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Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by zimv20, Dec 15, 2005.
Big Brother is watching you.
First let all these bastards into our country, then take away everyones right so you can spy on them. Welcome to the Patriot Act.
obviously not good news... but is anyone really surprised?
No but our republican ran Govt is tearing down all the safe guards that were put into place years ago to prevent the Population from becoming the target of its own military & govt. When we start spying on our own folks then we are lost. Its sickening to know they let millions walk into this country every year and they have not a clue who they are. It will be easier for Govt to slap a label on the whole population because of its inaction,no action over the years on everything from borders, to security to checking out the people they are letting into this country in the first place. Govt gets 3 Fs but then wants to sap away our libertys and freedoms with patriot act and wants to spy on its people? is this Russia? China? sounds the same doesnt it. What did we fight for all these years?................... So we can be just like our enemys?
it certainly seems like they're getting confused about which ought to come first, the cart or the horse...
All hail, J. Edgar Bush.
I await the calls from Congress for an investigation.
I'm... so... surprised.
BushCo abuse power? Un-imaginable!
I do like Russ Feingold's related quote today, now that re-authorizing the PATRIOT Act has been stopped (at least temporarily):
impeachable offense? afaik, the president is not above the law.
Never happen. The Republicans (like they do with everything) would cry partisan politics (while completely ignoring the irony) and then say the President was just trying to protect our freedoms (again, ignoring irony), and accuse everyone of questioning Bush's honor of being terrorist-lovers who want good Americans to die.
So we have a President who wants Torture,wants spying on Everyone and wants secret Prisons. I wish Bush and all his deferral buddies ruinning our govt would have done the Vietnam tour, Cheney,Libby,Rowe,etc Discraceful, Our President and his lawless gang. He represents the things 200 yrs of American history fought against. An all intrusive Police State answerable to no one and never wrong. That isnt our dream for America. I wont mention Katrina,Iraq,Oil Companies,etc.
I wonder if they are spying on MacRumors? Grandma's Phone? Juniors Library record? what else are they doing in secret? shipping folks overseas?
This is why the Constitution has all the checks and balances. Spyng on Americans ? We cant trust Govt to spy on its own folks.
don't hold your breath. the dems are still going through political puberty. by the time they reach aggressive maturity, it'll be '07 and a moot point.
forget the show trial, hang them from this in november. and not just republicans- any democrat who knew about this and looked the other way should be shown the door, too.
Yes, but only after the 2006 elections. It couldn't be clearer why Bush has pronounced Delay innocent. He needs him to save his own tush.
If the series of outrageous actions of this administrations (lying and twisting information to get us into a war of aggression; pushing the use of torture - something strictly forbidden by both international law and US statute; the illegal detention of US citizens and foreign nationals, some in secret prisons, without recourse to any appeal; and now Presidential ordering of spying on US citizens without cause or oversight - all blatantly against the law) doesn't constitute the definition of "high crimes," nothing ever will.
I thought it was very interesting that the Times admitted that they had this story a year ago, but sandbagged it until now. It seems that the supposedly "liberal" New York Times gave the Bush reelection campaign a huge gift.
No kidding. But would it have been enough to derail the election? I mean, after all the BS Bush has pulled, only since Katrina has he really been in deep enough s*** that he has to hold his watch over his head. Over the last months though, he's become more vulnerable to attack. Maybe this timing will work out even better, what with the whole Patriot Act in trouble. With the story breaking the week before it has to get re-approved, it may throw a large enough wrench into the works to actually make a difference.
And on a related note, I notice that despite all these illegal activities and questionable tactics Bush has approved in order to "win" the war on terror, that we're mired worse than ever, terrorism is rampant and Osama is still out there.
Yeah, it's not just you. I mean, I'm happy that they got to vote in Iraq and all... but I don't see that magically fixing everything. Even then, still not worth it. Why does the price of freedom have to be the sacrifice of freedom?
Isn't this unconstitutional? Can't anybody who was spied on sue the NSA for breach of civil rights?
it's a little more complicated than that. npr had a story about it today, which you can listen to from this page.
boils down to: it's not clearly illegal, but bush did so "at his peril."
It may not be "illegal" per se, but any evidence they collect from this can easily be thrown out of court. If it came to that, charges being filed and all. But this combined with the whole secret prison thing worries me. Especially considering the fact that we aren't really that much safer. Not to mention the political fallout from people who aren't even that paranoid (well, I'm sure now they are).
What really bothers me are the 14% (according to a recent MSNBC poll) who don't have a problem with this. Wonder what the percentage would be if Clinton pulled this crap.
Not to burst your bubble, this had nothing to do with the Patriot Act. If you listen to the NPR report, you will hear what law they violated.
Haven't yet listened to the NPR report, but here's the law:
Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act
There is a fine column over at Washington Monthly discussing this and the absurdity of Bush's claims he needed to bypass the law to protect the country.
i think that will be the defining phrase of the bush presidency.
When you let the dog off the chain trouble follows. The Republicans have let this President do whatever legal and illegal........we have seen it in his spun up war,in his quest for the police state(Patriot Act, Had to be FORCED by McCain to give up Torture, Now Spying on U.S. citizens, Secret Prisons, Secret Plane trips etc. He doesnt get it, Never will. We never should let one Party run everything. He and the republicans have proved this over and over and over. He does whatever and the republicans ignore.
Freedom, Liberty and Justice are not what he is about. Freedom Liberty and Justice is what America is suppose to be about. He has killed that reputation of ours hasnt he? whats next by the draft dodger and all his draft dodging buddies he has surrounded himself with in Wahington.