"Expelled": No intelligence, period.

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Thomas Veil, Apr 28, 2008.

  1. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2004
    Location:
    OBJECTIVE reality
    #1
    So I'm looking at the entertainment section of the newspaper, and there's this ad with Ben Stein looking like a naughty schoolboy, for a movie called "Expelled".

    [​IMG]

    Any notion I had that this might be an amusing comedy was quickly dispelled when I read the ad's sole review quote, something to the effect of, "This is the kind of movie we might get if we force-fed Michael Moore truth serum." The reviewer was from the Washington Times. Okay, got it. This is going to be some bogus right-wing screed.

    Just out of curiosity I looked this thing up online, and boy, does it look shady. Expelled Exposed has essentially the same purpose as those right-wing websites that try to "prove" Michael Moore is a liar -- except that Expelled Exposed appears to debunk the film without straining, whereas the right-wing sites that try to enumerate Michael Moore's supposed "lies" strain like a guy trying to pass a king-sized turd.

    Hell, even the guy who wrote the entry at Wikipedia has taken a giant ax to the film, deconstructing it with a long and apparently well-thought-out and -researched essay.

    Okay, I want to be fair -- I'll see this movie at some point, so I'm not just blowing smoke about something I haven't seen. But given the negative publicity attendant on this film, I sure ain't gonna give these guys any of my hard-earned money to see it. It comes to TNT or something, I'll watch it.

    Short of that, I can only echo the comment of others (at the links I posted above) that they're surprised a guy as smart as Ben Stein could get involved in something so unscrupulous. But then, I recall from Win Ben Stein's Money that the guy has a tremendous capacity for remembering facts; that doesn't necessarily translate into good judgment or common sense.

    If anyone has seen this, I wonder if you could verify for us whether this film is as deceitful as its critic indicate?
     
  2. wordmunger macrumors 603

    wordmunger

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2003
    Location:
    North Carolina
    #2
    I haven't seen the movie, but you might check out this site, sponsored by the National Center for Science Education, showing the film's many abuses. Yeah, it's a bunch of propaganda. I'm surprised Ben Stein was willing to be involved in it. He really makes a fool of himself.
     
  3. glocke12 macrumors 6502a

    glocke12

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2008
    #3
    You guys dont think Michael Moores work is anything but biased, left wing rhetoric ?
     
  4. wordmunger macrumors 603

    wordmunger

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2003
    Location:
    North Carolina
    #4
    Can't BOTH movies be biased? I'd argue that this movie is more biased, but really it's two separate questions.

    This movie does use some of Moore's techniques, but if you don't like Moore's techniques in the service of liberalism, why would you like them when put in the service of the fundamentalist anti-science agenda?
     
  5. glocke12 macrumors 6502a

    glocke12

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2008
    #5

    I did not say thats what I was doing. I just find it ironic that the first two posters call this right wing bias, while ignoring the fact the Moore is the king of ultra left wing bias.

    Whether ultra left, or ultra right, this type of stuff generally just does more harm than good.
     
  6. maestro55 macrumors 68030

    maestro55

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2005
    Location:
    Goat Farm in Meridian, TX
    #6
    I went to watch it knowing what kind of film it was going to be. I was probably the only Atheist in the audience. I lost interest within the first 10 minutes but kept watching only to have the movie compare those of us who believe in evolution to be Nazi's. Though it did inspire me to go and read the Richard Dawkins book "The God Delusion".

    Interesting tidbit they had a clip in the film of Dean Kelly from Baylor University (one of the movie's targets since the Baptist University took down a professors website discussing Intelligent Design). I actually had Lunch in March of 2006 in San Antonio during the ACM-ICPC World Finals with Dean Kelly, President Lilley, one of the computer science professors Bill Booth (just so happened that Mr. Booth was sitting with my computer teacher and I and the Baylor big wigs joined us at our table). I of course didn't mention the fact that I was a liberal atheist and kept my mouth shut most of the time. But that is a different story for a different time.

    I knew Ben Stein was rather conservative (I mean he wrote speeches for two crooks) but I didn't know he was that much of a right wing nut.
     
  7. walangij macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2007
    Location:
    MI
    #7
    Haven't watched it, but from some colleagues who are Christians who have watched it and I note that they have been trained in biological sciences. They don't agree with the practices in the film either, "pure entertainment" in their words, no substance. Hell if moderate christians think a movie on intelligent design is junk then that says something.
     
  8. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #8
    Not seen it, and having just read the blurb at Wikipedia I don't think I'll bother. Sounds like the one movie that would make a Michael Moore film seem good :D
     
  9. glocke12 macrumors 6502a

    glocke12

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2008
    #9
    Ive always thought Ben Stein was pretty level headed. Are you guys sure this isnt meant to be satire?
     
  10. Thomas Veil thread starter macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2004
    Location:
    OBJECTIVE reality
    #10
    That's the only way I think this movie could be any good, if it were a satire, a la The Colbert Report.

    I expect this movie will, however, become fodder for science, philosophy and journalism courses, as an example of how not to make a rational argument.
     
  11. EricNau Moderator emeritus

    EricNau

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    #11
    Absolutely positive; if anything, Ben Stein is more pigheaded. It's nothing more than a propagandist creationist movie meant to smear the reputation of science. They don't even bother to correctly portray evolution, or present evidence in support for intelligent design; they're just flinging mud.

    Any religiously-oriented person viewing this film should be aware and ashamed of the level of dishonesty and deceit that went into filming this movie (such as setting up interviews under false pretenses). Everything is very nicely detailed at http://www.expelledexposed.com
     
  12. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2004
    Location:
    The Mergui Archipelago
    #12
    I love the rotten tomatoes summary of this film;

    It's currently pulling 9% :). Just behind Prom Night. Funnily enough sites like Christianity Today seem to be the only one's convinced the film accomplished anything at all besides being an embarrassment :rolleyes:. Also venture down to the comments section for a hilarious chrisitian ID seizures that put youtube to shame.


    Edit: Requesting all quotes from IDers posted in this thread are done in comic sans.
     
  13. Aranince macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2007
    Location:
    California
    #13
    I just find it funny how everyone is so quick to attack anything that is remotely against the unmoral teachings of today's world.
     
  14. ZiggyPastorius macrumors 68040

    ZiggyPastorius

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2007
    Location:
    Berklee College of Music
    #14
    Whatever you say. When Ben Stein parades around, making claims like "Evolutionists (whatever that word really means) base their whole theory off lightning striking a mud puddle," or "It's considered a crime to present the idea that maybe Earth didn't come from random chance," the classic creationist strawman argument, it's kind of annoying. It uses propoganda to turn the whole of religious America towards intelligent design and this belief that evolution is an evil incarnation of Satan himself. The makers of this film told the interviewees such as Richard Dawkins it was going to have a completely different title, and that it was going to be about something completely different, and it turned into this. If you think people not wanting people of this level of ignorancy in charge of our educational agenda, then you keep your kids home and have them learn nothing but the Bible; I'm sure they'll do very well in the world.
     
  15. Thomas Veil thread starter macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2004
    Location:
    OBJECTIVE reality
    #15
    Well, first of all, I believe you mean "immoral"; second, the movie is said to discuss creation "science", not morality; and third, what immorality is the world teaching?
     
  16. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #16
    I find it funny that that's the best you can do to defend this piece of obvious propaganda.
     
  17. NAG macrumors 68030

    NAG

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2003
    Location:
    /usr/local/apps/nag
    #17
    How can you even discuss this movie? It godwin's itself by comparing scientists to nazis. Oh yeah, lots of intelligent debate there. Sheesh.
     
  18. John.B macrumors 601

    John.B

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Location:
    Holocene Epoch
    #18
    Do you hold language arts in the same regard as scientific endeavors? ;)

    “Me fail english? Thats unpossible.”
    Ralph Wiggum
     
  19. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2004
    Location:
    The Mergui Archipelago
    #19
    You're confused. We are all attacking the immoral movie with it's lies, deceit, and complete lack of merit. You need look no further for exactly what's wrong with the world
     
  20. NAG macrumors 68030

    NAG

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2003
    Location:
    /usr/local/apps/nag
    #20
  21. maestro55 macrumors 68030

    maestro55

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2005
    Location:
    Goat Farm in Meridian, TX
    #21
    My girlfriend's mother is a retired teacher, and a Christian. So I wanted to get her thoughts on teaching creationism vs. Darwin's theory of evolution in public science classrooms. She feels that we should be teaching science and leaving creationism to the churches. Now that doesn't surprise me as she is a rather liberal person despite her believe in God and activity in her church.

    My step-mom is also a teacher and will actually be teaching science starting in the Fall. I asked her what she thought and she will also be teaching evolution (in hopes that there won't be a backlash considering she is moving from a large city school to a rural school to take on a science position). She isn't religious at all so again no surprise.

    My High School Biology teacher was very religious and spoke briefly about Darwin's theory but made it clear she didn't want to teach it and supported creationism. I didn't lean very much from the woman anyhow.
     
  22. vniow macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2002
    Location:
    I accidentally my whole location.
    #22

    Take a note here everyone, this is sarcasm at its most adequate.
     
  23. furcalchick macrumors 68020

    furcalchick

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Location:
    South Florida
    #23
    it's about time the "evolution contradicts the bible" idea met some opposition from other christians in the mainstream. i know a bunch of christians that believe that evolution is not contrary to the bible, as evolution does not address any kind of origins or biogenesis for one. i'm just sick and tired of hearing that evolution is atheism when the two are not linked. i personally think ID is stupid and more of an easy out clause for fundamentalists to avoid/ignore science and a bad sign of what else they may be doing.

    expelled sounds like a propaganda film from what i've read on here and on other sites and i won't be watching it, despite many of the ID backers saying that true christians should watch.
     
  24. Mike Teezie macrumors 68020

    Mike Teezie

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2002
    #24
    Mine did the same thing. She said, "I'm required by State law to teach you this, but I want to say that I am completely against it."

    She covered Darwin's ideas in 30 seconds, and moved on. This was GT AP Biology II.

    This is the same teacher that made a point to tell all incoming students that yes, she was a virgin because she had never been married, and premarital sex is an abomination in God's eyes.

    The south rules.

    :(

    On topic, Ben Stein sure made an ass of himself. What a ridiculous piece of propaganda - tailor made for those with that raging persecution complex. They'll make a mint.
     
  25. NAG macrumors 68030

    NAG

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2003
    Location:
    /usr/local/apps/nag
    #25
    Wow, I'm sorry that your science education was such a joke. I knew there were some teachers that had no business teaching science (there was an english teacher "teaching" science in the middle school I attended...to her credit she tried to actually teach science from what I remember) but that is just absurd. I might as well walk into a history class and start talking about how I think everything before last thursday is just a fabrication since that is when the universe started.
     

Share This Page