Backlash against the LINOs

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Thomas Veil, Jun 9, 2010.

  1. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #1
    Huh. No sooner do I mention Howard Dean in another thread, then he shows up in one of two articles about a burgeoning progressive backlash against the Democrats in Congress.

    (Yeah, I hate terms like RINO and LINO too, but for the moment it's good enough for shorthand.)

    Anyway. Here's article the first:

    The backlash ended up hitting Nancy Pelosi yesterday. Article the second:

    Of course, the theme that ties these together is that these people are royally pissed at Democrats for not being liberal enough. I've heard that a lot in Coffee Party meetings, but it's refreshing to hear it coming from a national stage.

    It's hard to believe that to date there's been so little liberal pushback against the Blue Dogs and the Tea Party. So this was good to hear, and I hope we hear more and more of it. And I hope Obama and the Dems are listening.
     
  2. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #2
    This is good. I've told you already that gay political groups have shifted their focus as well. The Democratic Party as a whole is not getting our support anymore until they start doing something. Individual candidates are supported though.
     
  3. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #3
    Obama is making a hard play to the middle in order to force the Republican Party even further to the right - specifically the fringe right. And frankly, it seems to be working quite well. In theory, that would make a majority of the voters prefer the Democratic candidate.

    The problem with that plan is that it's going to be even more difficult to attain any sort of unity within the Democratic Party.
     
  4. Shivetya macrumors 65816

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    #4
    He has a long long push ahead of him... and its his party that is running from him so he has to move to center to get back to them.

    Unify the party of "me me me"? LOL.
     
  5. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    #5
    He is in the center. The democrats who are unhappy with him are the far-left and the conservatives. (Far-left in terms of American politics.)
     
  6. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #6
    Hate to break it to you, but that could easily be applied to both sides of the aisle.
     
  7. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #7
    Oh please. That would be your party.
     
  8. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #8
    The alternative is a Republican candidate if you don't support a democratic one. At least the democratic candidates will say they are for equal gay rights (and do nothing about it) as opposed to openly opposing it. (then again im not sure there is much difference).
     
  9. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #9
    Did you read my post? I said that individual candidates are supported, just NOT the Democratic Party as a whole.

    So- instead of sending money to the Democratic Party, it gets sent to individual Democratic candidates. Much smarter, don't you think?
     
  10. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    #10
    My "perfect" president would NEVER get elected. I have to deal with reality.
     
  11. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #11
    I agree. I support Obama, even though I'm fairly far to the left of him. I can appreciate his pragmatic* approach to getting things done.

    *pragmatic...and not somewhat frustratingly naiive and idealistic. Then again, so am I.
     
  12. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #12
    Same boat here, though I wish on certain things he would push harder.
     
  13. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #13
    I adopted a similar strategy, but lately it's made we wonder if any of the causes I care about are actually better off with Obama in the Oval Office.

    Almost nothing has been done the way that the 2008 primary voters expected. Primary Obama was much further to the left, and while it's normal for candidates to drift to center during the general election, our current Obama has shifted to the right.

    I brought this up during the healthcare debates (in one of the mega threads): I think Obama has no idea how to lead. Now I don't mean lead in the presidential sense, because I think he's by far one of the most competent presidents we've ever had, I mean it in a controlling the message kind of way. For most of his presidency, Obama has let the GOP, BP, Tea nuts, and Congress do the talking for him. That really is a shame, because by not controlling the message, he's let himself be led astray. Now he chases after "the middle" instead of producing good solutions and forcing more people into the middle. If FDR, Johnson, Nixon, Reagan, and Clinton could do it, why can't Obama?

    The worst part of all this is the sense of futility it creates for a lot of people who expected more. We can't abandon Obama now for one reason, and one reason only: Supreme Court. Whoever wins the Presidency in 2012 will shape the Supreme Court for a good 20 years, and we just can't have Scalia-style judicial activism for that long.
     
  14. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #14
    Has Obama got all his administration appointments through yet?
     
  15. Thomas Veil thread starter macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #15
    Absolutely right. For somebody who was so eloquent and forceful during the campaign, he sure is quiet now.

    I think he sees this as "the campaign's over, time to shut up, roll up your sleeves, and get to work." And he's right in theory. However, the right never stops promoting itself; they keep up a continual, relentless attack. Obama can't just sit there and take it; nor can he always leave the Democratic PR work to Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid or whoever...because frankly they suck at it as well.

    Take this BP situation. Many former presidents, on either side of the aisle, would have already been on TV with an evening address to the nation, explaining the status of the situation and what he's doing about it.

    The last time I recall Obama taking to TV like this was after the health care bill passed, and even then, he was on at something like midnight.
     
  16. fivepoint macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #16
    Seriously? Wow. You guys can talk yourselves into anything! :D



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    Bottom line... the more Barry and the liberals show their true colors, the more the American public dislikes them and fears for our country if they get their way. Common sense voters realize that our country is spinning deeper and deeper into destructive debt and that someone who really cares and is willing to make the hard decisions is what's necessary to make significant change. They're realizing that Obama is just a worse version of Bush, spending more, growing government more, all the while escalating the war in Afghanistan (now the longest war in American history), keeping Guantanamo open, and supporting the Patriot Act and FISA. Barry is a disaster of a president and liberals are a disaster of a fiscal governing body. Lets' just hope that they don't simply get replaced by neo-cons with basically the same worldview. Let's hope we get real conservatives in place that will lower governmental burden, balance the budget, and allow business and entrepreneurship (i.e. prosperity) to flourish in America once again!
     
  17. CaptMurdock macrumors 6502a

    CaptMurdock

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    #17
    Hate to tell you this, fivey, but the GOP forced most of the "real" conservatives out long ago. You got either your neocons or your bats-in-the-belfry fringe teabaggers who have forgotten the lessons of 2006 and 2008: the harder right you campaign, the more you're going to lose.

    Happy voting!
     
  18. fivepoint macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #18
    Oh, you don't need to convince me that the Republican party is full of a bunch of neo-cons (hawkish, religious, liberals essentially). You're so far off base on 2006 and 2008 though, it isn't even funny. If you think John McCain is a conservative, you're more confused that I thought. Americans are waking up to the message of small government, big liberty, and the constitution. The libertarian/conservative message is transforming the country we live in as evidenced by the Tea Party and many recent nominations/votes. Americans know that big spending liberal action is what got us into this mess, and that bigger spending, more liberal action won't get us out. The polling data demonstrates this.

    Liberals in this country are in big trouble, and they know it. Hopefully the anger transfers over to the fake conservatives as well. The George Bush's and John McCains of the world who only talk about the constitution and small government when it suits them best, and forget it as soon as their pet projects are on the table.

    Look at when the Republicans actually campaigned as conservatives, Reagan, Contract with America, etc. They DOMINATE. Conservatives only lose when they don't govern as they campaign. Liberals lose when they govern the same as they campaign because reality is so grossly split from their dream world.
     
  19. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #19
    I agree entirely. I like the guy, but damn is he crappy at controlling the message. My guess is that he thought things like killing grandma were so ludicrous that they would naturally be laughed away by the American public. My best guess is he vastly overestimates the American people's critical thinking skills and sense of logic.

    Edit: We're still going with the Reagan was the perfect "conservative" president crap? What is with his supporters and reality that they can't handle?
     
  20. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #20
    Like that whack job Sharron Angle they just trotted out. Moderates don't vote for idiots like that- and getting the moderates' vote is what gets you elected.

    Keep putting these kinds of candidates forward, Republicans! Please! :)

    And who said Reagan was the perfect conservative? Wow- he was far from it. Libertarians should hate Reagan.
     
  21. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #21
    I just hope Ayn Rand Paul goes down in KY. He's the only nutjob they've put up that seems to actually have a shot.
     
  22. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #22
    He's even more bats*** than his dad.
     
  23. Thomas Veil thread starter macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #23
    It's funny that you can say this and then turn around and lay out a couple of alternate-universe posts. To wit:

    If by that you mean that Obama and the Dems aren't as liberal as the public would like, you are correct. But I don't think you meant that.

    Turning around the Bush/GOP recession is hardly a disaster.

    This is mind-boggling in its sheer weirdness. If you think liberals and neocons are the same, you clearly don't understand one or the other or both.

    And if by that you mean Reaganites, you're just setting us up for more failure. Reaganites don't balance the budget, and spending + a lower government burden (code for lower taxes and deregulation) are precisely what have been screwing up this country for the past thirty years.

    Again...boggle boggle boggle.

    The Tea Party certainly seems to be fading of late, and it's just as well. Their profound belief that they can make America great by being Wall Street tools is sad and pathetic.

    As to spending, we've been over this. Reagan, both Bushes and the Republicans spent us into debt with their tax cuts and the Iraq war. Obama, however, thanks to Bush II, had no choice but to spend to stimulate the economy. Economists get this, even if teabaggers don't.

    At least they did until the voters figured out that the period of time everybody's been pushing conservatism is the same period of time America has been on the decline.
     
  24. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #24
    Wait- fivepoint thinks Reagan was a fiscal conservative? Seriously? Well, whatever credibility he had is gone now.
     
  25. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #25
    From this weeks Economist:

    http://www.economist.com/node/16321546?story_id=16321546&source=features_box_main
     

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