect our company and our customers at the time from unfair tariffs and price increases.
 
It shows he loves his company and has its best intrists at heart. Deep down i highly doubt Tim enjoys being in the same room as Trump. I bet he personally finds him repulsive as a human being. BUT, hes the top dog at the moment with the power to really hurt apples bottom line, employees and customers, so throwing up a few million here, a few million there (which is pennies to apple) in the hopes that it keeps trumps greasy orange fingers away from grabbing apple by the stem as it were, is good for apple in the long run. They may look like they are kissing the ring of Cheeto Corelone at the moment, but when hes eventually gone, Tim Cook can come out and say we did what we had to do in order to protect our company and our customers at the time from unfair tariffs and price increases.

At some point it's beyond the pale to support a regime doing what it's doing and using "protect our company and our customers at the time from unfair tariffs and price increases" as the cover for it.

There are things more important, eventually, than "price increases for customers".
 
It shows he loves his company and has its best intrists at heart. Deep down i highly doubt Tim enjoys being in the same room as Trump. I bet he personally finds him repulsive as a human being. BUT, hes the top dog at the moment with the power to really hurt apples bottom line, employees and customers, so throwing up a few million here, a few million there (which is pennies to apple) in the hopes that it keeps trumps greasy orange fingers away from grabbing apple by the stem as it were, is good for apple in the long run. They may look like they are kissing the ring of Cheeto Corelone at the moment, but when hes eventually gone, Tim Cook can come out and say we did what we had to do in order to protect our company and our customers at the time from unfair tariffs and price increases.
Imo, Tim Cook is doing what he needs to. The fact that the current president is giving the political system a much needed kick in the pants is not relevant. Tim is protecting Apple and its future.
 
Imo, Tim Cook is doing what he needs to. The fact that the current president is giving the political system a much needed kick in the pants is not relevant. Tim is protecting Apple and its future.
Indeed, it's really simple with public companies. You can just read the scorecard, which is the company's share price. If you care about a long term measure, then look at the performance over a five year period. There is no question that Tim Cook has been a very good CEO. He does his job -- which is not to be a spokesman for "Viva la revolution" crowd at MR.

Having said that, I think he need to reduce the company's manufacturing reliance on China -- which I think he is trying to do.
 
Indeed, it's really simple with public companies. You can just read the scorecard, which is the company's share price. If you care about a long term measure, then look at the performance over a five year period. There is no question that Tim Cook has been a very good CEO. He does his job -- which is not to be a spokesman for "Viva la revolution" crowd at MR.

Having said that, I think he need to reduce the company's manufacturing reliance on China -- which I think he is trying to do.
Heres the problem with that....even after the pandemic, where this proved just how stupid it is to keep all your manufacturing eggs in one basket, where do you go to build things while balancing both fairness and practicality. The whole problem with this situation is that Reagan and his trickle down economics sold out any major manufacturing in the US overseas back in the 80s.

Remember that movie Gung Ho with Michael Keaton when the Japanese bought out the car manufacturing plant and there was a culture clash, well think of that on a global scale.

Trump thinks if you inflict these tariffs it somehow magically brings back manufacturing jobs here in the US and for some industries maybe, but not for the vast majority of them.

Tech companies build their products in China because China allows damn near Railroad Barrons of the 19th century style of manufacturing, which is borderline slave labor for pennies on the dollar, and other countries are just going to do the same.

No american is ever going to work 12-18 hour days building iphones for less then minimum wadge with no real benifits for what Foxcon pays its employees. Period.

You bring all iphone manufacturing here to the US, you dont have enough people willing to work the jobs for the same pay chinese workers will do it for, plus now after decades of doing it this way, you dont have enough skilled labor here to even do the jobs, and the prices go up astronomically.

Its way cheeper to bribe trump with various gifts and donations to his hidious ballroom to just keep the company afloat, buisness as usual. Tim cook is doing his job as best he can given the situation. I cant really fault the guy. I bet you deep down he loaths trump with a passion, but speaking out against him, refusing to bend the knee hurts his bottom line and company.

Ultimately whats going to happen is automation and AI (which allready does half the labor) is going to take over and no one is going to get paid to build these things at all. Doesn't mean they are going to get cheeper though.

Why pay chinese workers pennies on the dollar to build your devices when you can have machines do all the work for free beyond the cost of their installation and mantiance?

Thats the real issue here no one is thinking about long term. Soon there wont even be jobs to build these things because automation will be so efficent and effective there wont be a need for human hands to even be involved.

Thats the real future here and i think tim cook knows that ultimatly. If you have a human building your device, you got to pay them, you got to keep them coming into work somehow and make sure they dont get hurt in the process. You replace the human workforce with all automated machines, who can work ten times as fast, far more efficently, far more easer to mantain or replace, why would you even want a human being on the factory floor outside of making sure the machines do the job itself.

thats the real future, and thats an issue cause if no one has a job because they are all replaced by machines, whos going to buy your products when they cant afford them?
 
Thats the real issue here no one is thinking about long term. Soon there wont even be jobs to build these things because automation will be so efficent and effective there wont be a need for human hands to even be involved.
thats the real future, and thats an issue cause if no one has a job because they are all replaced by machines, whos going to buy your products when they cant afford them?

Excellent points.

It all makes me think ... what is the point of life?

What is actually fulfilling and what are we striving for and prioritizing on a larger scale?

It seems we've done nothing but think about how to structure society (or allow it to be structured) to make the most money and only reward endless growth.

Those are not goals with any necessarily logical or healthy endpoints for humans ourselves.
 
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Heres the problem with that....even after the pandemic, where this proved just how stupid it is to keep all your manufacturing eggs in one basket, where do you go to build things while balancing both fairness and practicality. The whole problem with this situation is that Reagan and his trickle down economics sold out any major manufacturing in the US overseas back in the 80s.

Remember that movie Gung Ho with Michael Keaton when the Japanese bought out the car manufacturing plant and there was a culture clash, well think of that on a global scale.

Trump thinks if you inflict these tariffs it somehow magically brings back manufacturing jobs here in the US and for some industries maybe, but not for the vast majority of them.

Tech companies build their products in China because China allows damn near Railroad Barrons of the 19th century style of manufacturing, which is borderline slave labor for pennies on the dollar, and other countries are just going to do the same.

No american is ever going to work 12-18 hour days building iphones for less then minimum wadge with no real benifits for what Foxcon pays its employees. Period.

You bring all iphone manufacturing here to the US, you dont have enough people willing to work the jobs for the same pay chinese workers will do it for, plus now after decades of doing it this way, you dont have enough skilled labor here to even do the jobs, and the prices go up astronomically.

Its way cheeper to bribe trump with various gifts and donations to his hidious ballroom to just keep the company afloat, buisness as usual. Tim cook is doing his job as best he can given the situation. I cant really fault the guy. I bet you deep down he loaths trump with a passion, but speaking out against him, refusing to bend the knee hurts his bottom line and company.

Ultimately whats going to happen is automation and AI (which allready does half the labor) is going to take over and no one is going to get paid to build these things at all. Doesn't mean they are going to get cheeper though.

Why pay chinese workers pennies on the dollar to build your devices when you can have machines do all the work for free beyond the cost of their installation and mantiance?

Thats the real issue here no one is thinking about long term. Soon there wont even be jobs to build these things because automation will be so efficent and effective there wont be a need for human hands to even be involved.

Thats the real future here and i think tim cook knows that ultimatly. If you have a human building your device, you got to pay them, you got to keep them coming into work somehow and make sure they dont get hurt in the process. You replace the human workforce with all automated machines, who can work ten times as fast, far more efficently, far more easer to mantain or replace, why would you even want a human being on the factory floor outside of making sure the machines do the job itself.

thats the real future, and thats an issue cause if no one has a job because they are all replaced by machines, whos going to buy your products when they cant afford them?
Two problems here: (1) Reagan's and Trump's economic policies are exactly opposite, one stood for free and open markets and the other for a gated economy with barriers to promote domestic labor (a traditional Democrat position btw) ... yet you manage to criticize both of them. Seems political. (2) As it relates to my actual comment/post, my position is based on national security -- not economics. Allowing a hostile nation to control critical manufacturing processes is a dangerous position for Apple, let alone the country, in light of the growing possibility of war over Taiwan and other Chinese provocations.
 
[…]

Thats the real issue here no one is thinking about long term. Soon there wont even be jobs to build these things because automation will be so efficent and effective there wont be a need for human hands to even be involved.

[…]
Win win. The jobs that exist to build these phones don’t need to exist. As people claim it’s “slaver labor” the win win is these jobs that are people claim are drudgery can be deployed elsewhere.
 
Imo, Tim Cook is doing what he needs to. The fact that the current president is giving the political system a much needed kick in the pants is not relevant. Tim is protecting Apple and its future.

Americans are the only people still trying to use an 18th century political system to run a 21st century society. Trump's response is basically trying to revert back a 14th century political system. That will not protect anyone's future.
 
Americans are the only people still trying to use an 18th century political system to run a 21st century society. Trump's response is basically trying to revert back a 14th century political system. That will not protect anyone's future.
The way things were going wasn’t protecting anybody’s future either.
 
Americans are the only people still trying to use an 18th century political system to run a 21st century society. Trump's response is basically trying to revert back a 14th century political system. That will not protect anyone's future.
The American political process, an outgrowth of the late Enlightment and advanced by some of the greatest students of political science ever, is actually the highest form of governmental structure, which has been proven time anf time again in subsequent centuries.

In addition, there are plently of earlier political structures currently still in place in many areas of the world (like the Middle East and Russia just to name a few), which are known as structurally autocratic regimes and solely owe their legitimacy from power derived from control of natural resources. Other more recent political structures, like evidenced in China and parts of Europe are not a step forward in either advancing the general welfare or promoting economic growth as these governments require centralization, goverment largesse and a dimishment of individual liberty rights to function ... hardly good measures for freedom loving people.

Also, I think you give Trump too much credit if you actually think he is trying to change the American form of goverment into a European style monarchy although his design choices for the Oval Office may lend credibility to that argument at least in style.
 
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The American political process, an outgrowth of the late Enlightment and advanced by some of the greatest students of political science ever, is actually the highest form of governmental structure, which has been proven time anf time again in subsequent centuries.

In addition, there are plently of earlier political structures currently still in place in many areas of the world (like the Middle East and Russia just to name a few), which are known as structurally autocratic regimes and solely owe their legitimacy from power derived from control of natural resources. Other more recent political structures, like evidenced in China and parts of Europe are not a step forward in either advancing the general welfare or promoting economic growth as these governments require centralization, goverment largesse and a dimishment of individual liberty rights to function ... hardly good measures for freedom loving people.

Also, I think you give Trump too much credit if you actually think he is trying to change the American form of goverment into a European style monarchy although his design choices for the Oval Office may lend credibility to that argument at least in style.

This is a wholly risible post and reflects the abysmal state of contemporary American education. You should be ashamed.

Reasonable people have moved on since the late Enlightenment, which, among other things, permitted slavery and all sorts of horrible excesses. Why anyone would want to base their entire political system on ideas from 200 years ago is crazy.

The American system of government is comically bad — it basically exists just to prevent getting things done. Worse, it's a presidential system, and those are known to be problematic. Parliamentary systems are superior in almost every way. For example, even Canada has a better government than yours.

In rational countries, people change their political system when it is no longer fit for purpose. For example, my own country switched its electoral system by public referendum because the old system was causing problems. But you guys just won't because you're convinced you have the perfect system of government, when in fact it sucks, is inefficient, and results in a worse standard of living than most of the genuine democracies.

What's even funnier is that you go on about the evils of kings, when the US president is essentially an elected monarch with much of the powers (and even more in some cases) of an 18th century king – after which the position was basically modelled. George III, for example, had far less power than the president does. American declarations that the president isn't a king just shows you don't know much about the history of kings.

Other countries basically reduced their kings' powers to nothing or got rid of their kings — you lot have still got one. And yet you try to lecture other countries about the evils of kings...
 
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This is a wholly risible post and reflects the abysmal state of contemporary American education. You should be ashamed.

Reasonable people have moved on since the late Enlightenment, which, among other things, permitted slavery and all sorts of horrible excesses. Why anyone would want to base their entire political system on ideas from 200 years ago is crazy.

The American system of government is comically bad — it basically exists just to prevent getting things done. Worse, it's a presidential system, and those are known to be problematic. Parliamentary systems are superior in almost every way. For example, even Canada has a better government than yours.

In rational countries, people change their political system when it is no longer fit for purpose. For example, my own country switched its electoral system by public referendum because the old system was causing problems. But you guys just won't because you're convinced you have the perfect system of government, when in fact it sucks, is inefficient, and results in a worse standard of living than most of the genuine democracies.

What's even funnier is that you go on about the evils of kings, when the US president is essentially an elected monarch with much of the powers (and even more in some cases) of an 18th century king – after which the position was basically modelled. George III, for example, had far less power than the president does. Other countries basically reduced their kings' powers to nothing or got rid of their kings — you lot have still got one. And yet you try to lecture other countries about the evils of kings...
Nothing you wrote is persuasive in the least. Your argument never even gets off the ground for two obvious defects: (1) it is premised on an unambiguous logical fallacy, which is known as the appeal to age/fallacy of age (in your case) (i.e., what is old is bad because it is old) and (2) you only present only one weak substantive point to undercut American governance, which is slavery -- an institution rooted in antiquity (not the Enlightenment) and practiced in one form or another everwhere regardless of politcal structure. Even more recent forms of goverment developed in China, the Soviet Union,Cuba, etc. all have employed slavery/forced labor as matter of state policy. It also ignores the fact that slavery is not legal in the United States, which fought a war to rid itself of it, and the abolitionst movements in Europe only preceded that the American Civil war by a few decades -- hardly a relevant point to uncut a form of goverment.

So, yes, the United States goverment, with all its checks and balances and divded goverment and individual rights protections is a supperior form of goverment to those parliamentary systems that are known for gridlock, bureacratic/legislative group-think, inefficiency, political instability, and govermental coalitions that specifically platforms radical ideologies as part of the governing structure. And Canada? Get real. The Canadian government, with all due respect and love, has not produced a strong national leader, let alone world leader ... ever.
 
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