Evidence of Torture in the Prehistoric Southwest US

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by aaronvan, Nov 3, 2014.

  1. aaronvan Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #1
    Talk about politicized science. About twenty or so years ago, scientists reported human flesh in pre-Columbian human feces. Well, that set or a firestorm of criticism from the usual politically-correct suspects. Despite reams of hard data and peer-reviewed publications, the deniers attacked the science and the scientists (sound familiar?) because their research contradicted the myth of the Noble Savage living in peace and harmony until genocidal Europeans invaded Eden. They didn't attack their methodology or the data; they attacked the conclusion that acts of cannibalism had occurred over one thousand years ago at a specific location in what is now Arizona.

    I wonder of this study in the International Journal of Paleopathology will engender the same hysterical, over-the-top reaction? Hopefully, society has matured to a point where scientific research isn't perceived as an attack on any social class or ethnic grouping. I find archeology damn interesting, too, and attempts to suppress it or any other science are egregious, pernicious, and outrageous.

    http://bonesdontlie.wordpress.com/2...e-of-torture-in-the-prehistoric-southwest-us/
     
  2. citizenzen macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #2
    That doesn't sound like a reasonable position, or one that I remember hearing before.

    Who is advocating this "noble savage living in peace and harmony" myth?

    Sounds pretty fringe to me.
     
  3. localoid macrumors 68020

    localoid

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Location:
    America's Third World
    #3
    And in other news, archaeologists have discovered physical evidence that the European Jamestown Colonists Resorted to Cannibalism during the Starving Time of 1609-1610 at Jamestown, Virginia, the first permanent English settlement in the New World.

    Developing...
     
  4. FreemanW macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Location:
    The Real Northern California
    #4
    . . . . . and this just in from Donner Pass, CA . . . . . . .
     
  5. aaronvan thread starter Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #5
    Great example. That study was accepted without any controversy at all.

    Well, it's pretty much accepted by scholars today that the Donner Party stories of cannibalism were promoted by the penny dreadfuls of the time. If you've ever been to the Truckee Pass it's easy to see why: a blind man could catch game in those rich forests. They did eat their dogs and oxen, though.
     
  6. localoid macrumors 68020

    localoid

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Location:
    America's Third World
    #6
    Most of the so-called "civilized societies" aren't always what they're cracked up to be, are they?
     
  7. aaronvan thread starter Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #7
    I am very glad I live in the Northwest United States and not in Eastern Syria. Civilized society is superior in every respect than uncivilized society.
     
  8. localoid macrumors 68020

    localoid

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Location:
    America's Third World
    #8
    I wonder... Is there any chance at all that the earth's intelligent lifeforms will survive long enough to evolve into a multicultural, scientific, tolerant society in the future?

    Or do the machines need to win in order for that to happen?
     
  9. aaronvan thread starter Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #9
    When we finally develop Artificial Super-Intelligence, things will be much different. Troubling issues of race, science, and religion will be quaint and outdated.

    The ASI won't love us; nor will they hate us. However, we are made of atoms that they can use for other things...
     
  10. Mousse macrumors 68000

    Mousse

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2008
    Location:
    Flea Bottom, King's Landing
    #10
    So were all gonna be nothing more than Minecraft games for this ASI.:eek: I for one welcome our ASI Overlords.
     
  11. localoid macrumors 68020

    localoid

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Location:
    America's Third World
    #11
    "Gonna be?"

    Perhaps this existence is a simulation and we already are.
     
  12. aerok macrumors 65816

    aerok

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    #12
    What is the Matrix? :p
     
  13. chown33 macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2009
    #13
    Take the elevator to the thirteenth floor, and it's the second door on the left.
     
  14. aerok, Nov 3, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2014

    aerok macrumors 65816

    aerok

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    #14
    Will there be a red pill and a blue pill waiting for me there?
     
  15. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2002
    Location:
    Republic of Ukistan
    #15
    I am told that long pig is delicious, with the right garnish.
     
  16. aaronvan thread starter Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #16
    The end is nigh. :eek:
     

    Attached Files:

  17. APlotdevice, Nov 3, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2014

    APlotdevice macrumors 68040

    APlotdevice

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2011
    #17
    Noble savage? Okay, first off, that term in itself is highly derogatory. Second, according to the article you've linked to, this fossil evidence dates back to between 710-825 CE. That's about eight centuries before any European would step foot into that area. Third, and this may come as a shock to you, but Native Americas were and are people. In fact they were many different groups of people, possessing a variety of different languages, cultures, and beliefs.
     
  18. chown33 macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2009
    #18
    It's a stock character, if not an outright trope or myth, dating to at least 1672:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_savage
    I am as free as nature first made man,
    Ere the base laws of servitude began,
    When wild in woods the noble savage ran.

    I think the point of the OP is that the characterization does have mythological qualities that belie reality.
     
  19. citizenzen macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #19
    Yes, but realistically, who believes that and is outraged when science challenges that notion?
     
  20. localoid macrumors 68020

    localoid

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2007
    Location:
    America's Third World
    #20
    Sure about that? The OP's reference to "the myth of the Noble Savage living in peace and harmony until genocidal Europeans invaded Eden" seems to imply something rather different that what you're suggesting.
     
  21. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
    Location:
    The Misty Mountains
    #21
    I glanced over this and the link quickly and did not catch the politization of science, just a report that ancient humans tortured each other on occasion. something I think we all ready knew. Some modern humans seem fond of the practice...
     
  22. aaronvan thread starter Suspended

    aaronvan

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Location:
    República Cascadia
    #22
    That refers to the 1990s report and the backlash, as reported in Scientific American. The deniers have since moved on to other things.
     
  23. citizenzen macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #23
    So we're discussing something that occurred ~20 years ago?

    Talk about necroposting.
     

Share This Page