Christians and a Mormon candidate?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by 63dot, Oct 18, 2012.

?

Would you as a Christian vote for a Mormon?

  1. Yes

    8 vote(s)
    15.7%
  2. No

    13 vote(s)
    25.5%
  3. It shouldn't matter what religion the candidate believes

    26 vote(s)
    51.0%
  4. I have never given it any thought

    4 vote(s)
    7.8%
  1. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #1
    Is it important for a Christian (loosely defined as Protestant, Catholic, and Orthodox) to vote against a Mormon because of their faith, or is politics more important? Or, as it seems to be the case, religion doesn't matter and the issue is purely political? This is front and center these days because of Mitt Romney.

    I also want to see if this applies to Christians in general and if any Christian in Harry Reid's district holds Mormonism against him?

    Personally I grew up United Methodist and hold to those beliefs (and believe in Holy Trinity unlike the Mormons) and I look only at a candidate and their political stances. Furthermore, I don't care if they are a Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Hindu or if they are an atheist.
     
  2. robanga macrumors 68000

    robanga

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    #2
    Christ said to give to Caesar what is his, governments will do what they do. I find it very hard to believe anyone of that leaning will vote against an LDS guy solely based on that. Perhaps they would have backed another candidate in the primaries but not now.

    Let's face it the dialog between the LDS church and more mainstream Christian churches has become much kinder over the last decade.
     
  3. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

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    #3
    it seems facts speak for themselves.
    the majority of romneys' voters are non-mormon religious christians, so it clearly it is not a major issue.
     
  4. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #4
    This election has really brought out a lot of the bigots out of the closet and while many Christians won't accept a Mormon's beliefs, I don't think it will affect this election these days.

    Now had this election happened in the 1950s, I think a lot of people would have voted against a Mormon, other than fellow Mormons. A lot of this talk about the x-factor of Mormonism and the 2012 election kind of reminds me of the talk about Catholics in politics during the 1960 presidential race. I don't know if back then more Protestants went to polls to vote against Kennedy based purely on denomination or if it brought out a larger number of Catholics to support Kennedy.

    I think one major difference here is that while both Protestantism and Catholicism are both versions of Christianity however bad the relations of the two were in America in 1960, Mormonism stands on its own as a separate religion right now in 2012. Maybe 50 or 100 years from now, Mormonism will get a full fledged membership as just another denomination of Christianity but this isn't the way it is right this moment.

    One of the traditional religious rivals of the Mormons are the Southern Baptists but these days, both are among the strongest supporters of the GOP so that has caused a dire need for positive dialogue. Other than the different core beliefs of the two, they do share almost every major platform of the GOP and to an outsider, it's really hard to tell the difference.
     
  5. robanga macrumors 68000

    robanga

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    #5
    Agreed on your points politically. There is not a gap between the "conservative" stands of either. Yes the 50s and 60s were much different times, i remember the conversations around that in my parents era.

    I believe that the LDS church is viewed as a positive influence on society by many who are not members.

    Having said all that i contend there really is not much difference between either party on most issues.
     
  6. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #6
    The last article I read was that self-identifying Christians make up for 14% percent of the GOP registered voters. If most of them sat out this election then there is no way Obama could lose.

    As the polls show, at least according to Huffington Post and the electoral college, Obama is comfortably ahead. As for popular vote, this one is going to be very close (if the election were held today). While I don't think another debate will change the numbers much, the candidate's political stance will be the make it or break it factor which decides the election and not religious affiliation, imho.
     
  7. robanga macrumors 68000

    robanga

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    #7
    Its really a tiny fraction of the electorate in 3-4 states that will likely decide the election this time around as in the recent past. I'm not sure i would take what Huffington says as credible though. But, i think you are right faith will have a negligible effect on that.
     
  8. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

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    #8
    do you have a link for it? i would be very interest to read it as it dissonates with anything I have seen
     
  9. Tomorrow macrumors 604

    Tomorrow

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    #9
    Mormons are Christians - poll appears to be moot.
     
  10. APlotdevice macrumors 68040

    APlotdevice

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    #10
    Mormons consider themselves Christians. Christians generally do not. And certainly Mormons do have some interesting beliefs, like Native Americans being a lost tribe of Isreal.

    Of course as a Jew they're all just Gentiles to me. The only thing that really bothers me about Mormons is how active their church is in trying to influence American politics.
     
  11. Tomorrow macrumors 604

    Tomorrow

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    #11
    What do we consider them to be, then?
     
  12. APlotdevice macrumors 68040

    APlotdevice

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    #12
    Well my really devote Baptist friend thinks its a false religion. And I know it's often been considered a cult.
     
  13. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #13
    They're all cults. Mormonism isn't much loopier than any of the others.
     
  14. Tomorrow macrumors 604

    Tomorrow

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    #14
    Ask your cousin how he/she feels about Catholics, Lutherans, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Anglicans. I'm curious to know if he/she lumps them all into the same "false religion" boat.
     
  15. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #15
    i don't now about the US but i would guess the majority of people i know (around here) would call them a cult or sect

    not as dangerous as scientology but still a cult, and thus not a candidate i would vote for (similiar like Jehovas witnesses)
     
  16. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #16
    I should have bookmarked it. I typed in, "Is Mormonism a Cult?" and I went through both a lot of religious and secular sites. It's certainly a hot button topic in terms of just religion, but does not affect politics.

    Mostly, just like I believe, the sites didn't consider it a cult in the sense of a Jim Jones or Scientology, but distinct from mainstream Christianity. The evidence I seemed to find was that most did not care what a candidate believed.

    Let's say a double digit percentage of people in the deep south are very committed Christians and they believe that Mormonism is distinct from Christianity. What seems to be obvious is that while you can't convince most Christians that Mormonism is just another denomination of Chistendom, it doesn't affect their vote. If a Christian belongs to the GOP and the GOP candidate is a Mormon, it's safe to say that said Mormon will get enough of that vote to be able to breathe easily on voting day.

    ----------

    Huffington does seem to reflect the left and maybe give slight bias to Obama, but these numbers are not good for Romney if even close to true. Only in recent days has Romney broke 200 and less than three weeks left going into election he would have to turn a New York or California, or a whole bunch of medium sized states:

    (also look at margins in tossup states)

    http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/2012/romney-vs-obama-electoral-map
     
  17. APlotdevice macrumors 68040

    APlotdevice

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    #17
    Cousin? My cousins are all reformist Jews! But anyway, no, my friend actually does recognize all those groups as Christians (well maybe not Jehovah's Witnesses... That one has strangely never come up). Knowing him he probably thinks some of their beliefs are misguided, but the only western religions he seems to think are outright "false" are Mormonism and Scientology.
     
  18. robanga macrumors 68000

    robanga

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    #18
    The real question for a lot of Christians is the pivotal belief in the Trinity. ie is God three persons in one? LDS belief in the Trinity is slightly different (some would say a lot different)

    However a good friend recently said to me an opinion that it may be a difference in semantics. If you have a personal relationship with Christ and profess that, believe he was crucified, dead and buried, rose again and believe that he died for everyones sins, past present and future and embrace that...you are a Christian. I doubt many Mormon's would disagree on any of those points.
     
  19. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #19

    They're all cults. The only difference between what society considers a cult and what society considers a religion is a few million followers.
     
  20. macquariumguy macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    Heh, in the church I was raised in (1st Southern Baptist), Catholics weren't considered to be Christians.
     
  21. 63dot, Oct 18, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2012

    63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #21
    For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son that whoever believes in Him shall have everlasting life, or something to that effect.

    Being a Christian, the very core of the faith is summed up in that verse and it's what I have been taught as well as any denomination in mainstream Christianity, and there are many other verses, chapters, etc that follow that basic belief. If Mormonism believes in that verse, it's hard to argue that they are something else. However, for reasons I cannot explain, most of Christianity (Catholics/Protestants/Orthodox) don't seem to include Mormonism.

    While that verse comes from the bible, the main faiths of mainstream Christianity may have other important writings, but none equal to the bible. The Mormons have the Book of Mormon, and if held on an equal par with the bible, then one can argue that it's a different religion.

    Look at it this way. Christianity and Judaism share the Old Testament, but because the Christians have the addition of an equally important New Testament, it's seen as a newer and different religion. Because Mormonism has the Book of Mormon, and held as high as the two testaments, then it too is newer and different from both Judaism and Christianity.

    That being said, when Christianity got its start it wasn't called Christianity and was considered a version of Judaism. It took a long time for the early followers of Christ to eventually get the momentum to have their own religion and to be widely recognized as such. Only time will tell if Mormonism breaks from the chains of being called a mere cult and gets full status as a separate religion on its own. Few today would put Mormonism on the same questionable basis of a David Koresh cult or Jim Jones cult. Now had Mitt Romney been a surviving and self-professed member of those well known destructive cults, people would vote against him based just on that.

    To be fair, some of the beliefs and lifestyles of our governor Jerry Brown (California) have bordered on strange by many in his own party, but he's our governor and thought of pretty well or at least quite a bit better than his Governor Moonbeam days when he ran this state as a younger man.
     
  22. robanga macrumors 68000

    robanga

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    #22
    Different but the question is about compatibility. Catholicism and Protestantism are different but most of the basics are the same.
     
  23. 184550 Guest

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    #23
    This was in The Charlotte Observer this morning

    Billy Graham Website Scrubs Mormon 'Cult' Reference

    ...

     
  24. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #24
    I can see most Christians saying that when regarding Mormonism or Jehovah Witnesses, but why Catholicism? While I don't find Catholicism my preferred flavor of Christianity, I don't see any of their core beliefs differing than mine as a protestant Christian.

    Their sole authority, at least written, is the bible and they believed He (Jesus) died for our sins. On top of that, Catholicism in on the same page as to when viewing the Trinity. Though some think the Catholics worship Mary as a God, too, they actually don't as their Trinity is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Sure, they have a Pope and there's no biblical precedent for that, or their past delvings in the world of secular politics, but core beliefs still add up to Christianity.

    ----------

    If that's true, it's a far stretch for Reverend Graham.

    I can see why a lot of Americans, Christian and non-Christian, conservative and liberal, are simply not happy with Obama.

    After it's all said and done, I think we expected to be in a better place than 7.8% percent unemployment. I don't think that anybody here thinks our country isn't hurting right now.

    What's key is if you think that Romney could do a better job.

    I don't care what his faith is, but his history and his apparent beliefs of Trickle Down are certainly what our country doesn't need. I think we are slowly on the mend and that putting Romney in there will slow that down even more. The momentum we have, probably due very little to Obama, will pull us out of this recession. I know that Romney will not bankrupt us, but I still don't like the idea of him being in office. That being said, what is scarier than a Romney-Ryan winning next month would have been for McCain-Palin to win in 2008. If that had happened, we would have gone into a depression.
     
  25. macquariumguy macrumors 6502a

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    #25
    I'm not an expert, but I believe the answer was the Pope and the ideas of Papal infallibility and that the Pope literally speaks for God. The Baptists don't buy any of that stuff. I remember adults discussing the possibility that the Pope was the anti-Christ. There was much genuine concern when Kennedy was elected president that he would be beholden to the Pope before the USA.
     

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