Corbyn lies about train being full

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Eraserhead, Aug 23, 2016.

  1. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #1
    So despite having no support among MPs and a -40 popularity rating Corbyn still had his integrity. Not any more.

    It seems he made up a story about not having a seat on the train completely as he could easily have sat down as there were lots if available seats.

    Another lying politician.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37167700
     
  2. Limey77 macrumors regular

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    #2
    He is proving to be more and more of a liability. One that Labour needs to drop ASAP.
     
  3. zin macrumors 6502

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    #3
    Labour are a bunch of amateurs who have no idea what they are doing. I refuse to vote even locally for such incompetence.

    I can't believe I decided to renew my membership earlier this year.
     
  4. sim667 macrumors 65816

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    #4
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...y-corbyn-sitting-on-floor-video-a7205631.html

    Labour is tearing itself apart due to its desperation to pander to neo toryite ideology.

    If Corbyn goes, Labours membership will deplete over night, and they'll end up on the same level as the Lib Dems..... and thats exactly what they deserve.
     
  5. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #5
    Maybe this particular case was spectacularly bungled.

    But the larger truth is this: Many commuters and travellers do face dreadful shortages of seats on British trains. I frequently encounter this sort of problem on SouthWest trains. Get on the wrong train, specifically at the beginning or end of a weekend, and especially when school term begins or ends, and you can end up standing, or smashed into a tiny corner, for a hundred miles and two hours at a time. Many of Britain's trains don't seem to have been designed with any thought given to luggage.

    And that is often the sort of service you get for a ticket costing upwards of sixty pounds for a journey of just over 120 miles.

    Americans simply would not tolerate the dreadful travel conditions many British commuters and travellers face on a daily basis. They are forced, by dint of artificially expensive petrol and road taxes, to using a public transport system that is chronically underfunded. That is not adequately maintained. And that lacks the quantity of rolling stock to meet passenger demand.
     
  6. sim667 macrumors 65816

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    #6
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ection-information-commissioner-a7206916.html

     
  7. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #7
    Seat on a train? Now that's scandal. :p
     
  8. jeremy h macrumors 6502

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    #9
    What I want from politicians is both honesty and competence. I think Corbyn is honest but he seems incompetent. Incompetent honesty while endearing isn't really helpful when trying to position yourself to run a country.

    Yet again it's a balls up.

    I completely get wanting to make a point about trains and having the 'man of the people' do a little shaky vid while having to sit on the floor to stick on facebook or wherever probably seemed a great wheeze. And carefully done it could have been a great idea...

    But there's never any appreciation of cause and effect. (Remember McDonnell chucking that signed Mao's little red book at Osbourne..?) Once again a back of the envelope plan arrogantly not thought through. It feels like I'm stuck in one great big In the Thick of It episode.

    Look - if you're going to criticise a service then expect the purveyors of that service to come out of their corner swinging - you'd better be ready for them...
     
  9. sim667 macrumors 65816

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    #10
    Data protection laws are "ridiculous"?
     
  10. cube, Aug 24, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2016

    cube macrumors G5

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    #11
    He said he wanted to sit with his wife to talk with her.
     
  11. Eraserhead thread starter macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #12
    The story on Corbyn is clearly in the public interest. So of course you should be able to publicise it.

    And other members of the public are blurred out.
    --- Post Merged, Aug 24, 2016 ---
    That seems unreasonable and not what the initial video implied.
    --- Post Merged, Aug 24, 2016 ---
    I disagree. Corbyn isn't honest.
     
  12. ForkHandles macrumors regular

    ForkHandles

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    #13
    I suspect Corbyn had options for his seat on this train, barge his way into a reserved seat or sit on the floor, he chose to take a position that suited his politics. Corbyn is an advocate of state owned railways, his video showed an experience that occurs daily on commuter trains, and it has reignited the debate of the state of uk railways.

    Had Corbyn had a little more finesse he could have avoided making the video a test of his integrity. That said, when you buy a ticket on a train which doesn't stop for 200 miles then you are entitled to expect a seat.

    Before railways were privatised the state spent billions keeping the network running. Since privatisation the state still spends as many billions keeping the service running in subsidies , 20% of which now goes to shareholders! There is a very good argument to suggest that railways are a public good and like the NHS they are too important to leave to the private sector. Yes they are expensive but they are also critical the the running of our economy and our lives. This is the debate we should be having.
     
  13. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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    #14
    Ruined only by the fact he walked by empty unreserved seats.
     
  14. twietee macrumors 603

    twietee

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    #15
    The point is, that the issue itself isn't far-fetched at all - I'll never understand why people prefer to nitpick or critisize formal (mis-)behaviours when the topics presented are of far greater interest. He messed up on the delievery of his message, so what? Is the overall message not worth discussing because of that?

    I mean, I don't know this guy and he may be a bad politician or not but I hear all kinds off bad remarks about the British transportation system (not only that) so anybody bringing that up should be rather applauded, no?
     
  15. Eraserhead thread starter macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #16
    But it's the commuter trains that are generally rammed.
     
  16. twietee, Aug 25, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2016

    twietee macrumors 603

    twietee

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    #17
    From the OP: "[...]a problem "many passengers face every day" on the London to Newcastle train." That's his message imo. Are those trains crammed or not? Genuine question.

    I know who I would vote for when a local politician would adress the serious problems of public transport in Munich.

    edit: ok. seems commuter trains are sth different, wasn't familiar with the term. Still, I fail to see where the big problem in this particular case is. Was he lying? Yes, seems like it. Should he be called out for it? Yes, of course. But, correct me if I'm wrong, the idea of running public transportation (not only the commuter trains) by private corporations failed in the UK. I'm not familiar if that is already broadly discussed and adressed there - if yes, ok give him a slap on the wrist, but if not, don't focus on the small mistake he did when he still was trying to paint a broader picture.

    We had sth not quite similiar (but still got me riled up a bit inside) happening here not a week ago when Sigmar Gabriel, uncanny leader of the SPD, gave some rambling nazis the middle finger when on tour. All that was asked in the media (he has an extremely bad rep all around the voters) was whether that is appropriate for him to do or not. Nobody asked, where the F are all those right wing nutters and neo-nazis coming from (they where never away) all of a sudden in Germany..why do they feel so utterly comfortable nowadays.
     
  17. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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    #18
    Someone telling a lie is far more news worthy than saying public transport is fairly full when commuters are commuting.
     
  18. twietee macrumors 603

    twietee

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    #19
    I had to smile.

    Nevertheless, I can see myself joking with others about the former while I would seriously discuss the latter. Not the other way around.
    And I don't know how full your commuters are when commuting but here, I have to skip a train or two at times and other BS while seeing that little to nothing (and if basically only csometic) is done to address that stuff. I don't want to know how many people get the flu because of those overcrowded waggons.
     
  19. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    5 years ago I tried to quit a job I hated but they insisted they pay me for 1 day a week (whether I have work to do or not) and I could work from home. After a year of that I quit. My current job is a 20 minute walk through town. Commuting is a nightmare I hope to never experience again. You can get numbed to it after a few years but it sucks.

    Anyway, I'm not sure he was even on a commuter train at rush hour. If he wanted to make a real point he should have been but odds are he doesn't actually commute on public transport to work even on the 160 days a year he has to be at work.
     
  20. steve23094 macrumors 68000

    steve23094

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    #21
    Where are you getting this 20% figure from? All numbers I have seen show the rail operators typically run a 2%-4% profit margin. Obviously it varies slightly from year to year and company to company but it's well short of 20%.
     
  21. Eraserhead thread starter macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #22
    You do have to include the very high profits made by the companies that own the trains. But yeah I agree largely.
     
  22. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    I presume they mean the rail operators profits are one fifth of the amount paid in subsidy.

    The alternative to this would obviously be that prices are raised significantly or services curtailed in order to make the trains profitable without subsidy.
     
  23. Scepticalscribe, Aug 26, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2016

    Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #24
    Agree with @twietee's excellent posts - and that of @vrDrew about the importance of the bigger issue which is the provision of a decent public transport system.

    Insisting on making trains profitable rather than ensuring the provision of a reliable, and affordable public transport system, is shortsighted, as the provision of a good and reliable public transport system (one not governed by the need to make a profit but mandated to provide a service - some things need to be determined by the public good) is one of the factors that allows for the further commercial, economic and financial growth of major urban spaces.

    Mind you, while the general point that Mr Corbyn was attempting to highlight is a good one, unsurprisingly, he went about attempting to achieve it in a characteristically incompetent manner.
     
  24. Obi Wan Kenobi macrumors 6502

    Obi Wan Kenobi

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    #25
    Scepticalscribe, you nailed it again. I liked your posts on the EU referndum as well.
     

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