Conservatives, tell me why Texit is a good idea?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by 63dot, Jun 29, 2016.

  1. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #1
    I don't have views on this, but right now there are over 250,000 signatures calling for it.

    What are the reasons?

    So far I have heard that some conservatives in the state don't like that Texas has to pull more than their own weight and they don't want Texas money helping smaller states. Why should Texas have to pay for itself and others?

    I have also heard that Texas is sick and tired of a liberal Washington DC imposing law on a state that wants more rights for guns and one that isn't fully on the page of marriage equality of much of the rest of the nation. Why can't Texas be allowed to govern itself like a separate nation reflecting the values of its residents?

    But from what I have read, a Texit would not really change much and won't suddenly mean fewer taxes. Texas needs their neighbors Mexico and the United States as much as they need Texas so it will be business as usual. Just like it seems like Brexit is more a move on paper and not a real change on the way things are done, is Texit just a stupid idea? Laws will quickly be rewritten to keep the business as usual model, so state or nation, Texas won't be able to run and hide from operating costs. If Texas pays less or nothing for other states, they will only impose duties on Texas goods to even the balance sheet. So what is gained?
     
  2. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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  3. 63dot, Jun 29, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2016

    63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #3
    I talked to a far right man yesterday who thinks this could happen and that Texit believers have the moral high ground, but even by his far right views, it's just not a good move in the long term because neighboring states may let Texas have it via tariffs and taxes.

    I don't feel that Texas wants to uphold their brothers in the South because Sam Houston was originally against joining the Confederacy. It killed off a lot of Texans who didn't have a dog in that fight, thus spilling blood for states that benefited from crops and slavery. Texas is not Virginia or Georgia and as we have seen since the Civil War, they are certainly their own entity not being South, or Southwest, but a hybrid that has no allegiance purely to one or the other.

    The same offense I heard from a Briton simply being called a European was echoed in calling a Texan just another Southerner. Other than Alaska or Hawaii, Texas seems to be the most independent state in terms of how they describe themselves. Lone Star, as in alone with no company and content with that tag.
     
  4. b0fh666 macrumors 6502a

    b0fh666

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    #4
    if they allow me to connect internationally on DFW or IAH without that stupidity that is american immigration I'm all for that!
     
  5. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #5
    The Texas Embassy building still exists in London St James,I'm sure you could buy it for a "reasonable" price.
     
  6. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #6
    They were a nation for only 9 years and still talk about it as if it were yesterday.

    Presidente Ted Cruz, Generalissimo Extraordinare! LOL Hey, California was a nation and we don't go on and on about it.
     
  7. steve knight Suspended

    steve knight

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    #7
    But Texas gets a lot of the emergency funding for disasters and such.
     
  8. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #8
    You mean to tell me we are funding the Dallas Cowboys?
     
  9. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #9
    if your vacuum breaks just stick a cowboys sticker on it and it will start sucking again :p
     
  10. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #10
    Most cities and their residents, subsidize sports stadiums/arenas. Basically welfare for billionaires and little to no economic benefit.

    Texas is not going anywhere.
     
  11. mildocjr macrumors 65816

    #11
    Can't get the illegals out of Texas so we give Texas to Mexico. /sarcasm
     
  12. MacNut macrumors Core

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    #12
    So will FEMA be funding the LA Rams, we know that will be a huge disaster.
     
  13. 1458279 Suspended

    1458279

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    #13
    One reason for any state to leave is that they would have more control over their own laws. Example: CA just passed laws on min wage that forces a business in Modoc county to pay the same min wage as a business in SF.

    The local governments would have more direct control over the laws their people have to live with.

    On the same note, if TX wanted no min wage and stopped some welfare programs in exchange for some welfare to work program, they could do that without worrying about federal laws.

    The debate over tax rates vs growth and many other issues would come close to being resolved.

    Immigration is another issue, if TX had strict rules, we could see the results. With all the states being forced to follow the same rules, we'll never know the answer to many basic questions.

    A big part of the problem is that the constitution was supposed to limit the power of the federal government. Now, the federal government is in every part of everyone's life.

    The biggest thing would be freedom of choice for a deeply divided nation. People fed up with the US could just move to TX. As it is now, we're stuck in a dysfunctional forced marriage.
     
  14. Renzatic Suspended

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    #14
    Those are the positives. Now think of the negatives.
     
  15. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #15
    [​IMG]
    This is a graph showing how much money each state gets back from the Federal Government, for each dollar in taxes it's citizens pay. Essentially, the taker states are at the top and the earner states are at the bottom.

    I'd say any state above Indiana (that isn't comprised of beautiful beach islands) is welcome to go and try to survive on their own, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
     
  16. jf1450 macrumors regular

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    #16
    Good riddance. Trump will just need to make his wall longer and further to the north.
     
  17. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #17
    So, we're talking that they become completely independent and don't rely on the US federal government for anything? I would assume also that this means they cannot enter the US or return to Texas without a passport, and that their tourism industry would likely collapse. They would need to create and fund their own military. There are all sorts of things which are more than just, "Hey, y'all! We free now!"
     
  18. CaptMurdock macrumors 6502a

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    #18
    Okay. That was funny.
     
  19. 1458279 Suspended

    1458279

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    #19
    There's some issues with things like sports, transport, etc... but these things can be worked out. Overall, the biggest gain would be that we would see just how the US could benefit from certain policies.

    Consider if TX did this and had flat 5% income tax to replace the federal income tax and corp tax. Imagine if companies could get the same effect as having setup in Ireland right here in the US.

    The real issue here is that the government went all out with the economic recovery, yet after $10 trillion added to the debt, zero interest rates, TARP, many trillions added to unfunded mandates, we got job growth that didn't match population growth.

    That puts us on sides. One side saying "it would have been worse if we didn't do what we did, therefore we saved the nation from a massive depression"

    The problem is that this can never, ever be proven. We can't go back in time and do it differently.

    Consider two types of arguments:

    1. what is the boiling point of water
    2. does God exist

    One can be proven to rational minds via science, the other can never, ever be proven to people that are alive. You have to die to find out.

    The same is true with things that can't be re-produced. Most might agree that restricting credit after the 08 meltdown caused fewer people to be able to buy the homes as their prices fell. This caused prices to fall more.

    Point: Until we're able to go back in time, we have to go mostly on speculation.

    If TX or a group of states left, we would be able to do a East/West Berlin compare. After a few years, we could analyze the tax rates, business laws, regulations, etc... and see the economic effect.

    Compare that to what we're doing now. We go Left/Right/Left/Right and never get out of the ditch.

    Most humans depend on selling their labor to earn their keep. This is no longer economically viable. We can program a robot to do anything a human can do. This is a failing model. 95% of the recovery went to the top 5% of the people.

    If we don't figure this puzzle out soon (and get it implemented) we're done. There'll be a flight-to-safety and the government will be hungry for cash to feed itself.

    The worst part is that most will not learn how to fix it. Most will simply point their fingers in blame.
     
  20. boast macrumors 65816

    boast

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    #20
    The North American Union would allow free travel between Canada, USA, Texas and Mexico with a unified passport.
     
  21. MadeTheSwitch macrumors 6502a

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    #21
    What would happen to social security for Texas residents? A lot of people have paid into that, but I can't see Washington continuing the payouts to residents of a foreign "country". :D

    Then there are things like the electrical grid and water which would have to be resolved. And then the cost of now not only guarding the Mexican border, but now the borders with all the other states too (don't want illegal immigrants coming in from anywhere, right?). Texas is a very big state. That is a LOT of mileage to cover. Very expensive.

    Lots of things that most people haven't even thought about.
     
  22. Technarchy macrumors 603

    Technarchy

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    #22
    If they wan't to leave, let them. I personally don't care.
     
  23. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    I think it would be great if the left. This country is tearing itself apart as it is. If they want to ban gay marriage and teach idiocy from textbooks then I don't want their sizable population having an opinion over what we do where I live.

    Small governments = better governments.
    --- Post Merged, Jun 30, 2016 ---
    Would probably have pretty liberal borders with the US.
     
  24. diamond.g macrumors 603

    diamond.g

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    #24
    All of the US Military bases would close.

    Besides doens't leaving the Union require 2/3rds Congressional approval?
     
  25. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #25
    Except you have one problem in this scenario. In the first part, you say Texas has its own laws "right here in the US". Then you suggest they are separate. They can't be both. In order to have a true comparison, Texas would have to be on their own, and have no support whatsoever from the US. That means they would have to fund all of their own stuff through their 5% tax rate.

    You compare the new Texas to Ireland. Ireland, who spends 0.39% of GDP on defense, as opposed to the US's 10 times that.
     

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