District believes teacher violated church-state provision

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by leekohler, Aug 26, 2011.

  1. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #1
    I'd say they have a good case. This guy's a real piece of work.

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/feat...-buell-facebook-rally-20110825,0,307026.story

    Fire this idiot- now. A public school is not a church.
     
  2. bassfingers macrumors 6502

    bassfingers

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    #2
    Separation of church and state was in a letter, not an official US document.

    The establishment cause restricts the US government from making a law which claims a religion. It should not affect the freedom of speech of state employees. Hopefully it is the school's decision, not a court's whether or not to keep the teacher.
     
  3. leekohler thread starter macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #3
    It has long been established that there indeed IS separation of church and state in this country. Courts have ruled on it so many times it should be obvious by now. It exists. If this teacher doesn't like that, he's the one who needs to leave, not the kids in his class. He had no right to do what he did. You don't tell kids on a syllabus to get out if they don't like religion. He is paid by the taxpayers- as such, he has a responsibility to teach the subject of his class, not preach.

    The school better fire him. If they don't, the court will do their job for them.
     
  4. SwiftLives macrumors 65816

    SwiftLives

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    #4
    Would you be okay if the teacher were Muslim and taught his students about "Allah's truth?"
     
  5. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #5
    It takes time to fire him. I expect that he will be put on paid leave while they do the investigation and then at the end fire him.

    I think this teacher really crosses the line. There are things I have no problem with teachers doing and then there is what this dumb ass is doing.

    An example of something that is acceptable is I had a college profession who in the first class of every semester while going over the syllabus would state that his religious belief was in Jesus Christ is his savory and what his beliefs where and that was the end of it. How it was done was really tasteful and he would make it clear that his class room was not a place to talk about it as it had nothing to do with the subject matter. I want to say it always came up when it got to section on religious stuff and missing class for it. He made it clear if you need to miss class for religions reason just talk with him before you missed class and it would not be an acceptable reason after the fact (or day of)

    How it was done I would fully support any teacher doing that no matter what they believe because it was only said on the first day just to get it out of the way and to shut done it being talked about in class.

    This guy on the other hand is forcing religion on to people.

    As for another teacher at the school I would say is an example of someone who crosses line where he flat out side if you do not believe in evolution or you believe in god drop the class for you will fail.
     
  6. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #6
    Regardless of the religion mumbo jumbo, he should be fired for the anti-gay comments alone. He's a high school teacher, and that's the age when gay teens are the most vulnerable. If he wants to believe in the anti-gay BS, that's fine, but he should keep his mouth shut especially when he more than likely has students who are gay.
     
  7. Heilage macrumors 68030

    Heilage

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  8. IntelliUser macrumors 6502

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    #8
    His Facebook comment was sooooooo Jesus-like. :rolleyes:
     
  9. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #9
    Calling all shrinks!!!!

    Another Messiah complex on Aisle 10.

    The guy on M*A*S*H was vastly better, and he had a valid excuse.
     
  10. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #10

    If he were preaching anything other than your man in the sky fairy tales, you'd be protesting the loudest.
     
  11. Shrink macrumors G3

    Shrink

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    #11
    I just had to laugh. How could he be Jesus Christ when I'm Jesus Christ. :cool: :p

    A tiny bit megalomaniacal you think maybe.

    Or, as we say in shrink biz - a serious nutcase. ;)
     
  12. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #12
    You're not at all concerned with his statement:

    Why should anyone care about Jesus Christ, especially in a public school? JC or any other god is totally irrelevant. He was hired to teach a specific curriculum, not to preach any particular form of religion. He is a public employee who has every right to believe in what he thinks but has no right whatsoever to preach any particular gospel while being paid by the city, state and federal government.

    Besides, the guy obviously has mental health issues. When he claims to be a de facto "Jesus' he's obviously suffering from delusion. He shouldn't be a teacher.
     
  13. appleguy123 macrumors 603

    appleguy123

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    #13
    I've also had good and bad experiences with teachers and religion.

    My English teacher makes it known that she is religious, but she doesn't force it on anyone, and it doesn't affect the curriculum any.

    On the other hand, my freshmen Science teacher's classroom was basically a religious propaganda facility. She had crosses all over it, and little fish that said 'Believe' on them; even signs about hell(she teaches Earth Science and that Hell is at the center of Earth). I have told her that these practices are illegal and that she should take them down, but she just said to deal with it, or stay out of her classroom.
     
  14. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #14
    well the teaching part she would be in the wrong on. The walls while I would call it unprofessional I would not call them illegal and chances are they would not be struck down in court.

    I choose my examples to point out that you can have a religions person who does not cross the line and have a atheist person who majorly crosses the line. I think the people who cross the line should be nailed but sadly I do not think an atheist crossing the line will ever be nailed sadly.
     
  15. jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #15
    I take it from the last sentence that this was a public school? If so, I hope you are exaggerating. If not-- this teacher is clearly incompetent to teach Earth Science and should be reassigned to be a PE teacher.
     
  16. appleguy123 macrumors 603

    appleguy123

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    #16
    Yes, it's a public school.
     
  17. Sankersizzle macrumors 6502a

    Sankersizzle

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    #17
    This is 2011, I didn't think people still believed in "god".
     
  18. appleguy123 macrumors 603

    appleguy123

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    #18
    I just found out a few years ago not that not believing was a legitimate world view. So freeing. I don't actually know anyone else that doesn't believe in God; except for on the internet.
     
  19. Sankersizzle macrumors 6502a

    Sankersizzle

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    #19
    Interesting! I was raised in a very liberal household, but religion was definitely there. But I was always one of those kids who would park himself in front of the Discovery Channel (back when it was dinosaurs, space and monkey sex -none of that reality crap they have now), so what little faith I had was quickly shaken. I never really bought into religion since I was born, I'm not sure.

    Now that I go to university (in Canada), I would say that 75-80% of the people I meet are atheist/don't subscribe to any religion. I'm not going to lie, but people often get made fun of around these parts if they are too overt with their faith. I can't think of a single friend I have that DOES go to Church, even once a month.
     
  20. Firestar macrumors 68020

    Firestar

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    #20
    I know several people who don't believe in God. Actually, the majority of my closer friends.

    I think he should be fired. Rodimus Prime and Leekohler both made intellectual posts about the subject.
     
  21. appleguy123 macrumors 603

    appleguy123

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    #21
    Evolution has nothing at all to do with religion. If I were a biology teacher, and a student insists on giving the wrong answers(at least according to empirical science and the curriculum) I would have no choice but to fail her. What would you do?
     
  22. Daffodil macrumors 6502

    Daffodil

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    #22
    Yeah, I think it's pretty sad when you have someone so blatantly misinforming students without anyone stepping in to stop it.

    I remember talking to one of the bio professors I TAed for, who also taught basic evolutionary theory to underclassmen, and he said one of the real failings of the system was seeing some bio majors go on to get degrees still unconvinced that evolution is more than a "theory." This even from a public (albeit large, hence more impersonal) university with a renowned biology program.

    I don't get why they have to take evolution - something that should be unproblematic even to religious types - and make it all political. Abiogenesis - sure, I can see more valid debate arising there, but evolution? That to me, seems like it's got to be ignorance or a direct unwillingness to deal in facts.

    Really, this ties all too nicely into the thread on whether/why the GOP is anti-science...
     
  23. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #23
    No teacher I have ever had has ever discussed their religious beliefs.
     
  24. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #24
    It seems like those participants in the discussion who say there is no separation of church and state really want religion plopped right into the middle of governance, but would they be happy if some other religion, other than Christianity, became the predominant religion? Or are they so confident that Christianity will always reign supreme in the U.S.?
     
  25. Rodimus Prime, Aug 28, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 28, 2011

    Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #25
    Never said that all teachers did. First time he did it it was a eye opening but it was done really tactfully. He is also the only teacher I had that has done it. I know it is rare for one to do it but it is a good example of something that is acceptable.

    There is the science part which you give those answers but if he found out you believed in god he made your life really rough and the normal curve for you went out the window.

    He was one of those athies that did everything in his power to force it on other people and did not respect others beliefs.
     

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