Birther Trump can't produce his own birth certificate

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by yg17, Mar 29, 2011.

  1. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #1
    Not that I take him seriously or think he has a snowman's chance in hell of winning, but if you're going to make false accusations about Obama's birth certificate, at least make sure you can provide your own first!

    http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0311/Trump_fails_to_produce_birth_certificate.html?showall


    And this is why Obama is going to easily win re-election. The Republican field consists of 3 Wives Newt, Mandate Mitt, Birther Trump, Sister Quitter Grifter and Bachman-******* Overdrive
     
  2. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #2
    The Republican challenger will be someone who has been off the radar for the past 4 years - a governor or a US representative. I have very strong doubts that anyone who is receiving press right now will be on the ticket to challenge Obama in 2012.
     
  3. karsten macrumors 6502a

    karsten

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    #3
    was born in Scotland, which is not part of the United States

    orly??
     
  4. Mousse macrumors 68000

    Mousse

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    #4
  5. dscuber9000 macrumors 6502a

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    Was anyone even asking for his birth certificate? I really don't care if Trump was born in the US or not... even if he won the Presidency.
     
  6. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #6
    Um...you may not care. But I'm pretty sure the U.S. Constitution does. Furthermore, it's certainly a valid question of anyone who is still unconvinced of Obama's birthplace.
     
  7. MattSepeta macrumors 65816

    MattSepeta

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    Birthers... Goodness gracious.

    I pay about as much attention to the conservative "birthers" as I do the liberal "truthers"

    All of them ignorant and living in a whimsical fairy land of impossible conspiracies. It does sound fun though...
     
  8. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #8

    What is a "truther"? :confused:

    I think we can both agree that these stupid political buzzwords and the attention they receive does nothing but detract from any substantive issue and policy discussion.
     
  9. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #9
    How sad that our media allows Trump to exploit them for millions in free publicity.
     
  10. MattSepeta macrumors 65816

    MattSepeta

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    Truther

    People who buy into this crap, including but certainly not limited to: Tom deLong, Rosie Odonnel, Janine Garaffolo, and a bunch of other stupid celebrities and quasi-political commentators.
     
  11. pdjudd macrumors 601

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    #11
    9/11 conspiracy theorists. Trying to spread the "truth" about what really happened on 9/11.

    ETA: Beaten to the punch!
     
  12. plinden macrumors 68040

    plinden

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    #12
    Who's that?
    Who's that?
    Who's that?

    At least I've heard of Donald Trump. Well, ok, I've heard of Janeane Garofalo.

    Edit: Oh, Rosie O'Donnell. I get it. Wow a lot of big names there. I still don't know who Tom DeLonge is, even after googling him. I thought he was that ex-Senator from Texas.
     
  13. MattSepeta macrumors 65816

    MattSepeta

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    #13
    Not sure what you are trying to do, but you certainly helped prove my point.

    EDIT: Feeling low? Try your hand at spelling/grammar policing on the internet! Guaranteed to bolster your self image/esteem!
     
  14. plinden macrumors 68040

    plinden

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    #14
    Eh? I really didn't know who you were talking about, except for Garofalo. That was a cheap shot but worth it.

    On the Birther side we have someone who thinks he can challenge for the presidency, on the Truther side we have a small group of second rate celebrities.
     
  15. MattSepeta macrumors 65816

    MattSepeta

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    #15
    Ok, you may be right. Truthers do get to lay claim to Van Jones and a few more political faces I can not recall.

    When all is said and done, both groups are off their collective rockers. THAT I am sure we can all agree on.

    Except maybe ITN (oh, the good old days!)
     
  16. Hugh macrumors 6502a

    Hugh

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    I will try to find it on CNN for that's where I read it. That the 'birthers' lost there case in front of the Supreme Court ruled down that they can't force president show us birth cert.

    Hugh
     
  17. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    Rarer than tits on a bull.
     
  18. CaoCao macrumors 6502a

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    #18
    They are both off the deep end
     
  19. fivepoint, Mar 29, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2011

    fivepoint macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #19
    First, asking for the President of the United States to release his real original Birth certificate (not just a certificate of live birth) does not make you a birther. Unless you think perhaps that the current liberal Governor of Hawaii is a birther, or if you think that Chris Matthews is a birther. It just means that you want the President to do the right thing and perhaps even shut up the birthers once and for all. Trump's question is valid... why not just release it? Why not eliminate all doubt?

    Second, I think you're all underestimating Trump. If my keen senses are right, this was probably done on purpose to make the very point he's trying to get across. This came from Trump's camp after the 'mishap':

    Personally, there's no question in my mind... but I do find it strange/irritating (if for no other reason than I'm sick of listening to the stupid birther crap) that he hasn't just released the real long-form document.

    Does anyone know what ever happened to this story? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ys-Obamas-birth-record-exists-produce-it.html
     
  20. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    Not exactly. Basically, Orly Taitz, the loudest, most obnoxious voice of the berthers, had some serious legal trouble, resulting in a judgement against her on the order of, IIRC, $20K.us; she appealed this judgement all the way to SCOTUS, except the justices she filed her appeal with shelved it, leaving her no recourse but to pay up. So burdened, she, the only person actually pursuing the challenge, was taken out if action.
     
  21. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #22
    Because it is not up to him to have to justify himself. If someone is accusatory in his birth, THEY need to show evidence that he isn't what he says he is. In short, they made the claim, so they need to back their claim up with proof. They still have not done so, to this day.

    If he is going to boast such a claim as he did, he should have had his facts for himself all laid out and clear for everyone to see. A hospital record does not make for an official document authorizing citizenship. Even your keen senses should have realized that.

    See above. He doesn't need to. The birthers made the claim. They must prove themselves right, not he prove them wrong. Or perhaps your keen senses should have pointed you in the direction of the Hawaii Office of Vital Records, which states:

    So he doesn't have to provide anything, as it is his personal records. Unless you have some sort of direct involvement in his life (which birthers do NOT), he doesn't have to release a damn thing, just as you don't have to. But don't fret.. Your keen senses also should have told you that in August, 25 years from now, this will be a moot point. It may even be a moot point this year, as most states have laws that make birth and death certificates public record after 50 years..

    Or perhaps your keen senses aren't as keen as you make them out to be...

    BL.
     
  22. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #23
    Because 'eliminating all doubt' is impossible. Do you honestly think that the 'birthers' will be satisfied by the "real original Birth [sic] certificate?"

    The president has been vetted as a congressman and as president, that should be enough and I see little movement on this issue for the other candidates in 2008. I wonder why?

    This is a good point, but I think it's backfired. If Trump, who had the indecency to repeat the lie without actually saying it, can't reproduce the right document, how can anyone else?

    From the story, it appears that the records custodian was incorrect and the document was just a hand-written note. But, that belies the real point, despite dozens of stories affirming Obama's citizenship by real journalists and not hacks like Jerome Corsi, the Republican party thinks it's a valuable peg to hang their attacks on.

    The actual Birthers aren't exactly like Truthers: the 9/11 Truth folks are conspiracy-minded blockheads, but the Birthers are useful idiots.

    Trump is playing to the idea that Obama, a half-black American who lived in Indonesia for a time as somehow inherently foreign despite his birthplace and parentage.
     
  23. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #24
    This still has me wondering..

    If it were Nicole Kidman running on the Blues' ticket instead of Obama, would the Reds and the birthers be just as livid and wanting of her to show her birth certificate. It's even more damning for her, as she has the accent to show that she isn't from here.

    So 5P, since you're also wondering why Obama hasn't provided his birth certificate, would you also require Kidman to show hers, should she have run for POTUS, vPOTUS, or Congress?

    BL.
     
  24. fivepoint macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #25
    Wait a minute... not up to him to try and justify himself? Not up to the President of the United States to prove that he was born in the U.S. as required by the constitution? What are you talking about, of course it's up to him. Half the people asking for his birth certificate honestly believe he was born here, but also agree that he should have to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt with an official full form Birth Certificate. Many states in fact are working towards making this a requirement to be on their presidential ballots for 2012... something that should be unnecessary as it should be covered at the federal level, but it wasn't.

    You say Trump made a claim... what was it exactly. I know he didn't claim Obama was born somewhere else because he specifically said that he personally thought he was born here... all he claimed is that Obama was being dodgy with it, and that he seemed strangely unwilling to simply make the document officially available. Add on top of that that his friend the Governor of Hawaii was unable to find it, and you start wondering if there's a reason why it's being kept out of the public record. The question is... why not make it available and remove all doubt? Seems quite reasonable.




    You're clearly right that there are some loons that will never be convinced, but It's also obvious that 90% of them could be eliminated by simply making the birth certificate public. So why wouldn't they do that? Yes, I know he was vetted, but he was also vetted by those in his own party who had a vested interest in his success. IT doesn't matter if that's enough for you and me, some people want the verification for themselves. I see no reason why that verification shouldn't be made available. Their continued stonewalling on the issue makes them seem guilty by default.

    As for Trump not producing the 'right' document at first... maybe you're not getting it, but I think that was the point. Release the wrong document, the one similar to what Obama released, let the media pipe up and say "hey, that's not good enough", at which point he can release the real one (after all, why wouldn't someone realease the real one) and use it as an opportunity to educate everyone on WHY there's such a huge difference between the two documents and why one means something and the other doesn't mean much.




    Are you ok with future presidents of all types not being required to demonstrate a real full form birth certificate to get on the ballot? Seems like a pretty simple prerequisite to me.




    I got to admit, I don't know what the hell you're talking about. Yes, all candidates for President should have to submit their real long form birth certificate to be put on the ballot as the Constitution requires their birth be in the U.S. It's a simple matter of law... and a common sense approach to satisfying the skeptics among us.
     

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