Dems decide to send DACA workers home

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Zombie Acorn, Oct 9, 2017.

  1. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #1
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ut-immigration-demands-including-wall-funding

    Trump requested 10k border workers, mandatory everify, change immigration to merit based vs family based, and funding for wall in exchange for formalizing the DACA program into law. Democrats say that these are breaking the good faith negotiation. They must have forgot that Obama and Democrats aren't in power anymore. Most Republicans would be fine with letting DACA lapse, if the Democrats want this program formalized there is going to be a heavy sacrifice. There will be no one to blame but Democrats if they don't come to the table on this one.
     
  2. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #2
    The bystander couldn't stop the murderer from killing their victim.

    It's all the bystanders fault.
     
  3. 0007776 Suspended

    0007776

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    #3
    The Republicans appear to not know how a negotiation works. They won’t be able to get the border security they want passed on their own, they have demonstrated that they can’t get any of their priorities done despite their majorities repeatedly. If they want to insist on wasting billions on a wall that does nothing they can sit there and take the electoral consequences of doing nothing.
     
  4. rjohnstone macrumors 68040

    rjohnstone

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    #4
    This is exactly how negotiations work.
    Dems want DACA codified into law.
    Reps want the list of **** in the OP.
    That's where you START a negotiation.
    If the Dems want to pickup their toys and go home, it's on them. The proper response is a counter offer. You go back and forth until an agreement is made.
    By walking away, the Dems will lose any chance of having DACA set into law. I guess those dreamers aren't worth a little expended political capitol on the Dems part.
     
  5. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #5
    Not a murder case, Dems want to codify something that technically breaks the laws on the book at this point. Time to pony up for it.
    --- Post Merged, Oct 9, 2017 ---
    Border security isn't on a timer, DACA is.
     
  6. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #6
    The GOP have a majority in Congress and the Presidency. DACA is entirely theirs now. They own this issue, just like every other issue during Trump's term. Blaming Democrats is silly. Even when the GOP is in power their supporters act like victims.
     
  7. 0007776 Suspended

    0007776

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    Here’s the thing, The Dems started with wanting just a bill to put DACA into law, when Trump said he wouldn’t include the wall they Democrats compromises and became willing to include some additional spending on border security. Instead of working to find a level of border security funding that would work for both sides Trump walked back on his part of the compromise. The guy couldn’t make a deal to save his life, he just wants his way or nothing.
     
  8. GermanSuplex macrumors 6502a

    GermanSuplex

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  9. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    #9
    You can blame democrats because the head democrat who occupied the oval office wrote the thing on a piece of paper that could be thrown in the trash by whomever succeeded him. This is the problem with trying to make immigration policy through presidential fiat rather than the legislature the way it should be done. Because it's too hard and because you won't get 100% what you want isn't a reason to do it via EO. I know the left is going to tell the "dreamers" it's all Trumps fault, when in reality their fate was written on the back of a napkin by the last guy.
     
  10. GermanSuplex macrumors 6502a

    GermanSuplex

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    #10
    It was written on the back of a napkin because that was all that would fit under the door. It was meant to buy time for a bipartisanship effort, but for the most part, all that means to republicans is “f u, you’re on your own, our donors need a new Cadillac”.

    To be fair to Trump, this is surprisingly the one issue he seems to want to get fixed. But all his other ****** policies seem to railroad this decent cause, so it’s a mixed bag.
     
  11. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    #11
    No it was written on the back of a napkin because Obama knew he couldn't get passed what La Raza or any of the other pro-immigration groups wanted and they were sick of hearing about how Obama has deported more people than any other president. It was a carrot to them. Only in the end all he ended up doing is passing the buck on to the next man/woman in line so it became their problem.
     
  12. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #12
    Don't think too many Republicans are going to care if DACA lapses, some of them were angry Trump gave a 6 month window. That's why Dems will need to play ball.

    They should also be careful about how they snub Trump on this one, he has a database of illegal immigrants now thanks to Obama.
     
  13. rjohnstone macrumors 68040

    rjohnstone

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    #13
    Nope... Legislation requires 60 votes in the Senate and the GOP only have 52. So while they have a majority, it is not sufficient without Dem support.
    Most don't really care about DACA, but will gladly use it as a bargaining chip.
    --- Post Merged, Oct 9, 2017 ---
    Trump denied ever making such a deal. Dems tried to corner him by making the claim right after their meeting.
    What they failed to realize is Trump isn't influenced that way.
     
  14. iLunar macrumors 6502

    iLunar

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    #14
    Pretty sick that Trump (and you) are playing politics with people's lives and families. Guess conservatives have truly lost all compassion.

    ICE will go down in history as the 2017 equivalent of brown shirts.
     
  15. rjohnstone macrumors 68040

    rjohnstone

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    #15
    Brown shirts??? Have you ever read a history book? Not even close my friend, not even close.
    ICE's job is to enforce immigration laws... period.

    As for compassion, a lot of us have lost a fair amount of it over the years.
    We have immigration laws for a reason. Anyone who fails to recognize them does not deserve any of my compassion.
    Dreamers are here do to the actions of their parents and I do feel for them, however I am not in favor of forgoing border security and immigration reforms just to make them happy.
     
  16. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #16
    Funny that your first sentence criticizes exactly what you do in your third. Enforcing existing law doesn't make ice brown shirts.
     
  17. oneMadRssn macrumors 601

    oneMadRssn

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    #17
    Please, tell me who is in power then? It's certainly not Republicans as they haven't been able to accomplish a single priority this term.
     
  18. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #18
    Funny you criticize this congresses ability to "get things done" when the whole reason we are in this mess is because Dems didn't "get things done" when they are in power. Pen and a phone indeed.
     
  19. oneMadRssn macrumors 601

    oneMadRssn

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    #19
    Yea, definitely didn't get things done. Except:
    • January 29, 2009: Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–2
    • February 4, 2009: Children's Health Insurance Program Reauthorization Act (SCHIP), Pub.L. 111–3
    • February 17, 2009: American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (ARRA), Pub.L. 111–5
    • March 11, 2009: Omnibus Appropriations Act, 2009, Pub.L. 111–8
    • March 30, 2009: Omnibus Public Land Management Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–11
    • April 21, 2009: Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act, Pub.L. 111–13
    • May 20, 2009: Fraud Enforcement and Recovery Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–21
    • May 20, 2009: Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–22
    • May 22, 2009: Weapon Systems Acquisition Reform Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–23
    • May 22, 2009: Credit CARD Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–24
    • June 22, 2009: Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, as Division A of Pub.L. 111–31
    • June 24, 2009: Supplemental Appropriations Act of 2009 including the Car Allowance Rebate System (Cash for Clunkers), Pub.L. 111–32
    [For Comparison, this is where we are in the timeline for this congress. That has so far accomplished two things: A appropriations act, and a sanctions bill on Iran, North Korea, and Russia. So 12 major acts of legislation under Democrat control, versus 2 under Republican control.]
    • October 28, 2009: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2010, including the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, Pub.L. 111–84
    • November 6, 2009: Worker, Homeownership, and Business Assistance Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111–92
    • December 16, 2009: Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2010, Pub.L. 111–117
    • February 12, 2010: Statutory Pay-As-You-Go Act, as Title I of Pub.L. 111–139
    • March 4, 2010: Travel Promotion Act of 2009, as Section 9 of Pub.L. 111–145
    • March 18, 2010: Hiring Incentives to Restore Employment Act, Pub.L. 111–147
    • March 23, 2010: Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, Pub.L. 111–148
    • March 30, 2010: Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act of 2010, including the Student Aid and Fiscal Responsibility Act, Pub.L. 111–152
    • May 5, 2010: Caregivers and Veterans Omnibus Health Services Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–163
    • July 1, 2010: Comprehensive Iran Sanctions, Accountability, and Divestment Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–195
    • July 21, 2010: Dodd–Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act, Pub.L. 111–203
    • July 29, 2010: Tribal Law and Order Act of 2010
    • August 3, 2010: Fair Sentencing Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–220
    • August 10, 2010: Securing the Preservation of Our Enduring and Established Constitutional Heritage Act, Pub.L. 111–223
    • September 27, 2010: Small Business Jobs and Credit Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–240
    • December 8, 2010: Claims Resolution Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–291
    • December 13, 2010: Healthy, Hunger-Free Kids Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–296
    • December 17, 2010: Tax Relief, Unemployment Insurance Reauthorization, and Job Creation Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–312, H.R. 4853
    • December 22, 2010: Don't Ask, Don't Tell Repeal Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–321, H.R. 2965
    • January 2, 2011: James Zadroga 9/11 Health and Compensation Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111–347, H.R. 847
    • January 4, 2011: Shark Conservation Act, Pub.L. 111–348, H.R. 81
    • January 4, 2011: Food Safety and Modernization Act, Pub.L. 111–353, H.R. 2751
     
  20. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #20
    Yet here DACA is, not codified in law, and the Democrats will pay dearly for it.
     
  21. oneMadRssn macrumors 601

    oneMadRssn

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    #21
    Will they? I thought you just said Democrats aren't in power.
     
  22. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    #22

    Which one of these deals with immigration reform?
     
  23. Zombie Acorn thread starter macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #23
    If they want DACA passed they will be at the table, if not it's not on the Republican wish list anyways. Bottom line DACAs not happening without border security.
     
  24. oneMadRssn, Oct 9, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2017

    oneMadRssn macrumors 601

    oneMadRssn

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    #24
    That might be how things work in Canada, but here in the US it is the party in charge that gets blamed when bad things happen. Whether it's on the Republican wish list or not is irrelevant. When the news shows videos of parents being ripped apart from their children, Republicans will be blamed because they have the "majority."

    But Republicans can't get anything done. Basically, this GIF sum up the Republicans right now:
    https://i.imgur.com/8Qyp3TK.gifv
     
  25. 0007776 Suspended

    0007776

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    #25
    Well even if Trump is telling the truth which is very rare, the Dems did offer a compromise from their original desire of a clean passing of DACA, and Trump offered nothing. The Republicans are in a civil war right now and can’t even pass an ACA repeal that they passed 50 times under Obama, Trump need the Democrats to work with him to get things done, while the Democrats can stand back and let Trump fail.
     

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