Apple Recognizes the Right-Click, Finally


nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,551
1,186
And OS 9 had full support.

"lags behind other multibutton mice in functionality and ergonomics"

Well some of us LIKE Apple's shape and find it more comfortable... and a scroll ball is hardly lagging in function. It's just personal preference. If you prefer those big tree-stump mice that are all the rage these days, they work great on Mac and always have.
 

angelwatt

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
7,842
7
USA
don't blame the mouse

She shouldn't have wasted so much time complaining about how the mighty mouse works in Firefox. The issues of it causing Firefox to go to a next or previous page is something that exist in Firefox and isn't the result of the mighty mouse or osx. The issue can also be resolved quite easily with a fairly simple change. I had come across the fix when I started using iScroll2 which lets laptops do 2-finger scrolling on the laptops.

The fix can be found here fo those who would like to use it:
http://www-users.kawo2.rwth-aachen.de/~razzfazz/iscroll2/

Or you can just do a google search for iscroll2 and firefox and you'll find it.

Her mentioning of its lack of functionality is also a somewhat trademark to keep things simple for users. She should view it as a positive aspect rather than negative.
 

Lacero

macrumors 604
Jan 20, 2005
6,639
2
Apple had been living in La La Land for quite some time. Finally they've smarten up to the fact 99% of computer users prefer the option of a right-click mouse.
 

Earendil

macrumors 68000
Oct 27, 2003
1,546
0
Washington
Lacero said:
Apple had been living in La La Land for quite some time. Finally they've smarten up to the fact 99% of computer users prefer the option of a right-click mouse.
Uhh, that's pretty much incorrect on many many levels. 6 people in my family, and 3 of them don't use the right click, not even in the control-click way. the 4th one only uses it for games.

Granted my family has been using Macs forever, and right clicking isn't as important. Perhaps I'll take a poll here at my dorm, see how many of the 18-23 y.o. are using the right click. Could be interesting, but I'd bet my powerbook it's no where close to 99%, even in the young I-grew-up-with-computers crowd.
 

ham_man

macrumors 68020
Jan 21, 2005
2,265
0
Lacero said:
Apple had been living in La La Land for quite some time. Finally they've smarten up to the fact 99% of computer users prefer the option of a right-click mouse.
Ever heard of cmd?
 

Nermal

Moderator
Staff member
Dec 7, 2002
18,678
1,183
New Zealand
Yet at the same time, you can use the Command key to perform most right-click functions, such as Cmd-I instead of right-click, Get Info.
 

nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,551
1,186
Perhaps the only "breakthrough" that would please some people is if Apple pulled a Microsoft and started REQUIRING right-clicks for basic tasks ;)

99% of people are used to Microsoft's ways, no doubt. But to 99% of people truly want to be REQUIRED to use the right button for basic tasks? In Mac OS X, right-click menus are optional shortcuts--very handy--but never the primary method for anything basic and common. I find it hard not to like that approach.
 

Tinhead

macrumors member
Oct 25, 2004
43
0
nagromme said:
Perhaps the only "breakthrough" that would please some people is if Apple pulled a Microsoft and started REQUIRING right-clicks for basic tasks ;)

99% of people are used to Microsoft's ways, no doubt. But to 99% of people truly want to be REQUIRED to use the right button for basic tasks? In Mac OS X, right-click menus are optional shortcuts--very handy--but never the primary method for anything basic and common. I find it hard not to like that approach.
This would be the ideal situation, sadly though there are several actions in many of OS X's apps (like the Finder or iTunes) that indeed require right/control-clicking. It's not as bad as in Windows, but Apple should get their consistency together nevertheless. OS X is so close to being there every small misstep in usability catches the eye (compared to Windows anyway).

Personally, I would love to see something in the dev tools that would only allow to use menu options in contextual menus that are already defined in the main menu bar. Of course, this kind of strict ruling would probably be considered as a limitation by developers.

Lots of people complain about the right-clicking on Macs. I like to think of OS X as an OS that has full one-button mouse support as a feature. Everything more should be optional and preference.
 

narco

macrumors 65816
Dec 9, 2003
1,155
0
California.
I actually turned off the right button of my mighty mouse. I've used a one-button mouse for so long and rarely need the contextual menus, so it's no big deal. I'm happy with the scroll wheel alone -- I have that button set to Expose and is much easier than creating an Expose hotspot.

The problems with the scroll wheel and Firefox is the reason why I deactivated the horizontal scroll. Hopefully someone fixes it.

Fishes,
narco.
 

winmacguy

macrumors 68020
Nov 8, 2003
2,237
0
New Zealand
Earendil said:
Uhh, that's pretty much incorrect on many many levels. 6 people in my family, and 3 of them don't use the right click, not even in the control-click way. the 4th one only uses it for games.

Granted my family has been using Macs forever, and right clicking isn't as important. Perhaps I'll take a poll here at my dorm, see how many of the 18-23 y.o. are using the right click. Could be interesting, but I'd bet my powerbook it's no where close to 99%, even in the young I-grew-up-with-computers crowd.
All of the guys and girls in our studio (20 people) use a 2 button PC mouse on their Macs. I am the only one who uses a Mac mouse. The PC users naturally have 2 button mice :rolleyes:
 

Mainyehc

macrumors 6502a
Mar 14, 2004
589
121
Lisbon, Portugal
winmacguy said:
All of the guys and girls in our studio (20 people) use a 2 button PC mouse on their Macs. I am the only one who uses a Mac mouse. The PC users naturally have 2 button mice :rolleyes:
Yep, I'm a switcher, and as such, I also have a 3rd party 2-button mouse (soon to be replaced with a Mighty Mouse ;) ), but that's because I'm a power user, just like those people you're talking about... as for the other part of those 99%:

Lacero said:
Apple had been living in La La Land for quite some time. Finally they've smarten up to the fact 99% of computer users prefer the option of a right-click mouse.
I think you're exaggerating. I know A LOT of Windows users who get confused by the simple concept of right-clicking, let alone by doing it... That's why I think there's no universal input method for pointing devices, which means Apple is clearly the leader as far as choice is concerned. Especially now that every new Mac will ship with a Mighty Mouse, with the right button disabled by default. And that should keep forcing developers to comply with Apple's HIG, let's just hope...
 

cwtnospam

macrumors regular
Sep 4, 2004
148
0
Mainyehc said:
I think you're exaggerating. I know A LOT of Windows users who get confused by the simple concept of right-clicking, let alone by doing it... That's why I think there's no universal input method for pointing devices, which means Apple is clearly the leader as far as choice is concerned. Especially now that every new Mac will ship with a Mighty Mouse, with the right button disabled by default. And that should keep forcing developers to comply with Apple's HIG, let's just hope...
I agree. I think Apple has given in to a loud and influential minority. If they ever want to make any headway getting into corporations they need to appease the IT departments, and a two button mouse is a first step.

Now Apple only needs to make the OS difficult to use and maintain, and the IT world will love them. :D
 

Photorun

macrumors 65816
Sep 1, 2003
1,216
0
NYC
Earendil said:
Uhh, that's pretty much incorrect on many many levels. 6 people in my family, and 3 of them don't use the right click, not even in the control-click way. the 4th one only uses it for games.

Granted my family has been using Macs forever, and right clicking isn't as important. Perhaps I'll take a poll here at my dorm, see how many of the 18-23 y.o. are using the right click. Could be interesting, but I'd bet my powerbook it's no where close to 99%, even in the young I-grew-up-with-computers crowd.
Most the people in the two design shops I've worked for and most professional designers I know not only like right-click, but feel it's required, especially for Macromedia Dreamweaver, but it's damn helpful in Photoshop. Sure you can use the control key but that's a pain in the arse, why would I want to move my left hand when I can more quickly simply drop my ring finger that is already on the mouse. If you like a single button mouse (clearly you're not a power user but whatever) be happy there still is one, but the majority of people I know, power users and gamers on the Mac demand and use two button mice. My girlfriend's first action after switching, buying an iMac G5, was to toss her one button mouse for a two button mouse (sadly she bought a Microsoft Intellimouse), her reason? It's easier to use a two button mouse. Indeed.
 

whocares

macrumors 65816
Oct 9, 2002
1,496
0
:noitаɔo˩
Nermal said:
Yet at the same time, you can use the Command key to perform most right-click functions, such as Cmd-I instead of right-click, Get Info.
Which is all the beauty of a 1 button mouse... My one button mouse has at least 9 buttons just in Finder:
Ctrl+click: menu
Cmd+click: select multiple files
Option+click+drag: copy file
Cmd+drag: move an icon in window and don't snap it to grid
Option+Cmd+click+drag: make an alias
Option+double click: open folder in new window and close old window (good in OS 9)
Cmd+double click: open folder in new window, keep old window
Cmd+drag window: drag and inactive window and don't activate it
Cmd+click on window name: get path to window (works in all apps)
etc.
etc.

Don't even get me started on Photoshop :p

The only think lacking on a 1 button Apple mouse is a scroll wheel.
 

whocares

macrumors 65816
Oct 9, 2002
1,496
0
:noitаɔo˩
Photorun said:
Most the people in the two design shops I've worked for and most professional designers I know not only like right-click, but feel it's required, especially for Macromedia Dreamweaver, but it's damn helpful in Photoshop. Sure you can use the control key but that's a pain in the arse, why would I want to move my left hand (...)
Because it's handy to have your left hand neer the ctrl key to access tools (cmd + letter), zoom in and out (cmd+click and opt+cmd+click), move around the picture (space bar+drag), etc. etc. ;)
 

simX

macrumors 6502a
May 28, 2002
755
0
Bay Area, CA
Photorun said:
Most the people in the two design shops I've worked for and most professional designers I know not only like right-click, but feel it's required, especially for Macromedia Dreamweaver, but it's damn helpful in Photoshop. Sure you can use the control key but that's a pain in the arse, why would I want to move my left hand when I can more quickly simply drop my ring finger that is already on the mouse. If you like a single button mouse (clearly you're not a power user but whatever) be happy there still is one, but the majority of people I know, power users and gamers on the Mac demand and use two button mice. My girlfriend's first action after switching, buying an iMac G5, was to toss her one button mouse for a two button mouse (sadly she bought a Microsoft Intellimouse), her reason? It's easier to use a two button mouse. Indeed.
I dunno. It's all a matter of use. I find that the only time where I would find a multi-button mouse would add to my experience is with games.

When I use the computer, I try to keep both hands on the keyboard at all times, because it's faster. (When I'm at school and not at my regular computer, I login to my two webmails by going Command-L, type address, press return, Command-T, Command-L, type second address, press return, Command-Shift-Left Arrow, type login credentials, press return, Command-Shift-Right Arrow, type login credentials, press return, etc.)

Since both hands are usually on the keyboard, my left hand is just naturally there to hit the control key with my left pinky finger when I move my right hand to the mouse (and the same would be true for lefties). And when it's not there, both hands are usually off doing something else, in which case it takes the same amount of time to move both hands to do a control-click as it does to move one hand to do a second-button-click.

So to me, control-clicking is really as natural as right-clicking. I would consider myself to be more of a power user than many of my friends who use multi-button mice, because I really know how to use the interface with the keyboard AND the mouse. Multi-button mice are not easier -- they're just an expensive excuse for 1) a poor interface on Windows, 2) switchers, and 3) gaming. Not to say that there's not a market for multi-button mice, but I think it's a fallacy that multi-button mice are easier to use.
 

Earendil

macrumors 68000
Oct 27, 2003
1,546
0
Washington
Photorun said:
Most the people in the two design shops I've worked for and most professional designers I know not only like right-click, but feel it's required, especially for Macromedia Dreamweaver, but it's damn helpful in Photoshop. Sure you can use the control key but that's a pain in the arse, why would I want to move my left hand when I can more quickly simply drop my ring finger that is already on the mouse.
You're talking about power users here, you're talking about 0.0001% of the computer using population. You're talking about people that when they buy a new computer, a small accessory like a multi button mouse is a small increase in price. You example is a poor representation of the computer using population. And I don't know about you, but when I'm using Photoshop and Macromedia Flash I tend to have my left hand on the keyboard for all the shortcuts... But that's just me. I don't actually use control click though as I have a multi button mouse...which leads me to your next speal.

If you like a single button mouse (clearly you're not a power user but whatever) be happy there still is one, but the majority of people I know, power users and gamers on the Mac demand and use two button mice. My girlfriend's first action after switching, buying an iMac G5, was to toss her one button mouse for a two button mouse (sadly she bought a Microsoft Intellimouse), her reason? It's easier to use a two button mouse. Indeed.
I'm going to take a little offense at that first assumption, and then how you used it to make a jab at my computing ability. But you know what they say about people that ASSuME. I'm current a Computer Science Student at Whitworth college, I intern at a high tech UAV company, own a Powerbook with a duel monitor set up, am Photo editor for our college paper, and might have taken a few classes here and there involving computers. Personally I run my setup with a 4 button Kensington trackball, that is mapped to 6 keys/commands.
However, I am well aware that I am not the average computer user, and that I represent a very small % of the computer using population.
 

mkubal

macrumors 6502a
Jul 22, 2002
557
0
Tampa
whocares said:
The only think lacking on a 1 button Apple mouse is a scroll wheel.
Well, that and a right click. ;)

I used a one button until a few years ago when I realized how much I was using control click and how much time I could save by just right clicking. I haven't looked back since and using a single button now feels strange to me.
 

SiliconAddict

macrumors 603
Jun 19, 2003
5,889
0
Chicago, IL
jholzner said:
Right clicking has been supported in OS X since 10.0.

Supported yes. Recognized no. ctrl click is for all intents and purposes a hidden feature that anyone new to the platform is NOT going to know about unless they stumble across it.

I think of Apple's behavior like the UN or the US government not recognizing x leader of a foreign nation. The man may be in power but that recognition is critical to giving that leader and his gov credibility. Of course in this case its like the UN (PC) recognizing him years ago with the US (Apple) holding out until a few months back.

PS- Don't make this into a political thing. It was just an example.