Bush/Obama vs McCain Clinton? The New Gas Tax Political Football

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Cleverboy, Apr 30, 2008.

  1. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

    Cleverboy

    Joined:
    May 25, 2007
    Location:
    Pocket Universe, nth Dimensional Complex Manifold
    #1
    http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN3038243520080430?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews
    http://www.reuters.com/news/video?videoId=81429&newsChannel=topNews

    Let's see how Clinton and McCain spin this. Sounds like the economics on this are soundly on the otherside of the field.
    ~ CB
     
  2. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #2
    We pay the highest gas taxes in the country here, it is way to high as it is.
     
  3. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    #3
    I'm pretty sure CA gas taxes have you beat.

    Plus our summer blend is more expensive.

    Thank god train ticket prices aren't linked to gas! :eek:
     
  4. atszyman macrumors 68020

    atszyman

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Location:
    The Dallas 'burbs
    #4
    Glad to see someone is doing the math. I figured it out yesterday and with my car, I'd save roughly $35. Combine our family and we'd maybe save $100.

    How many people are going to say "hey, cheaper gas, we can drive a little more!" and will end up filing their tank 2-3 more times over the summer costing them more in the long run?

    And if it's supposed to help struggling families, other costs will continue to rise, they'll drive "only a little" more because gas is cheaper and the extra tank or two will have wiped out their savings from the gas tax suspension while taking income for highway maintenance away from the government.
     
  5. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #5
    CA ad CT are 1,2 in highest gas tax.

    People are going to drive no matter what the price, cutting the tax will bring some relief. We get taxed on everything in this country as it is.
     
  6. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    #6
    Yup. Whenever we shift to the summer blend we normally see a 10-cent hike.

    I can't imagine what the hike is going to be like this year.

    Might as well take out a mortgage to fill up a tank.
     
  7. amik macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #7
    Here's a cut/paste of my response in a similar thread on another forum.
     
  8. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #8
    All the taxes on gas that are supposed to fix the roads, well where does that money go, the roads are still ****.
     
  9. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #9
    Look who's on the wrong side of the issue once again- Clinton/McCain. Nothing to see here. Move along.
     
  10. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #10
    The way I see it the government dips into our pockets for everything. I think not taxing the crap out of us for once would do some good.

    Amazing that Bush wants tax cuts until it comes to oil. So oil companies no tax, consumer up the ass.
     
  11. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #11
    It's symbolic and accomplishes nothing as has already been illustrated in this thread
     
  12. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    #12
    We really don't pay that much in taxes on gas if you think about it.

    If you consider how much it takes to maintain roads, emergency services, and other services related to car-based transportation, the gas tax really pays for itself from a consumer standpoint.

    Frankly I think high gas prices are a good thing. Sure we're hurting in the short term right now, but maybe it'll push us to do other things and stop using a fuel which really only has a few decades left anyway.
     
  13. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #13
    So how much should we be taxed, until we can't afford to eat or sleep in a house. Everyone on the streets the government took all our money.

    Emergency service comes from local taxes here. State roads get the gas tax, and the state roads here are crap.

    The whole supply in demand thing I think is a load of bull. I haven't see any shortages on gas, they say we are paying more because there is less. Well I don't see stations closing because there is no gas left. It is just a money grab plain and simple.
     
  14. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    #14
    Most states receive Federal subsidies for emergency services.

    Nonetheless, it doesn't change the equation from your point of view. You're still getting more out of your gas tax than what you're paying into it. Even with a tax that's higher like CA or CT, we still don't pay nearly what it actually costs to drive on a road per passenger mile.
     
  15. PlaceofDis macrumors Core

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    #15
    a bit over dramatic don't you think?

    okay, lets not tax, then all our cars will be damaged since we don't have the money to fix the road their driving on. the actual tax on gas isn't that much, nor is it the reason why prices are so high.

    so we save a few cents over the summer, come winter when the tax is reinstate there will be a huge jump again. this is a short term idea that is only being played out to get 'rep points' for hilary and mccain. it makes absolutely no sense.
     
  16. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #16
    Oil companies are using the fear strategy, they say we need to raise prices because it costs more to refine. Well then why are the oil companies bottom lies sky rocketing if they need to pay for the refineries. Where is all that needed money going but into the oil mans pocket. Price and demand is just to make it look good. I want to see how much demand has gone up. People have and will always drive. Greed is the main factor not demand.
     
  17. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #17
    "And the Oscar for Best Dramatic Performance goes to..." :) Of course oil companies and OPEC are gouging us. That's a given. But if your roads suck, write your state reps.
     
  18. PlaceofDis macrumors Core

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    #18
    you don't think there are more drivers? if its the oil companies being greedy, then what does that have to to with the government taxes on gas?
     
  19. amik macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #19

    Supply and demand is simple economics. In order for it to fail, there has to be a fundamental change in human behavior or some sort of illegal price fixing/monopolistic competition. The latter is not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

    When prices go up, use goes down. The reverse is also true. Suppliers have incentive to keep the price sufficiently low so that they operate at capacity. If they see that they can increase the price and still operate at full capacity, why wouldn't they do it? As demand increases in the summer months, prices increase to the point where demand falls off enough to meet supply. You don't see gas stations running out of gas because there are, for lack of better term, wide spots in the line. It's not as if the pump is connected directly to the refineries and when demand exceeds capacity the pump runs dry. We briefly draw down small storage supplies until the price correction, and resulting sag in demand, allows them to gain level.

    Couple the basic supply/demand economics with more complex issues around the US dollars declining value and oil speculators and the whole mess gets more cloudy.

    It is worth investigating how much additional refining capacity has been added over the last few decades. The answer does not make big oil look good and largely supports your claims of a money grab, but it has been going on for a long time.
     
  20. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    #20
    Not that that will do anything, at least not out here anyways. The Bay Area has arguably the worst roads anywhere in the country, and I know state leaders bring it up during their campaigns, yet nothing gets done.
     
  21. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #21
    I bet I'm a better actor than most of Hollywood.:p Have you seen some of the movies out.
     
  22. zioxide macrumors 603

    zioxide

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2006
    #22
    They would be even worse if they didn't have this tax money.

    This idea is ****ing awful. Basically, you'd save 15 cents per gallon for the first week. Then, more people here about the no tax on gas, and they're like, "Hey lets go driving because gas is cheaper!" So demand increases, but the supply doesn't. Prices go back up, and then they're back where they started. On top of this, we lose the tax dollars and our roads and bridges get even ********.

    edit: Here's my new idea: Charge gas taxes depending on what kind of car you drive. So if you drive a Hybrid, there's no tax. Small car like a Civic, 10 cents a gallon. If you're a ****tard with a Hummer, its 50 cents a gallon.
     
  23. jb60606 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Location:
    Chicago
    #23
    Call me selfish and cruel, but I'd give my left nut to see that Humvee driver in unit 1608 downgraded to a Prius. I'm with Obama on this one. :D
     
  24. Cleverboy thread starter macrumors 65816

    Cleverboy

    Joined:
    May 25, 2007
    Location:
    Pocket Universe, nth Dimensional Complex Manifold
    #24
    The ironic thing about this issue, is that Obama can't be caught saying what the economists are saying. He has to (rightly) say that "it isn't enough". --Cause its not. Economists, meanwhile, get to say the absolute truth of "gas prices aren't high enough". Demand drives price. If a meaningless cut spurs gas purchases, the price will increase, and the cut will likely end up in the deep deeeeeep pockets of the oil companies.

    Clinton says we'll TAX 'em to get the money paid for. That's kind of stupid. Tax them as part of a comprehensive plan to encourage better consumer environmental options, but don't try to lower prices artificially for a temporary time... increase demand... increase taxes on the provider... and expect the prices not to reflect it.

    Gas Tax Holiday? MADNESS is THY NAME.

    I want lower gas prices too, but unless Americans consume less (demand), or supply is positively effected (supply)... gas prices won't be going in the right direction any time soon. Hopefully the strikes and incidents will get resolved and lower volatility speculation though. That's entirely out of our control though.

    Hopefully people will be smart enough to reward common sense on this issue, and not political posturing.

    ~ CB
     
  25. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #25
    Just to humor myself, would the big dig not have happened if the money wasn't there. That was maybe the biggest bunch of waste ever created in this country.
     

Share This Page