Better Off Before Obamacare?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by R.Perez, Nov 16, 2016.

  1. R.Perez macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    #1
    New article from the Atlantic:

    Regardless of what you think of Obamacare (I strongly advocated for Single Payer), it looks like delivering on the campaign promise of repealing it and replacing with the something cheaper and better is going to be unlikely to say the least.


    Premiums Before and After Obamacare

    a19e185d6.png



    Full article: https://www.theatlantic.com/health/...off-before-obamacare/507650/?utm_source=atlfb


     
  2. DUCKofD3ATH Suspended

    DUCKofD3ATH

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    The GOP plan would:
    • Expand health savings accounts
    • Offer refundable tax credits to subsidize the purchase of private health insurance and decrease dependence on employer-sponsored plans
    • Cap the tax exclusion for employer-provided health insurance
    • Allow people to purchase insurance across state lines
    • Provide $25 billion in funding for high-risk pools over 10 years
    • Devolve Medicaid to the states, either through a block grant or a “per capita allotment”
    • Partially privatize Medicare beginning in 2024 through a “premium support” option
     
  3. R.Perez thread starter macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    None of that will lower the increase in premiums, certainly not more than the ACA has.
     
  4. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    Let me translate that into GOP-speak:
    • Expand health savings accounts
      • Expand the bandaid for the fact most health plans have a deductible that is way too high.
    • Offer refundable tax credits to subsidize the purchase of private health insurance and decrease dependence on employer-sponsored plans
      • Spend more government money
    • Cap the tax exclusion for employer-provided health insurance
      • Raise taxes
    • Allow people to purchase insurance across state lines
      • Won't work
    • Provide $25 billion in funding for high-risk pools over 10 years
      • Spend way more money, increasing the national debt
    • Devolve Medicaid to the states, either through a block grant or a “per capita allotment”
      • Screw over poor old people
    • Partially privatize Medicare beginning in 2024 through a “premium support” option
      • Implement death panels
     
  5. citizenzen Suspended

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    #5
    Cool. Americans can for pay for their healthcare with savings they don't have.

    How could that go wrong?
     
  6. DUCKofD3ATH Suspended

    DUCKofD3ATH

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    • Allow people to purchase insurance across state lines
    Why would people do that unless the price was lower?
     
  7. R.Perez thread starter macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    Source: The Problem With G.O.P. Plans to Sell Health Insurance Across State Lines -NY Times
     
  8. mrkramer macrumors 603

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    They just won't do it, even if it is even more legal than it already is.
     
  9. Populism macrumors regular

    Populism

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    #9
    If Trump/Republicans are serious about wanting to see an end to Obamacare, they need only grab a chair and watch the Unaffordable Care Act enter its death throes. It's happening, with or without their assistance.
     
  10. R.Perez thread starter macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    Unless you're going to counter the arguments and data with reputable sources and data of your own, your perspective is pointless. Try actually adding to a discussion.
     
  11. Populism macrumors regular

    Populism

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    Thanks, lil' 'Rez! We'll keep that in mind!

    Toodles...
     
  12. shinji macrumors 65816

    shinji

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    The ACA and the GOP plan are **** compared to single payer.
     
  13. citizenzen Suspended

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    If Republicans ever bring single payer to the U.S., I'll switch parties.

    (there is no chance I'll ever have to switch party)
     
  14. shinji macrumors 65816

    shinji

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  15. mrkramer macrumors 603

    mrkramer

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    There have been times in the past where the parties have switched sides on almost every issue, and in some economic issues we are seeing another switch, so I wouldn't be shocked to see it happen, although if it happens I'd expect it to be the Republicans replacing the ACA with large grants to the states to implement their own health care systems.
     
  16. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    The ACA was designed in part to limit the huge rate hikes year after year, we aren't seeing that and in some cases we're seeing them more often. The only ones seeing anything affordable is those who qualify for subsides.
     
  17. R.Perez thread starter macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    I can see you didn't read the article.
     
  18. Michael Goff macrumors G4

    Michael Goff

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  19. Herdfan macrumors 6502

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    They may not have a choice. After a couple more years of 30-40% increases and insurers bailing out, something will have to change. Not sure what it may be, but the entire system is on its way to a crash.

    But for all the supporters of the ACA, what happened to the promise that the average family's costs would go down? My premiums have more than doubled since 2013 (which was my first year under an ACA plan).
     
  20. Fancuku macrumors 6502a

    Fancuku

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    They are telling us that ACA has nothing to do with it. lol

    Some people benefitted from it while most got the shaft.
     
  21. R.Perez thread starter macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    #21
    I'm saying claims need actual evidence, not speculation and anecdotes.
     
  22. TonyC28 macrumors 65816

    TonyC28

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    I'm not sure how to put it into words, but I've always found it weird how we refer to health insurance as "healthcare." A doctor provides healthcare. I'm trying to think of two things that were once separate that are now so intertwined that we consider them one. Maybe student loans and college are on the way to that?
    --- Post Merged, Nov 18, 2016 ---
    You don't know what a health savings account is, right?
     
  23. bent christian Suspended

    bent christian

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    That worked great for credit card interest rates.

    Oh, wait...
     
  24. TonyC28 macrumors 65816

    TonyC28

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    This discussion will be filled with what-ifs and theoretical plans, but it really boils down to a simple truth: people were told that their premiums would go down and now they are going up, in some cases quite significantly. Supporters defend that by saying that prices would have gone up even more with the ACA. But that isn't what we were told. We were told premiums would go down, period. At the end of the day people care about their bottom line and their bottom lines are taking a hit. You'd have to be pretty naive to think this wasn't on the minds of voters on November 8.
     
  25. Populism, Nov 18, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2016

    Populism macrumors regular

    Populism

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    #25
    Very well stated. And don't forget to mention 2014 Lie Of The Year - if you like your plan you can keep it!

    As to your last point in particular, I strongly agree. I believe the announcement of the 25% increase in benchmark premiums two weeks before the election had a much stronger impact on the election than the Comey letter. Good, bad, right, or wrong, people carried that resentment into the booth and attributed it to Obama=>Democrats=>Clinton.
     

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