Blasphemy Laws in Modern Society

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Plutonius, Feb 25, 2017.

  1. Plutonius macrumors 603

    Plutonius

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    #1
    Blasphemy is the act or offense of speaking sacrilegiously about God or sacred things.

    It was just reported that a Danish man posted a video on the internet of himself burning a Quran and he was charged under Denmark's blasphemy law.

    I wasn't aware that secular countries still have blasphemy laws and that they still enforce them. Do you believe that such laws should exist ?
     
  2. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #2
    About half of the world has laws against blasphemy:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law

    And of course they shouldn't exist.

    As far as I know the only nation with guaranteed freedom of speech is the US.

    I believe everyone should have freedom of speech.
     
  3. zin macrumors 6502

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  4. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #4
    My feelings are:

    How can that be blasphemy if the person didn't believe in God or the so called sacred thing?

    I guess I don't get it.
     
  5. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #5
    While what that guy did is in poor taste, he shouldn't be charged with a crime. I find it rather odd, that Denmark would have something like this. Seems like something you would only see in a predominately Muslim country.
     
  6. BeeGood macrumors 65816

    BeeGood

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    #6
    As a Christian, I'm actually grieved by the fact that laws like this exist. It just makes people have even more contempt for the things we believe.
     
  7. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #7
    Did you see my link?
    Much of europe has those laws.

    So does Canada ...
     
  8. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #8
    Liberals bend over backwards and wrap themselves into a pretzel when it comes to Islam. Imagine if Catholicism was committing the attrocities that Islam was today, the left would be dragging the pope by the hair.
     
  9. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #9
    Sadly, I agree with this.
     
  10. chown33 macrumors 604

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    #10
    I wonder if destroying a colander would qualify as blasphemy.

    Or maybe the simple imposition of order, such as cleaning up one's desk, is a sacrilegious action. FNORD
     
  11. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #11
    Missed it, originally. It was an interesting read.
     
  12. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #12
    wikipedia always is :p
     
  13. niploteksi macrumors regular

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    #13
    What about protection against flag desecration? The US Senate was one vote from passing that law in 2006 as I understand it?
     
  14. The-Real-Deal82 macrumors 601

    The-Real-Deal82

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    #14
    Christ I'd be in trouble then. I probably swear with god related language dozens of times a day. The fact religion is fake to me means it's just words but it funny to think it could be classed as illegal in some places lol.
     
  15. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #15
    Not only do we have a law on the books, the liberals keep trying to push through motions on "Islamaphobia" which basically would instate a major tenant of sharia in our modern society.

    Religion is not only fake, but it's a choice, so when you choose to be part of a religion that is spreading suffering around the world I should be able to call your religion ****.
     
  16. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #16
    Many in the US do not realise they live in the only place on earth which has free speech.

    And the left wants to get rid of that.
     
  17. casperes1996 macrumors 65816

    casperes1996

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    #17
    Hello from Denmark!
    Yes, just heard of this case today, and it's absolutely bull-piss. For my entire life, this sort has been unheard of, until now. As far as I know, it's the first time in literal ages this has happened and the political spectrum is to blame that we've returned to this yet again. Though in a sort of roundabout way, but more on that later
    Before we move on, we have to tackle the most bull-excrement part of this whole thing however. Because you say something in your post that should be true, but isn't. Denmark, is not a secular state. We have a church ministry and "The Danish People's Church" (clings better in Danish). Priests of said church are employed by the state and aside from functioning as priests perform state tasks, such as managing "The Name Books" which is set of historical archives, and of course wedding people, and managing the administrative work that goes into officially registering the marriage on behalf of the state. Personally, I've opted out of the church, but if your parents are in, so are you unless you manually opt out, and it involves an extra tax. Even if you opt out and avoid the church tax, part of your tax money still goes to the church which is bullocks.
    The real kicker here however, is that the majority of Danes are atheists. Yet most people are still part of the church because "tradition". I'll never forget a religion class at my high school, where my teacher asked how many people believed in God, and 2 people raised their hand (out of 30 or so) and he then asked how many were members of the church, and all but four raised their hands. Most of the atheists had atheist parents two, who were also members of the church. A lot of this is similar in the other Scandinavian countries also.
    Now to the big part of the "How did we get here".
    There's a political party called "The Danish People Party". They're the populists and the xenophobes in Danish politics. There's been a lot of parties like them since, and recently, an even more extreme version that literally copied things from Trump's speeches (noteworthy is the "They're rapists, murderers... and some I assume are good people" thing he said about Mexicans, just about Muslims instead). Anyway, The Danish People Party, when they're under attack or investigation for ********ting, have this clever little strategy that they'll get a member to say something absolutely ridiculous, to divert the media attention away from the big scandal. And most recently, the ridiculous thing was "You aren't Danish if you're not a member of the Danish Church". Now this party has tried hard to create a war on other religions, especially Islam and they believe that freedom of religion (which we do have in Denmark) is the same as freedom to not be Danish basically. But wait a minute I hear you asking, this guy burnt the Quran, not the Bible. What does this have to do with anything? Well, this political party dusted off these laws and said "Aha! Muslims! If you do anything that can be seen as an attack on Christianity, we'll use this on you!", but of course there's something called the separation of powers, and laws have to be applied uniformly to all people, and as I said we have freedom of religion, so if someone charges someone with these laws, the judge has to be fair and follow the laws, so The Danish People Party shot themselves in the foot.

    For the most part, Denmark functions as a secular state, but isn't and there are a few clear examples of it. However, most Danes, if asked, would say we do live in a secular state, and the people who like The Danish People Party, would point at Muslims and say that they want to destroy the separation of church and state, but we don't have it to begin with. Not all the way anyway. That someone could actually be judged under blasphemy laws is a massive news story in Denmark, and judging by your post, the broader world too, because we do consider it abnormal and unheard of. Those laws are a relic of the past and most of us are surprised they still existed. But the state of the political environment here, and across the world, has led us to where we are now with this. Xenophobia and the tendency for "us vs. them" especially with regards to Muslims, goes both ways. If you make an enemy out of someone, eventually they might start seeing you as an enemy too, even if they didn't before. By constantly saying that Muslims are terrorists and all sorts of piss, perhaps they won't exactly feel that they're welcome or that the people who say such things are very nice people, and obviously they won't then actually become terrorists, but to be honest, might smile at a story like this even if they would otherwise find it appalling. And it is appalling. Especially considering it was done on his own private property. Had he entered a Mosque and done the same, punishment would be justified but not as per blasphemy, as per invading property with malicious intend.
    Public burnings of religious texts could be discussed as I see both sides on that. However, if treated as a normal demonstration and there's no violent activity, and the burning is done in a safe manner and otherwise following laws, I believe it should be treated as a normal demonstration.

    Anyway, big rant from my side :)

    Depends how you define freedom of speech. I also believe that "speech" is generally the wrong term, as US judges have several times judged that actions can also constitute speech, at which point I think we should call it "freedom of expression", but let that be a subject for another time. There's a big difference between being free to do something, and being able to do something without consequences. I am free to call another person an *******, and that person is then free to hate me for it. My action caused the person to hate me, but I expressed it freely. If you tell your boss he's a douchebag, I think he should have the right to fire you. Both can be seen as expressions in a way, but your actions clearly have consequences still, even though you are free to express them. There are officially things you can't express in Denmark, but in reality, those laws are just on the books for traditional, 'constitutional monarchy' reasons. Same way we have a queen who technically is a monarch, but in reality have literally no political power. We have freedom of speech just the same as you guys do (see above bit for a comment pertaining to this specific case)
    --- Post Merged, Feb 25, 2017 ---
    I don't really see how this makes sense? Just because you're against people fearing Islam for no logical reason, doesn't mean you want Sharia.

    Agree entirely. And you should be able to call me an *******, and that Jesus had a tiny bell-end. Oh, and all praise the flying spaghetti monster.

    All kidding aside, I'm an agnostic atheist. Religious is a choice, and per my views, superstition like you say, but I am no more capable of proving it than religious people are of proving the existence of God. Now as someone who believes in the scientific method that means that I discard the theory of God, but I also acknowledge it as a theory and since I doubt we can ever get an answer as per why and how it all began, pre-pre-Big Bang, any theory is as good or bad as any other, and if someone believes in God and otherwise behaves like a good and lawful person, I am not one to criticise that in itself. I can name both positives and negatives of all religions, and overall, it almost never comes down to the scriptures themselves, but more tradition than religion.
    But going back to what you said. If you call religion ****, the religious people should likewise have the right to call you a ****. Freedom of expression goes both way.
    --- Post Merged, Feb 25, 2017 ---
    Could you elaborate? I haven't heard of this
     
  18. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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    #18
    and conservatives just condemn all muslims as terrorists. see easy peezy.
     
  19. casperes1996 macrumors 65816

    casperes1996

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    #19
    Speaking of which, all catholic priests molest young boys, right?
     
  20. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #20
    Italy has blasphemy laws, although they are really not enforced. It is also forbidden to talk badly about dignitaries, both domestic and foreign. (Again, not really enforced)
     
  21. Plutonius thread starter macrumors 603

    Plutonius

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    #21
    Thank you. I didn't know anything about Denmark church / state / politics. I always assumed that the government was secular. Do you have many refuges and how do they feel about a state religion ?
     
  22. niploteksi macrumors regular

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    #22
    State religion and a secular government isn't the same thing.
     
  23. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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    #23
    yep. nope was just being sarcastic to a broad paint brush.
     
  24. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #24
    Thanks for the informative reply. Bonus points for using "piss" a lot. Enjoyed that...
     
  25. Plutonius thread starter macrumors 603

    Plutonius

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    #25
    I was replying to the post. In it, the poster said that Denmark isn't a secular government because they have a state church. I replied that I always thought it had a secular government and thanked the poster for correcting me.
     

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