Did Iran sabotage Bush's effort to win the war?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by MACDRIVE, May 24, 2007.

  1. MACDRIVE macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #1
    I'm thinking Bush would've lost the war anyway, but Iran certainly didn't help by supplying sophisticated roadside bombs.

    General Shinseki said before the war started that the U.S would need somewhere in the neighbourhood of 4 to 5 hundred thousand troops to secure the country; I think he was very much right.
     
  2. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #2
    What is the proof and what is the scale of Iran's contributions?
     
  3. MACDRIVE thread starter macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #3
    I'm just going by the mainstream media reports and what General Abizaid said in a 60 minutes interview with Lara Logan.
     
  4. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #4
    Sounds like a bunch of crap to me.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Support_for_Lethal_Activity_in_Iraq

    OK. I don't really doubt that Iran isn't involved on various levels in Iraq, but saying that the US has failed because of Iran's involvement is a really pathetic excuse. If the US couldn't predict that a neighboring country that we are extremely hostile towards and have no diplomatic relations with would have a reaction to an invasion and occupation, the US administration is, once again, more naive and incompetent than I previously imagined.
     
  5. MACDRIVE thread starter macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    Explosive Formed Penetrators (EFP's) are widely suspected of being produced by Iran because of the sheer sophistication of the devices and of which cannot easily be produced on the battle field.

    ^ ^ ^
    That's not a quote by the way; I wrote that. ;)
     
  6. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #6
    The US did not need any help to lose this war.
     
  7. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #7
    Something like 90% of the people who attack us and each other are Iraqi. Al Qaeda is a tiny minority, and Iran is even less relevant. I can post links if you want, but this is pretty much a given.

    The only people who sabotaged this war are the Bush administration.
     
  8. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #8
    When the powers that be are confronted by resistance they inevitably invoke the scary outsiders fantasy,whether it be US military adventures that go wrong or when local people protest the building of a local Walmart.Whilst I'm sure the Iranian government is laughing up it's sleeve at US difficulties it has it's own problems to deal with without being responsible for every little thing that happens in the Middle East.As other posters have said a shred of evidence,other than US generals shooting their mouths off, may help me change my view of the situation.
     
  9. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #9
    yeah because obviously no iraqy can hold a soldering iron and in no case know enough about electronics to solder stock components together available at every better electronics shop
    after all those have been used before... and yes even by other terrorists: like in on attack on a car in germany by the RAF like 20 years ago and those had a lot less people available in support

    they are a fricking pipe closed on one side and a copper dish bent inwards on the other side... OMG it's so sophisticated

    i think we had that discussion before

    and if iran is providing weapons why bother with road side bombs who are highly ineffective and not real anti tank weapons ?
     
  10. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

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  11. geese macrumors 6502a

    geese

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    #11
    Silly. It was to pacify the middle east and make Iraq into a beacon of democracy, stability and economic success.

    This WILL happen, like in the next 200 years or so.
     
  12. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #12
    Despite what America and Britain have done...
     
  13. geese macrumors 6502a

    geese

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    #13
    I'm sure there will be some hardcore Blairites still in existance in 200 years time who'd argue it was still instrumental in bringing peace and stability, despite a civil war lasting 100 years!
     
  14. MACDRIVE thread starter macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #14
    Okay, I can see that the general consensus is that Iran has caused no trouble at all.
     
  15. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #15
    Iran's actual involvement is difficult to ascertain, however considering the multitude of the administration's mistakes, one can't help but think that the war was lost before Iran could have any effect.
     
  16. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #16
    Nor did the UK. ;)
     
  17. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    Interesting. Weren't EFPs also used in Lebanon by Hezbollah and by the Red Army Faction? And, hasn't the technology been used for 30 years, including on widely sold TOW missiles?
    It seems to me that EFPs are not evidence of Iranian involvement, but are rather the result of a long-term insurgency which has been able to important weapons and skills from a variety of nations, including Iran.
     
  18. SMM macrumors 65816

    SMM

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    #18
    The US taught the Afghans how to make the bloody things. We are not talking nuclear guidance systems here. This is a simple armor-piercing shaped charge. Regardless, America, UK, France, Russia, Spain and others, have been selling the full gambit of military munitions to every Middle-East country who has a checkbook. We have done this for years. I hardly think we should be surprised when they are used against us. I also have this nauseating vision of the last American troops marching out of Bagdad in disgrace, on their way to their airlift, and the people really dancing in the street. Then our 'silent' friends like Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, etc, will be jumping up to the microphone and taking credit for the part they played in driving out the infidel.
     
  19. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #19
    You forgot about the oil reserves. Er, to keep gas prices low I mean, of course. Oops. And get Saddam, who was a bad guy, who once we got rid of, all the Iraqi people could be free and their neighbors would no longer live in fear from opposing dominating forces who did horrible things like torture and kill innocent people. Plus we'd be safer from terrorism. Double oops.
     
  20. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #20
    The fact of the matter is, whatever amount of trouble Iran has caused is an amount that a competent administration and military leadership would have predicted and attempted to mediate. We're not talking about Togo here. If Togo were supplying aid to insurgents, that would be a surprise.
     

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