Everyone we fight in Iraq is now "al-Qaida"

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by zimv20, Jun 24, 2007.

  1. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #1
    salon

    i'd noticed something on cnn.com the other day, talking about how many AQ fighters were killed in iraq. didn't think much of it at the time, but now...

    amazing how our press is still reguritating WH garbage.
     
  2. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #2
    Its funny how many "Senior " operatives have been captured. Vietnam...Iraq.... whats the difference both Bulls... wars brought to us by politicians and special interests.
     
  3. SMM macrumors 65816

    SMM

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    #3
    Nice catch. In Vietnam we had to call them the North Vietnamese and Viet Cong Communist Aggressors. AQ sure is an easier term to get out your lips.

    I find this news slanting as disturbing as you do. It is a universal practice to 'label' your enemy. When the WH decided to call the Iraqis 'insurgents', I had to laugh. The term insurgency refers to an uprising against a sovereign state. But, we had just removed the government that existed. Iraq is a resistance movement, which is a conflict waged against an invading/occupational army. But, we sure could not call these guys 'resistance fighters', or (even worse) 'freedom fighters'. To a large degree, that is what most are.

    There are many other dynamics at work in Iraq. There is a political civil war, a religious civil war, numerous splinter groups and ethnic groups and finally there is AQ and the Islamic Jihad. However, the AQ in Iraq is largely unassociated with the international AQ. They are not well organized and are largely independent of each other. They are more like AQ Lite.

    The administration used two main excuses for invading Iraq. The first was the WMD and the second was the ties between Iraq and international terrorism, AQ specifically. Neither of these were true and the administration knew it. This was not a case of bad intel. Leading up to the invasion, we had UN inspectors on the ground in Iraq. They found NOTHING! But the administration kept pounding away daily; AQ-Iraq, AQ-Iraq, AQ-Iraq, Smoking Gun-Mushroom Cloud, Smoking Gun-Mushroom Cloud, Smoking Gun-Mushroom Cloud.

    The WH lied through their teeth, and the major media outlets played an equal part in the deception. The NYT was only eclipsed by FOX as the worst of the lot. Leading up to the war, the Times ran well over 100 front page articles, and opinion pieces making the case for war. There was an incredible amount of evidence to directly counter, or cast doubt on the WH's claims. A few journalists got it right. But at the NYT and WP, those stories were always hidden in the 'back pages'.

    The NYT has never admitted any culpability, wrongdoing, or even mistakes in helping lead us into this godforsaken war. I think they have the blood of 3,500 young Americans and 40,000 Iraqis on their hands. They gave up journalism and have become a spin outlet for the administration. There are no longer any secrets for what the Iraq war was, and is.....an immoral disaster. The media companies can come clean and try to repair the damage they have helped in creating. For tens of thousands, it will never be undone. Yet, when I see the propaganda machine, still churning out the WH lies, I find it very disappointing. No society can remain free without an independent, vital fourth estate. It must maintain its public trust, regardless of which way the political winds blow. When journalism takes second-seat to advertising dollars, the public has been betrayed.
     
  4. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    There are more trouble makers in Iraq than just al Qaeda.

    bbc

    AL-QAEDA IN IRAQ
    MUJAHIDEEN SHURA COUNCIL
    SUNNI NATIONALISTS
    ANSAR AL-ISLAM
    SHIA MILITIAS
    MEHDI ARMY
    BADR BRIGADE


    The article talks about "pro-government" reporting. Thats probably the stupidest thing I've heard all week. Apparently the guy never watches Keith Olbermann. Its a case of if you're looking for it, you will find it.

    Also I don't doubt that the public gets some propaganda. The censoring of airing dead american soldiers could be considered that. But the war on terror ;) is against terrorists proper, not Iraqi nationalists. Which is possibly the reason why they spared Muqtada al-Sadr. The US strategy isn't just spraying bullets in a crowd hoping to kill bad guys. Maybe you hear "qaeda qaeda qaeda" is because thats who they're targeting right now.
     
  5. FFTT macrumors 68030

    FFTT

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    #5
    I've been bugged by this continuous reference to Al Qaeda when we all know these are AQ copy cat wanna bes or sympathizers, nothing more.

    Rebel factions would be a more appropriate description.
     
  6. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #6
    The constant use of the term "terrorists" to describe all of the violent political movements in the world is also a real frustration to me. Terrorism, however it's defined, is a means, not an end. We'd do better to understand the goals of these groups than to focus on their method of achieving them.
     
  7. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    The idea that the media are voluntarily repeating this kind of propaganda is alarming to me, especially since you'd think they'd have learned their lesson after the Bush-Iraq-WMD debacle.

    Whether it's plain lazy reporting or government influence, it's still on the slippery slope to Newspeak.
     
  8. adroit macrumors 6502

    adroit

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    #8
    I've discussed this several times with my friends over the last couple years. It seems more and more prevalent that the attackers being mentioned in news articles are being identified as AQ fighters. The phase " . . . who have links to Al Qaeda" seem to be a qualifier for all groups these days.

    It's gotten to the point that I wont be surprised to hear on the news "Mossad, who have links to Al Qaeda, . . . " :rolleyes:
     
  9. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #9
    I think they should start saying "Bush, who has links to Bin Laden".
     
  10. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    It must be because of the well-known liberal bias of the news media.
     
  11. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #11
    Whoops.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6239896.stm
     
  12. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #12
    At least now I know who I am shooting at. I really don't care what you call them. You shoot at me, I shoot back.
     
  13. Henri Gaudier macrumors 6502a

    Henri Gaudier

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    #13
    Skunk puts together a very thought provoking post and you come back with that! It's moronic.

    I take it from your avatar that you're in the military. You must understand that you've traveled thousands of miles to invade anothers country and you deserve everything you get! If it was reversed and Iraqi soldiers were in the US you'd agree. Yes?

    As for the OP's original assertion - I've found the same thing. A very recent undeniable change in reporting. Horrific.
     
  14. Queso macrumors G4

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    #14
    Can I just ask whether you're in Iraq or Afghanistan? If you're allowed to say that is.
     
  15. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #15
    Ahh yes, please believe everything you read in the papers. Trust me, being there and sitting playing arm chair quaterback is two different things.

    What thoughts did it provoke in you?

    Everything I deserve, I wouldn't expect less from the French. Thanks, you are awesome:rolleyes:

    All I was saying for a Soldier who gets shot at doesn't care if its AQ, insurgents, Sunni/*****, if you shoot at me, I will shoot back.

    I was commenting on the original post.

    You can call it what you want.
     
  16. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #16
    Been to both, 2 in Afghanistan, 1 in Iraq
     
  17. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    I don't see how we can expect accurate information from any source in Iraq. Everyone has an agenda, which seems to be exclusive of every other agenda. Even a diligent press is going to have an almost impossible time sorting out the competing claims, and we know the press isn't always interested in making the effort.
     
  18. Queso macrumors G4

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    #18
    That's very true for the people on the front line and in the heat of the moment, but not such a valid argument for how those events are then reported. If the people killed are from one of the groups associated with Al-Qaeda then fair enough, but in this case it's another friendly fire incident only with Iraqis killed other than western troops. Do we know who shot first yet?
     
  19. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #19
    Exactly. That's what pisses me off the most. What are you supposed to believe? An unbiased media, leaders, Iraqis, Afghans, who? I guess you just formulate your own thoughts and make biased accusations on what you perceive is the thruth. Ohh wait thats an opinion.

    I will try to stay away from my polictial opinions. I will only tell you from my personnel opinion on how I see things on the ground.
     
  20. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #20

    Edandlindz28 do you believe you did a good thing by going to these two countries,do you believe you did the right thing by joining the military?
     
  21. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #21
    Which is the primary reason why we need to get out of that country with all due haste. We can't sort out their problems; we can only continue get in between them.
     
  22. Henri Gaudier macrumors 6502a

    Henri Gaudier

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    #22
    I'll get banned again if I say what I want to fully so I'll keep it nice and tight. I get constant nationalistic remarks here about being French. Nationalism is very primitive thinking. I understand your remark about how it doesn't matter what the name of the shooter is - a bullet .. is a bullet. But you shouldn't be there!

    If Polish people smashed into the Eiffel tower and in retaliation we invaded America because of how you fund terrorism through black ops and the CIA made it publicly easy to invade you rather than Poland and we killed you by the 10's of thousands after a decade long victimisation of you through the UN and literally killed 7.5* million of your children. What would you think of the French soldiers in your town?

    * Iraq has a population of 20 million and according to the UN 500,000 children died as a direct result of the sanctions imposed by the US. Scale that figure up to a country with a population of 300 million and there you have it - a children's holocaust and the perpetrators are still respectable and getting your votes. Peace.
     
  23. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #23
    Sounds easier than it is. Do I think we can sort out their problems, no, but can we help them yes. It will take time. Time that I don't think the American people will stand for. There were times we should have gone right instead of left. It is a slow process for both Iraq and Afghanistan and I wish it could be faster.

    We are bringing democracy to a part of the world that never had it. Freedoms they never lived. It's not easy for them, their culture/religion/beliefs sometimes don't coincide with what we think is right vs wrong, good vs bad.

    The good thing about going into these countries is that more people are free and freedom is not something everyone wants. I am proud to serve my country. No matter what others say or think.
     
  24. Edandlindz28 macrumors regular

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    #24
    Okay, I am sorry for the French comment. Shouldn't have made it, but Iraq and the French is two things I will avoid.

    I serve with some great French soldiers in Afghanistan. I respect them and they are doing a great job.
     
  25. gauchogolfer macrumors 603

    gauchogolfer

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    #25
    Even the US account doesn't claim that the helicopters were fired upon. The attack was pre-emptive, and directed at friendly Iraqis, if the local accounts are to be believed.
     

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