Dream Act blocked in senate

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by OutThere, Dec 18, 2010.

  1. OutThere macrumors 603

    OutThere

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    #1
    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/19/us/politics/19immig.html?_r=1&hp

    This is one of the areas where I have the most trouble settling on a coherent political stance, particularly because I consider myself very liberal. My father immigrated legally and jumped through all of the hoops to get citizenship here, and in principle I don't feel particularly warm towards illegal immigrants. I do, however, feel we're wronging these kids. Their home is America now, and they were brought here by parents and had little choice in the matter. They're unfairly in limbo. However, as a recent college graduate I'm also intimately aware of how insanely over-saturated the entry level 4-year degree job market is right now. Dilemma, dilemma.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. CorvusCamenarum macrumors 65816

    CorvusCamenarum

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    #2
    Just more amnesty.

    We can't afford to keep taking care of the neighbors' kids.
     
  3. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #3
    If you are a low-skilled worker, which is the category most in demand in the U.S., the quota is 5,000 annually, compared to a demand of 500,000 a year. Do the math.
     
  4. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #4
    I don't look very kindly on illegal immigrants either. The fact is, they are here. We can't keep them out. We can't deport them all. The only logical solution is to provide a path to citizenship for them. The vast majority are law abiding people. We could use their tax dollars too.
     
  5. coolmacguy macrumors regular

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    #5
    Pretty much. We should secure our borders so that as few more as possible can easily enter, then do something reasonable to integrate those who are already here and obviously won't be leaving.
     
  6. likemyorbs macrumors 68000

    likemyorbs

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    #6
    And also setting a quota for LEGAL immigration so that some people can actually come here legally. But the dream act should have passed because those people we are speaking of were brought here as young children by no choice of their own and are now americans.
     
  7. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #7
    Many of them were probably Americans before they crossed your border... :)
     
  8. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #8
    The only sensible approach. Gotta live with reality.
     
  9. CorvusCamenarum macrumors 65816

    CorvusCamenarum

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    #9
    By definition, they can't be law-abiding if they aren't here legally.
     
  10. likemyorbs macrumors 68000

    likemyorbs

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    #10
    Sure, lets go with that theory. :rolleyes: Ok fine, ill be more clear. They're not United Statians, they're Mexicans. And btw Statians is underlined in red on my mac because its not a real word, nor will it ever be. The end.
     
  11. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #11
    Well technically, but they can be law abiding in every other way.
     
  12. mgguy, Dec 18, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2010

    mgguy macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    #12
    Committing fraud, using false identification, stealing someone else's identity, using fraudulent SSNs or using the SSN of someone else, driving unlicensed, fleeing from a traffic collision, not appearing for a deportation hearing, and other crimes are commonly committed by illegal immigrants to be able to work, avoid detection and deportation, to travel, and do other things necessary for living in this country.

    Re: the DREAM act, perhaps we should make those eligible for it a deal: let them stay if their illegal-immigrant parents who broke the law to get them here step forward and agree to self-deportation.
     
  13. racer1441 macrumors 68000

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    #13
    No forgiveness for illegals. Should also drop the ability for their kids to be citizens just because they were born here.
     
  14. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #14
    We all need a little forgiveness. Shame on you.
     
  15. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #15
    How exactly are illegals entering the publically paid school systems? don't they require ssn information? Also are they receiving federal money for those required two years in college? My guess, yes, even though their parents are likely getting paid under the table. A clause requiring all family members except the child to be deported before amnesty is granted might suffice.
     
  16. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #16
    And, a better structure for guest workers with paths to citizenship would blunt this problem.

    So, we want the people willing to trade their family for citizenship? That sounds like a winning policy.
     
  17. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #17
    We need their tax dollars.

    Regarding this topic, ok, millions are here. How do we stop more from getting in? I've always thought that they need to go after employers, there are a lot less of them then illegal immigrants. As I see it, politicians stand up in public berating illegal immigrants, while certain businesses whisper in their ears how they need cheap labor. Is all being done that could be?

    My brother went to graduate school in Nova Scotia. He wanted to live in Canada after he graduated, but there was no way without the proper documentation. Maybe we need to take a lesson from Canada. How hard can it be to properly document workers?
     
  18. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #18
    Canada grants temp visas in sectors that they do not have proper supply of workers in and they typically require higher qualifications than your average Mexican illegal. Their leniency in granting citizenship is much more forgiving but they don't border a landfill.
     
  19. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #19
    Well first off SSN is not really need much for schools and schools never really check them. Hell once you are entered into the system schools generally give you a new number and that number is used for everything from that point.
    Also remember the parents more than likely gave their kids a fake SSN number and so the kids grew up believing that was their numbers.
     
  20. racer1441 macrumors 68000

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    #20
    Shame on you for hugging up to illegals.
     
  21. mgguy macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    #21
    Perhaps, but this and other such ideas, including having open borders, would require new or modified legislation and immigration policy. Until we change the law, which might take years, let's do all we can to enforce those we now have, including all of the laws I cited above as being violated by illegals as a necessity to live and work in this country and to avoid detection and deportation.

    Breaking up families is already an effect of illegal immigration, either by illegal immigrants leaving behind their children and other family members in their country of origination, or leaving family in this country behind when they are apprehended and deported. A common argument by illegal immigrants and their supporters is that if they are deported, they will have to leave behind their young children, many of whom are US citizens by birth. If keeping families together is of paramount concern, how can they give this option serious consideration?
     
  22. CorvusCamenarum macrumors 65816

    CorvusCamenarum

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    #22
    What they pay in taxes doesn't match what they receive in benefits. Not even close.

    I'd advocate for harsher penalties for knowingly employing illegals. I'd also advocate for billing an illegal's home country for any and all costs associated with returning them.
     
  23. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #23
    I have to say, I don't think the DREAM Act should have passed either. I agree we need some type of immigration reform, but I fail to see how this is really going to help. It just seems to me that it would encourage more illegal immigration, especially if people think they can at least get their kids US citizenship. I'm more for working with what we have and simplifying that process so it's not so difficult to get here.
     
  24. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #24
    It's a shame the Dream Act didn't pass. Here in California, there are plenty of Mexican, Latin and South American illegals. To many immigrants, it's enough to get a reasonable paying, steady service jobs but unfortunately too many of their children never see past that level.

    It would be great to have more eager, educated, publicly visible hispanic Americans in this state. There have been a lot of stories in the papers about kids who didn't know their status until they applied for college. Two wrongs don't make a right. Why deport these kids when all they know is the US?
     
  25. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #25
    Do they not deserve any human dignity?
     

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