Death @ Heart Attack Grill

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by eric/, Feb 13, 2013.

  1. eric/ Guest

    eric/

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio, United States
    #1
    I thought this could be an interesting debate topic.

    Link

    So I think this begs the question, should we let establishments which knowingly, albeit explicitly, serve unhealthy food exist?

    Why or why not?
     
  2. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #2
    Of course we should. Why should we let the government tell us what we can eat?
     
  3. eric/ thread starter Guest

    eric/

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio, United States
    #3
    Well, with obesity being such a problem, and cardiovascular disease being the #1 killer (unless that's recently changed), don't we have an obligation to the safety of our people to make sure they aren't eating stuff that will cause an early death?
     
  4. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #4
    Irony. Pass it on.


    Edit:
    A better discussion to have would be about medicare/medicaid. Should our tax dollars pay for those who knowingly abuse their bodies. There are many preventable disases - many heart related. I'm not sure I enjoy paying for people's bad life choices.
     
  5. eric/ thread starter Guest

    eric/

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio, United States
    #5
    I think that's on topic. And I think they should.
     
  6. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #6
    why?
     
  7. zioxide macrumors 603

    zioxide

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2006
  8. eric/ thread starter Guest

    eric/

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio, United States
    #8
    They are part of our country, we should be taking care of them. They should also have access to health experts so that they can learn how to properly manage their weight/eating habits.
     
  9. mrkramer macrumors 603

    mrkramer

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Location:
    Somewhere
    #9
    If people want to eat stuff that will kill them they should be allowed to as long as it's not marketed as being healthy. I also wouldn't mind seeing a fairly large tax on these kinds of foods and having that revenue go towards health care, then the people who are making choices that will negatively effect their health are also paying more into the system.
     
  10. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #10
    I have no issue being proactive. But let's face it, what we're talking about is reactive. When lung cancer is being treated or a quadruple bypass is being performed, nothing was being properly managed.
     
  11. ugahairydawgs macrumors 68020

    ugahairydawgs

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2010
    #11
    I don't think the government should necessarily step in and say you can't serve this or that. I think, in that respect, the local government in NYC has way overstepped their bounds over the years with their food related bans.

    That said.....stuff like that should come with a warning label. Restaurants and the like should be required to put nutritional info for all of their products at every table in the joint and anything over a pre-defined limit in terms of calories, fat, sodium, sugar or cholesterol should come with a warning much like what we see on the sides of a pack of cigarettes.

    Outside of that there's not much that can be done really. It's up to each individual to do better for themselves.
     
  12. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    #12
    Agreed. Why?

    Because if I am reading this right, eric/ is saying that we should have our tax dollars pay for those who abuse their bodies and willingly put themselves into poor health.

    But let's put that into another perspective, and this one being the perspective of the person who willingly does this. This means that they are expecting us to bail them out whenever they wreak havoc on their bodies, such as this guy here. Wouldn't that make this ... an entitlement? And wouldn't the Conservative base be against something like this? If not, what happened to living and dying by one's own actions? In this sense, this would be akin to letting those who were Too Big to Fail fail.

    With that being said, should we have helped this guy? Yes. But we should have helped him with a hand up, not a hand out. We help by making this guy realize how much he's putting his body through, and teach him to eat right. That could have saved his heart and his life.

    I'll put it one final way. Which person would you like to have your (our) tax dollars help:
    • someone who was blinded at birth, scarring on their eyes because of the malpractice that occurred, who now can not get coverage because their condition is pre-existing, and suffers a cornea perforation and retina detachment, requiring an ocular evisceration (google that one, and be sure you aren't eating anything), but would otherwise be in great health..
    Or...
    • someone without a physical problem, who doesn't exercise, eats very unhealthy foods on a daily basis, high in calories, saturated fats, cholesterol, and not only needs the drugs to try to reverse the damage (a further cost), so they can continue the unhealthy eating habits they have.

    I know which choice I would make.. do you? and if so, why?

    BL.
     
  13. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #13
    Should we allow beer commercials or McDonald's to promote their unhealthy foods? Those commercials get people to buy their products and in return stress the health system.
     
  14. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #14
    This is exactly my point. I have personal experience in the matter, so I'm not objective at all, but it's certainly worth discussin.

    My girlfriend was born with a congenital health defect - and as she got older was almost impossible to insure. And the coverage she received was practically worthless. More than 4 years after her death, I'm still paying medical bills.

    Conversely, her father who abused his body with alcohol and crappy food had his quadruple bypass completely covered. Do you think he stopped drinking? Or eating McDonald's?

    And research funds are going to diseases that are preventable, like heart disease and lung cancer instead of going to things that aren't.

    I'm for taking care of our citizens, but what about personal responsibility? Why not promote preventing things, instead of spending money reacting to everything?
     
  15. ugahairydawgs macrumors 68020

    ugahairydawgs

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2010
    #15
    Outside of using the tax code to do that, I don't know how you get people on board with that. Restaurants spend a lot of advertising money conditioning our society to eat that crap. Going to take one heck of a carrot to get folks off the dollar menu.
     
  16. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #16
    One of the issues with all of the unhealthy foods people are eating is that they are cheaper. I believe that's one of the reasons children are so unhealthy. Cost of living is expensive and in situations where both parents work, it's easier and cheaper to feed them a happy meal. We just need to find a happy medium.
     
  17. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #17
    Maybe if you get a free toy with brussel sprouts kids would eat them.:p
     
  18. dukebound85 macrumors P6

    dukebound85

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Location:
    5045 feet above sea level
    #18
    Yes. Everything in excess is unhealthy.
     
  19. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2009
    Location:
    in a New York State of mind
    #19
    Ironically, a lot of those places are offering some type of fruit in kids' meals. Also ironic - but my kids love fruit and veggies. it's the protein I have to force them to eat. :D
     
  20. citizenzen macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #20
    :)

    Had he eaten nothing he'd have starved to death in a matter of a few weeks.

    The food may have contributed to his heart attack, but it definitely helped to sustain his life for many years.
     
  21. Tinmania macrumors 68040

    Tinmania

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2011
    Location:
    Aridzona
    #21
    I agree with you (and what a shame about your girlfriend).

    However, it is so hard to draw the line. I used to be heavily into giant-scale r/c planes (very large). In that hobby I was a youngster. Most were above 70-years-old (or even 80). It was hard to find one in the group that didn't have a hip replaced (or two), knee replaced, etc. I once did a rough count (very rough) of the group, not counting life-threatening treatments, and it was in the range of one million+ easily (not that many people). I hate to sound crass but some of them passed on within a year or so of getting a new hip or whatnot. Meanwhile we have children and other younger people not getting adequate care and not making it. It's worth noting that medicare was paying for most of this and this particular group was almost venomously opposed to Obamacare.

    I'm gonna prolly get flamed for this but it is what it is.



    Michael
     
  22. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    #22
    I can sympathize, and I admit I can't be objective either. The first person in my scenario is my SO/wife. She wouldn't have a problem at all if a nurse, who questioned the doctor's orders and was overruled, applied a cauterizing stick of straight silver nitrate to her eyes, frying her cornea, retina, and optic nerve in one eye, and causing glaucoma to set in on the other eye, which was the one that needed the evisceration. All of this happened when she was born, FYI..

    But for something that wasn't her fault and has been a model person since. She even became a power lifter and held the world record for age and weight class at the time.

    Even if I didn't know her at all, I would rather have our tax dollars be spent to help her than this guy, especially if he went to the people's well for his healthcare.

    This. In this case, if we want to affect change, that change has to start internally, then work its way out. If we all changed our eating habits, the country's mortality rate due to heart disease would drop faster than Sarah Palin could mouth the words 'death panel', and for sure, our obesity rate would drop.

    BL.
     
  23. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2009
    #23
    If we could stop subsidizing the large-scale production of crap like HFCS and grain-fed beef, that would be a foot down the road to health. Then, we need to have an objective standard for nutrition – balance of fiber, fat, sugar, protein, etc – such that producers of trash-food will be penalized for marketing trash over real food. Yes, ultimately, the buyer will get hit with the penalty, but if it forces the producer to cut back on the sale of trash-food, real food will start to move in and take its place, leading to better overall health in the country.
     
  24. Mac'nCheese macrumors 68030

    Mac'nCheese

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2010
    #24
    Wait.......aren't you on the don't take our guns away side in the other threads? We can't take away a weapon from someone who might kill an innocent child but we can take a burger away from someone who is just hurting themselves?
     
  25. samiwas macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    #25
    This is a different thread..........
     

Share This Page