Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by FX120, Nov 13, 2009.
I don't really have to say anything, the story speaks for itself.
It will be interesting to see how this ends.
I seriously ***** hate this country sometimes.
I don't see what the issue is. Guns are like bombs. If you find a bomb in your garden bin, do you pick it up and carry it into a police station?
Cops in Britain are unarmed, which means the instant he pulled it out his bag the whole place would have gone into lockdown and the armed Tactical Response Unit would have been called out and every known alarm would have been set off for the safety of the officers.
What I like about laws like this is they are blanket. No smart-a lawyer to get you off on a technicality or unusual circumstances or 'intent'. The law is quite clear. Possession is possession. Full stop. Carry it around, you own it. No excuses. Just don't pick a gun up. Ever. Especially one that's not yours.
Just like drug dealers can't claim they just found the heroin in their pocket on the street. This way they can send bank robbers to prison just for having a gun, not having to prove they actually used it in a hold up. Why do you think they dumped it in the first place?
I can well imagine American bleeding-heart gun-hugging liberals who love to go soft on law breakers being outraged by this story though.
I don't think this is a fair verdict. However, I also don't think this guy made the right decision. He should have called the authorities, not taken it upon himself to transport an illegal weapon.
British = Subjects
Americans = Citizens
Just a suggestion people of Britain, but it might be a good idea to stop printing the face of an unelected ruler, who views you as her "property", on your money. Just my opinion
Go ahead and imprison your soldiers who are trained to use weaponry, when a real war happens kiss yourselves goodbye. Guess who is saving the world in the next world war.... the people that know how to use weaponry.
I guess there really is truth in the old saying....No good deed ever goes unpunished. Hopefully he won't get jail time.
Right, because this has anything at all to do with the Queen .
It sounds like maybe the law has been mis-applied here and certainly morally he isn't guilty, but probably one of the issues here is that everyone's hands are fairly tied by the law. If its possible I think he needs to be pardoned to be honest.
Everyone is subject to the law, even the monarch.
That being said, I'd be quite happy to pension off the lot of them.
Sometimes the law is an ass
but what was he thinking?
OK, I feel sorry for the guy. But… If I found a shotgun in my garden I wouldn't take it down to the police station…
And why take it out of the bin bag when inside the station?
I still like the Disneyland idea…
The thing is he's an ex-soldier and he's used to carrying guns, and knows they are dangerous. Unfortunately sometimes life experience dictates you to do the wrong thing - like I probably cross the road dangerously because I've been in the developing world a lot where that behaviour is considered "safe".
I understand that…
And as far as crossing the road goes, I too have lived in countries where crossing the road anywhere anytime anyhow is fair game. But I also lived long enough in places like Singapore where crossing the road would get me a pretty nasty fine… so that leaves me to always think before I do.
I am not demonising the guy. I do think he is being treated unfairly. But, he really should have thought, hang on, right now I am not a soldier, I am a civilian, and civilians do not carry shotguns into police stations. The average PC will get the sh*t scared out of him/her when confronted with a gun. Especially when it gets pulled out of a black bin bag.
That is the law going crazy and taking it at face value and not taking into account that he was doing the right thing.
If you cannot trust a soldier that is trained to handle weapons then who???
This is why this country is going to **** because of stupid laws that punish those that want to do the right thing but now wont because they end up being the bad guy.
This is a sad day for England...
Coming in the wake of the Fort Hood incident, this is quite ironic.
If the guy had a shotgun licence, he would have been OK. If he did not, he had no business taking the thing onto the street, carrying it into a police station or unwrapping it. In addition, he probably destroyed any forensic evidence by handling it.
The simple answer to this question is that nobody can be trusted 100% to handle weapons. Nobody is perfect and hence will make mistakes and everybody is prone to labile emotions from time to time that clouds judgement.
As far as this guy goes he might have acted in good faith but what a moron. Walking around in public with a gun that he has no idea how safe it is. Combined with the fact that if it was used in a crime and he examined it to see if it was loaded he could have destroyed any kind of evidence. Being a soldier he should have known better and just let it be until people properly qualified came by. He certainly didn't show the kind of judgement you'd hope someone in the military might have.
Somehow I don't think it will be soldiers who save the world. Life is a little more complicated than that.
This is exactly why I, as a well trained and experienced Paramedic rarely help people when I am off duty and a "civilian". People will gladly set aside common sense to stand behind laws that were developed for a purpose that are completely irrelevant in a particular incident. I'm not about to chance getting sued because I tried to help someone and they died because I didn't have any equipment since I am off duty. It's truly sad that I have to take that into account.
Can't you perform standard first aid?
^^^^Yeah there are good Samaritan laws that stipulate that you can come to the aid of people in a way that doesn't exceed your capacity or capabilities.
Perhaps it is time for a different job if you value someone's life behind a fear of being sued?
Well, the verdict seems somewhat overdone. I do think, however, that he should not have taken the gun out of the bag. He should have taken the bag there, and explained that inside is a gun, he found it *somewhere* and wanted to turn it in.
Here in Norway, for a while the Police gave amnesty to anyone who turned in illegal firearms to be destroyed, it was a good take on it. The most important thing was getting those guns off the streets, and they did a good job with it.
There are weapon amnesties in the UK from time to time. But walking into a police station saying I have a gun in this bag isn't really different to wacking it out.
If he bothered to phone up the police station and speak to the Chief Superintendent why didn't he say I have found a gun and want to bring it in rather than surprise him with it. Then the policeman would've taken the appropriate steps to recover the gun from his house rather than pose a risk to the public at large.
Do I think that it is a bit too far for prison, yes probably.
Do I think the person was stupid, yes.
Would I have done the same, no.
Would I expect others to do it, yes.
so he called the police and asked if he could "pop in and see him" without telling telling him that he found a gun on his property and he wanted to give it to him ?
while the punishment might not fit with his intentions it sure fits with him lacking any common sense
Pretty much how I feel about it.
As to why not just leave it in the rubbish bin, I can see him fearing that some kid or miscreant might come and take it out.
Yeah, but look what you'd have to face if you came here: