Bush: If I Were Iraqi, I’d Be Saying, ‘God, I Love Freedom’

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by solvs, Nov 8, 2007.

  1. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2002
    Location:
    LaLaLand, CA
    #1
    You know, sometimes I wonder if he really is this oblivious, or if he knows it's b.s.

    http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/07/bush-iraq-freedom/

    Really?

    In other news, a bunch of Iraqi policemen just got blown up again.

    http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2007-11/08/content_7035290.htm
     
  2. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #2
    He can't honestly think he's kidding anyone anymore surely...
     
  3. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

    Joined:
    May 31, 2006
    Location:
    New York
    #3
    He's got Barney fooled.


    That's about it.
     
  4. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    #4
    Really? We just had a cop shot in the head in a Dunkin Donuts for no reason too. I'm sure that disproves the theory that we love freedom too.
     
  5. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #5
    There you go then. You're just as free as the Iraqis....

    Lucky you.
     
  6. kainjow Moderator emeritus

    kainjow

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2000
    #6
    Why does it seem like the topic of donuts keeps coming up in this forum? :p
     
  7. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    #7
    No, the presence of random violence does not indicate the presence or lack of freedom.
     
  8. Buschmaster macrumors 65816

    Buschmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Location:
    Minnesota
    #8
    And that happens all the time, and it happened LOOOOOOONG before the MNF was there.

    I think there is a certain egotistical feel that we like to feel like we're making a big impact, if it is good or bad. Like a lot of people with global warming. Not to say we're not having an impact on the Earth, of course we are.
     
  9. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    #9

    It doesn't? What does freedom mean to you? What does it mean to any of us?

    Free to do what? Free to be what? Free from what?
     
  10. Buschmaster macrumors 65816

    Buschmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Location:
    Minnesota
    #10
    Freedom will mean something different to everyone you ask, depending largely on their life experience.

    If you lived under a terrible leader, there is a chance you would think that getting rid of them and getting a new leader would be freedom.

    Like many American's are probably thinking about 2008 when they read that sentence...

    I'm not saying Bush was smart is saying this, or in much at all of what he says. But I understand what he's saying.
     
  11. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    #11
    Are you saying that a single individual through a random act of violence can eliminate freedom in a free country? Is freedom tied to body count? If so, we have tens of thousands dying on our freeways every year.
     
  12. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #12
    Several US presidents have done just that over the decades. Just not in the USA.
     
  13. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #13
    Quit being obtuse. Just once I would like to see you honestly discuss something instead of mentioning things such as "a cop got shot in the Dunkin Donuts". You think that's comparable to what is going on in Iraq? Honestly?
     
  14. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    #14

    No. I asked a question... and what's more, to ascribe the levels of current violence and oppression within Iraq to 'random' factors is a little disingenuous.

    Freedom to go to the market to shop for your family without being blown to bits by a car bomb... freedom to live without a foreign occupying force on your soil... freedom to have the once-reliable water and electricity supplies that you once had?

    Freedom is just a buzzword, mere lip-service to the real needs of a civilised society. No-one is truly free.
     
  15. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2004
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    #15
    If I can't walk into a Dunkin Donuts without being worried that I'm going to be shot, then yes, I'd feel like some of my freedom has been eliminated.
     
  16. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2003
    Location:
    Colly-fornia
    #16
    You are quite correct. Random violence does not correlate with freedom.

    But those cops were not random victims. They were targeted for political purposes; which is a completely different thing. When we're looking for an excuse to invade, we call that kind of thing politically-motivated violence terrorism.
     
  17. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2003
    Location:
    Colly-fornia
    #17
    'Tis true.

    To quote the Vandals...
    Sorry, random flashback.
     
  18. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2002
    Location:
    Palookaville
    #18
    I say, make him an Iraqi. He wouldn't be missed by 75% of the people in this country.
     
  19. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2003
    Location:
    the faraway towns
    #19
    Endemic violence is significantly different than the deaths because of accidents.
    Crashing your car into a tree on the way to work is very different from being kidnapped, executed, and tossed into the Euphrates. And you know it.

    Furthermore, while the Iraqis currently enjoy a great deal of abstract freedom, their lives are actually governed a series of limitations that you apparently cannot grasp. They can't drive down the highway without the possibility that they will be shot, kidnapped, or blown up, (EDIT) including the possibility that they may be run over or fired on by US armored vehicles on the highway.
    In Baghdad, there are enclaves on Sunnis who cannot go beyond the concrete and concertina-wire that protected them.
     
  20. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2004
    Location:
    OBJECTIVE reality
    #20
    Aside from the obliviousness, anybody see anything wrong with
    Yeah, an Iraqi would say that. :rolleyes:

    Or by 100% of the Iraqis.

    If you know what I mean. ;)
     
  21. carbonmotion macrumors 6502a

    carbonmotion

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    #21
    I think a really great national characteristic of America is this "can do attitude"
    I'm no sure if the situation in Iraq can be improved by this attitude alone though. I'm also not sure if you say it's happening often, it really will happen. That doesn't seem like a reasonable way of looking at things.
     
  22. psychofreak Retired

    psychofreak

    Joined:
    May 16, 2006
    Location:
    London
    #22
    Translated, God is Allah, clearly they would be speaking Arabic...
     
  23. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    #23
    Well, look at the other side of the coin. Every time an Iraqi malcontent blows himself and a couple police up, there are people wringing their hands and whining that all is lost when the population of Iraq numbers in the MILLIONS.
     
  24. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    #24
    They are far more at risk from their own people then they are from our troops and you know it.
     
  25. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #25
    Either way it doesn't exactly result in a recognisable definition of freedom does it?
     

Share This Page