argh why doesn't the Airport Extreme or the Time Capsule have a built in modem?!

Discussion in 'Mac Accessories' started by animatedude, Sep 27, 2010.

  1. animatedude macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2010
    #1
    i know Internet Service Providers give away modem or routers these day but wouldn't be best if Apple made an Airport Extreme or Time Capsule with a built-in modems?

    if you check people questions on apple.com you will see have half of them want to know how to switch off the wireless connection on their Linksys and let Airport Extreme do that...and the other half doesn't even know what Airport Extreme is for..

    i know Apple has a habit of getting rid of stuff but anyone else agree this will drive Airport Extreme sales up? it would be the ultimate connection device for macs and no need for additional router..
     
  2. miles01110 macrumors Core

    miles01110

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    The Ivory Tower (I'm not coming down)
    #2
    If Apple included a modem you'd only be able to connect to an Apple-controlled VLAN that only displayed approved websites. No thanks.
     
  3. PurdueGuy macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2010
    #3
    Which modem? Dialup? Glad they dropped it.

    And I hate the bundled wireless/cable/dsl modems. I just bypass it.

    The moment you tell tech support your router is Apple-branded, they usually say "sorry, not supported." So I doubt they'd support a DSL/cable modem, even though it would probably work better than the company provided one!
     
  4. ilkhan4 macrumors newbie

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    Sep 28, 2009
    #4
    What type of modem would they include? DSL? What if you only have cable in your area? Or satellite? Or 4G? Or fixed-based wireless (like me)? FIOS? There are just too many different kinds of "last-mile" networking technologies for Apple to support all of them.
     
  5. gianly1985 macrumors 6502a

    gianly1985

    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    #5
    Yeah, it sucks. But otherwise, Apple would have to build tens of different versions of the AEBS. And provide support for tons of scenarios in tens of countries and ISPs.

    Anyway, about DSL (i think maybe the most common "last mile" technology in rich countries, but I may be wrong) if you pick up an ADSL modem and set it up in "bridge mode", it would be like having it integrated in the AEBS. The AEBS will take care of the PPPoE connection.

    If your ISP only support PPPoA (and not PPPoE), you will have to find an ADSL modem with the "half bridge mode", which means the modem will do a PPPoA to PPPoE "conversion" (kinda) and the AEBS will connect using PPPoE. (at least this is what i read around)

    These 2 scenarios are the closest thing to having an integrated DSL modem inside the AEBS/TC.

    Other scenarios may create double dhcp, double NAT, double rainbows, port forwarding issues, game console problems, impossibility to create a Guest Network, etc. But also may not. Depends on how you configure the 2 devices (modem/modem-router and AEBS).
     
  6. Nermal Moderator

    Nermal

    Staff Member

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    New Zealand
    #6
    I'm using half bridge (PPPoA connection). The result out of the modem is a "direct connection" with your public IP address, so no messing around with PPPoE is required. You just get the AEBS to share the connection. It works well and knocked about 20 ms off my latency.
     
  7. gianly1985 macrumors 6502a

    gianly1985

    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    #7
    I see.
    I didn't know about the details, I just had this post in mind:

    http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=7998751&postcount=10

    I don't have any actual experience with PPPoA and half bridge mode.

    Edit: also, the last post here:

    http://forums.macnn.com/92/networking/348371/airport-extreme-base-station-adsl2-modems/

    and this:

    http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=10995670
     
  8. animatedude thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Feb 27, 2010
  9. Vylen macrumors 65816

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    Sydney, Australia
    #9
    +1...

    And making multiple versions to address any of these types of connections would probably end up resulting in them losing more money.
     
  10. PurdueGuy macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2010
    #10
    Then that would overkill for thousands on cable, or like myself on FIOS.

    The only option would be to have 3 SKUs
    - regular
    - DSL
    - cable modem

    Aside form compatibility issues (which are HUGE), there are support issues, and having 2 extra SKUs adds to the cost. I used to not think that extra SKU was a big deal, but friends of mine in manufacturing and design have beat it into me that those costs are very real.
     
  11. Nermal Moderator

    Nermal

    Staff Member

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    New Zealand
    #11
    Very much so. I've seen an issue where someone tried to use a UK-purchased DSL modem in NZ and ended up with a working connection but very high latency. Each network has its own little quirks and it can be very difficult to make one device that works with everything.

    Even the modem I use now, which is only sold in NZ and Australia, has different firmware for both countries due to the network differences.
     
  12. mulo macrumors 68020

    mulo

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    Behind you
    #12
    all the old stuff aside, fiber optics? :D
     
  13. Thunderhawks Suspended

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    #13
    You can bet on it that his set up (ISP modem and router) will eventually be replaced by a uniform standard/solution.

    As technology evolves it will HAVE TO address faster through put decoding, etc., thus they'll need to revisit what they are doing.
     
  14. gianly1985 macrumors 6502a

    gianly1985

    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    #14
    Interesting post about the RFC 1483 protocol ("bridge mode"):

    http://www.farside.org.uk/200903/ipoeoatm
     
  15. animatedude thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Feb 27, 2010
    #15
    YEAH MAN! that's what i'm talking about...i'm surprised Apple still didn't do that.at least they can release one with the most popular connection ports which i assume DSL is one of them....

    i tell you half of the questions at apple.com is about people confused between their ISP routers and their Time Capsule and AEP.
     
  16. PurdueGuy macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2010
    #16
    Luckily, at least Verzion, provides an ONT (Optical Network Terminal) so it's just cat5 out (if you have them set it up that way!)
     
  17. animatedude thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Feb 27, 2010
    #17
    i still think AirPort Extreme with built-in DSL or Cable modem will save most of us headaches and will make ISP consider providing Airport Extreme to its customers which equals more sales for everyone.
     
  18. radiogoober macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 7, 2011
    #18
    I think it's a horrible idea. Completely unnecessary.
     
  19. animatedude thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Feb 27, 2010
    #19
    i just don't like the fact of having 2 devices when 1 can do all! if you check apple forum or even this forum you will notice most Qs about the Airport Extreme are Qs about "how can i connect it to my router" blah blah

    Hey Apple! most of your users (at least in Europe and The Middle East) are connected to DSL connection, release an Airport Extreme or Time Capsule with built-in DSL modem....most of us will buy it.

    i know ISPs will buy it from you to offer it to their customers.
     
  20. radiogoober macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 7, 2011
    #20
    It's a horrible idea.
     
  21. blueroom macrumors 603

    blueroom

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    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    #21
    Agreed. Add DOCSIS to the mix and you've got even more models.
     
  22. radiogoober macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 7, 2011
    #22
    Yup. And why not make a model that has a built in 2400 baud modem that can only dial AOL? :) And another model for CompuServe.
     
  23. blueroom macrumors 603

    blueroom

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    Feb 15, 2009
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    #23
    Our local ISP (Rogers) sells an all in one DOCSIS 3.0 router.

    Presenting the craptacular 802.11n draft! SMC gateway with non Gigabit Ethernet (seriously awful router).
    [​IMG]
    Most folks that get them turn off the router function and it becomes little more than a large, hot, wired modem that needs a router.

    To make matters worse Rogers does not offer a DOSCIC 3.0 stand alone modem nor is it easy / possible to get them to enable a third party modem.
     
  24. radiogoober macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 7, 2011
    #24
    I wnat a model that has NetZero and Renegade BBS software built in!
     
  25. BrianBaughn macrumors 601

    BrianBaughn

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    Feb 13, 2011
    Location:
    Baltimore, Maryland
    #25
    It would be better if your internet provider could just give you an reliable ethernet connection ready to go with no modem at all but that ain't gonna happen, either.
     

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