China to execute Briton


mkrishnan

Moderator emeritus
Jan 9, 2004
29,641
12
Grand Rapids, MI, USA
Does anyone have a good summary of any Chinese equivalent laws that mitigate or undo responsibility in the face of insanity or psychiatric disease (NGRI, Atkins, etc, in the US)?
 

Eraserhead

macrumors G4
Nov 3, 2005
10,300
10,374
UK
And the Thais and Lao (at least) are also pretty strict on drugs offences if you don't pay the bribe.

EDIT: According to Wiki here's a list of countries that have the death penalty for drugs offences:

  • Afghanistan
  • Bangladesh
  • Brunei
  • People's Republic of China
  • Republic of China (Taiwan) - though they may be confused.
  • Egypt
  • India (no execution carried out for such offences)
  • Indonesia
  • Iran
  • Iraq
  • Kuwait
  • Laos
  • Malaysia
  • Oman
  • Pakistan
  • Saudi Arabia
  • Singapore
  • Thailand
  • United States (Although Federal Law provides the death penalty for certain drug offences, no one is on death row for such offences)
  • Vietnam
  • Zimbabwe
 

mkrishnan

Moderator emeritus
Jan 9, 2004
29,641
12
Grand Rapids, MI, USA
That's a more extensive list than I realized, although some of the countries clearly enforce it more than others (I know, in India's case, the law calls essentially for a crime in any category to be exceptional in nature before the death penalty can be imposed, but what this means has been an evolving target; this came up with the issue of whether it was likely that the Mumbai terror trial would involve a death penalty claim).

Does anyone know anything about the Chinese equivalent of "Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity" (in the US, a variety of different standards have been applied over time; the US prohibits the execution also of the mentally retarded, but in this case, they appear to be claiming that this person was manic at the time the crime was committed). That being said, I'm a little skeptical about the mania claim. If this were the US, it might fly, but I'm not sure I'd call it likely.
 

skunk

macrumors G4
Jun 29, 2002
11,745
3,996
Republic of Ukistan
Of course, if the Chinese were right in saying that there were absolutely no records of this man having any mental problems before his arrest, then it must be said that according to their lights they are acting correctly. It does seem odd that, given the extensive reporting by all and sundry of his past history of debilitating bipolarity, he was apparently never once referred by family, friends, police or social services for help, treatment or even evaluation.
 

mkrishnan

Moderator emeritus
Jan 9, 2004
29,641
12
Grand Rapids, MI, USA
Of course, if the Chinese were right in saying that there were absolutely no records of this man having any mental problems before his arrest, then it must be said that according to their lights they are acting correctly. It does seem odd that, given the extensive reporting by all and sundry of his past history of debilitating bipolarity, he was apparently never once referred by family, friends, police or social services for help, treatment or even evaluation.
Also, what they describe isn't really consistent with Bipolar Disorder... individuals who are bipolar can have manic episodes, during which their reality testing is off, and they make incredibly bad decisions. But mania is like setting your house on fire -- it can burn, but it cannot burn forever. Mania can explain why someone would decide to move to China in 2007 to become a pop star, perhaps, but not why they stayed there for a year or so before committing this crime (as it seems).

Anyway, I still grieve for the family's loss. And I still would like to see all countries, including my own, ban or substantially limit (at most, maybe for war crimes, treason, mass killings / terrorism) capital punishment. China in particular really lacks transparent standards, to the point where the world doesn't believe its estimate of how many people it kills annually is even vaguely true.
 

arkitect

macrumors 603
Sep 5, 2005
5,910
5,462
Bath, United Kingdom
Of course, let's cut China some slack…
:rolleyes:

We all know what the "official" MacRumors response would have been if this tragedy had played out in, lets say, Texas for example…
 

Eraserhead

macrumors G4
Nov 3, 2005
10,300
10,374
UK
It does seem odd that, given the extensive reporting by all and sundry of his past history of debilitating bipolarity, he was apparently never once referred by family, friends, police or social services for help, treatment or even evaluation.
If he wasn't mentally ill then the Chinese have every right to execute him for this crime. 4kg is enough that it'd be pretty hard just to sneak it into his luggage without his knowledge.

As he was crossing a border you have to follow the rules for the countries concerned.
 

Eraserhead

macrumors G4
Nov 3, 2005
10,300
10,374
UK
So you're OK with capital punishment?
I would rather they abolish the death penalty, but their legal system allows for it for this crime.

You can't say that because he was a foreigner that he's exempt from the rules that they apply to their citizens - especially for a crime that is a crime in virtually all countries.
 

arkitect

macrumors 603
Sep 5, 2005
5,910
5,462
Bath, United Kingdom
I would rather they abolish the death penalty, but their legal system allows for it for this crime.

You can't say that because he was a foreigner that he's exempt from the rules that they apply to their citizens - especially for a crime that is a crime in virtually all countries.
*sigh*
Did I say anywhere in my posts that he should not have been punished?
And don't put words into my mouth… of course he should be subject to the laws of the country — foreigner or not.
But:
I rage against the disproportionate punishment.

Throw his ass in jail and keep him there for a period of time.
No legal system anywhere should sanction murder by the state.
Of course, YMMV…
 

skunk

macrumors G4
Jun 29, 2002
11,745
3,996
Republic of Ukistan
So you're OK with capital punishment?
Of course it is… I am just surprised by the double standards…
I am absolutely against capital punishment. I am absolutely against the arbitrary and politically-driven application of Chinese justice, or any justice. I am also against China being singled out for vilification by British politicians and media who would never dream of saying anything comparable about the same thing happening in Texas. Now please explain your accusation of double standards.