Fact Checking Trump's Speech

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by samcraig, Jul 22, 2016.

  1. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #2
    anyone who in anyway tries to defend what Hil Liar Y did has zero credibility.

    Trump claimed Clinton “illegally” stored emails on her private server while secretary of state, and deleted 33,000 to cover-up “her crime.” But the FBI cleared Clinton of criminal wrongdoing, and found no evidence of a cover-up.

    She's as guilty and negligent as one could get.
     
  2. thermodynamic Suspended

    thermodynamic

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    #3
    To each point, in individual paragraph form:

    Yes, Iran has been doing the nuke plan thing for 3 presidents or more now. It's on a path. Trump is citing dissatisfaction with her performance to stop the issue. He seems brazen. What will he do more actively to halt this, to make the US look like the world's Superman?

    Yeah, blaming Clinton for the resignation is "guilt by association" at best but Obama's Robert Gates* saying not to be quick to abandon support (that paragraph is missing context as to the relevance of Obama and Gates to Clinton, but it's possible Clinton was never involved. Factcheck needs a minor clarification rewrite on that.)

    * a leftover from Bush's era since Obama lacked experience in this area, so that gives Trump a boost and for the identical reason of Obama - though don't remind the GOP about any possible double standard here...


    0.000001% tax increase on 0.000001% of the population will always be screamed at as "massive". But without good paying jobs, forget any domestic projects and America has been sidelined for long enough, which is why all these other candidates have received more visibility. Obama's done some good, the GOP has done some obstructing, but there's a lot of compromise involved - sometimes too much as many people reported. Americans rightfully expected better from all involved. Will Trump manage to make things better for the working class in the way Obama had not?

    Nitpicking. People who see a rise in crime for one year will say "new trend" as well.

    What has Trump said about Rice, Powell, and Bush having private email servers? Or Bush's deleting 22,000,000 emails? If the, as Sanders said it, "damn emails" issue comes up in the debate, Trump has a trump card on this. Or does Clinton have the trump card as such?

    No other country has the national debt the US does, I suppose. In terms of monetary cost, right now there isn't, we've spent trillions continuing to build other nations and dole out more corporate welfare. It's simpler just to reject all until something more fair comes about. Maybe that's what he's thinking about?

    I wish Trump included the services the US exports, but maybe Factcheck is nitpicking again, with Trump focusing on solely tangible products we manufacture?

    Oops, a slip-up. Like no other person running for public office has never slipped up ever-de-ever.

    At the "that's not all" paragraph, they raise fair points about Republican involvement. But Bill Clinton still chose to sign it, that's an important part of the process. But, yes, if people want an outsider, perhaps Trump will do a little more to point out his own party's past foibles. Is that unreasonable?

    Could be another nitpick or slip of the tongue. Or couldn't think of a comeback to the last year where wages have ostensibly gone up faster than inflation - or Factcheck trying to say there's a new trend, despite lambasting Trump on his trying to show a new trend over the same timespan? Whoops...

    And, yes, the lack of recognizing the student loan problem (which is more than just any entity holding the debt) is also a big issue for millions of Americans, especially with today's late-teens and 20-somethings (or older, the great recession was the first impetus behind people having to retrain and for workers it is not sustainable to take on tens of thousands in debt for each career change to get the minimum accepted degree. Someone once said that some should have to pay $70k while others pay $4, but that just shows the sheer level of ignorance of some in this country.)


    And, yes, I will be as open-minded when we get to vet Clinton's speech. I'm sure Factcheck will have just as much zeal.
    --- Post Merged, Jul 22, 2016 ---
    Negligence isn't good, but still innocent. Not premeditated. Sorry you feel that perspectives can't be considered, with the same level of depth your post was (the arrogant attitude would be seen by some as your losing your credibility from the get-go, but I disagree with that). Now if you put in 100 pages of evidence, then expect a 100 page response of equal depth. One paragraph in response to one paragraph is fair.
     
  3. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #4
    Negligence that she exhibited and the events under her watch were beyond not good. If she's so innocent then let a grand jury and court through a trial system clear her. Until then she was just protected and the system never allowed to do it's job.

    She absolutely premeditated the use of the server through her own admission as to why she did it. She said it was self serving for convenience sake but that's not the only reason and many of us know that. Not everyone is blind and dumb enough to think she's free on this one.
     
  4. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #5
    Trump's tedious, shouty, and (frankly) frightening speech was the most dishonest thing he's put out in a long career built on dishonesty and fraud.

    Let's start with this: The picture he paints of America beset by an epidemic of violent crime and invaded by murderous Muslims and immigrants is patently false.

    Violent crime, including murders of police officers, is at historic lows, and this downward trajectory continued under President Obama. Trump's tactic of cherry picking statistics is sort of like creating a documentary of America by showing only photos of un-flushed toilets: Factually true, but hardly representative of the real situation.

    Even if violent crime was a crisis, there is little the President (or Congress) could do about it. Since they don't control the nations tens of thousands of municipal police departments or Sheriff's offices. They don't control local DAs or appoint county and state judges.

    Trump is trying to frighten people into electing him. Although why even a frightened person would think Donald Trump had answers for anything - let alone violent crime - is beyond me.
     
  5. mudslag macrumors regular

    mudslag

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    #6

    What you just did is a deflection.
     
  6. samcraig thread starter macrumors P6

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    #7
    If you're not found guilty. You're not guilty. Just like when Apple is found not guilty of something and people argue against those that use the term illegal.

    That aside...

    When is Trump going to move the manufacturing of HIS "swag" to the US?
    Do you think Trump knows that the US owes China over a trillion dollars?
    Why does Trump want to hold immigrants to standards greater than he holds for himself and the hate speech he spews?
    Restore law and order? By hiring the best prosecutors? This isn't the apprentice.

    and so on.

    There are problems in the US (and world.) Donald Trump cannot fix them. He can point out the problems and point fingers at who to blame. But he is not the person who can fix them.

    You can hate the opposing candidate and think she's unfit to be President. But that doesn't equate to wanting or needed Trump, specifically, in the White House.
     
  7. zioxide macrumors 603

    zioxide

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    #8
    Love it. Can't even make it one reply in a thread about Donny without a Trumpet trying to deflect to Hillary.

    You know your candidate is trash when your only rebuttal is "well the other person used their personal email for work".
     
  8. AustinIllini macrumors demi-god

    AustinIllini

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    #9
    It's like a formula:
    calling candidates names + avatar in military uniform = waste of an argument

    I'm not anti-military, but I just don't know how so many military personnel are so out of touch
     
  9. sodapop1 Suspended

    sodapop1

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    #10
    Precisely! It is foolish arguing with a bunch of trolls. I imagine once Trump loses the election, most of these trolls will crawl back under the rock from which the came.
     
  10. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #11
    I think we've done enough ignoring of people.
     
  11. sodapop1 Suspended

    sodapop1

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    #12
    I don't recall suggesting any such thing. But let's not confuse having a rational and civilized conversation with people whose only objective is to spread hate and call other people names.
     
  12. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #13
    Just fact-checking this, but technically trolls live under bridges. Or their parent's basement.
     
  13. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #14
    She wasn’t found not guilty. The matter was blocked from going to trial. In the end she’s as innocent as OJ Simpson and for the liberals who like to argue it, George Zimmerman. Believe what you want though….

    Ask him. Perhaps she will. Until now, he’s just a businessman like everyone else who’s taking advantage of the off-shore ability that the left supports.

    Wouldn’t surprise me if we do and I’m sure he does. He’s been vocal about China and our involvement with them since the 80’s and likely before that.

    Can’t read your mind on the specifics you reference. In the end, America First….it’s about time we focus on our people and our country FIRST.

    He’ll likely support people who actually will hold people accountable vs slapping them on the wrist and letting them go. Rudy cleaned up NYC and didn’t do so by the antics that the left supports as effective, because they are not.

    You don’t know that. What we do know is that for 8 years now the administration including Clinton clearly have not solved the problems and have made more.

    Between the two, he’s a far better choice.
     
  14. diamond.g macrumors 603

    diamond.g

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    #15
    Even if she were found innocent by verdict it is likely no one would believe it (as evidenced by OJ Simpson). So then we are back to Square 1.
    --- Post Merged, Jul 22, 2016 ---
    Point made...
     
  15. mudslag macrumors regular

    mudslag

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    #16

    Well that's certainly subjective.
     
  16. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #17
    We’ve seen more incidents in recent time and so have many of the cities across the pond. If it’s not such an issue or if there’s no need for concern then why is anybody at all talking about it including the liberal media and politicians. You’re right, I guess the world is at peace like never before…

    You’re right. I suppose all the notice and talk that the left is spouting and taking advantage of to leverage “gun control” is just hogwash. That or perhaps they are the ones cherry picking.

    Really? There's nothing being done or that can further be done? WOW!
     
  17. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #18
    Because they are both guilty not innocent. I also highly doubt she would be cleared in a trial. At least with OJ the system was allowed to play out. She's so scared and so well protected to keep the agenda going that they won't even let it play out. They know why...
    --- Post Merged, Jul 22, 2016 ---
    I'm more in touch that you are.
     
  18. samcraig thread starter macrumors P6

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    #19
    Toddlers have killed more people in the US than terrorists this year. Maybe we should start profiling them.
     
  19. pdqgp macrumors 68020

    pdqgp

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    #20
    may as well because the left thinks that there's a HUGE issue with toddlers and deaths around them.

    at the end of the day there's a huge segment of the population that just plain doesn't support bringing refugees here. There's no need or point in doing so. leave them there and make a safe haven for them THERE.
     
  20. bent christian, Jul 22, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2016

    bent christian Suspended

    bent christian

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    #21
    The system did play out. You sound unfamiliar with how the criminal justice system works in this country. Police investigated an allegation of illegal activity and found none. Attorneys for the state had nothing to persecute. The case ends. That's how it works here.
     
  21. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #22
    And yet you think Saudi Arabia should shoulder a burden...
     
  22. samcraig thread starter macrumors P6

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    #23
    There are more than two candidates. Like I said - just because you hate one, doesn't mean you have to support the other.

    He's had plenty of time to start moving manufacturing over if he was going to insist that companies (not his) do the same. That's called being a leader - not a dictator.

    We do owe China that much. So why in his speech did he attack China and say he was going to rip up trade agreements and confront them as if he was holding all the card? Do you think it's wise to attack someone you're incredibly indebted to?

    You also speak in circles and are being subjective. There are more problems now? And they are the fault of who exactly? The President - or could it be Congress who for quite some time has been Republican dominated.
     
  23. AustinIllini macrumors demi-god

    AustinIllini

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    #24
    Fooled us..
     
  24. samcraig thread starter macrumors P6

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    #25
    No - the issue is gun control. Not banning guns - but more control over who has them. Trump and the Republican party can't start talking about all of the pain this country is having because of anger and people killing in the streets while at the same time blocking every attempt to create laws that would reduce the issue. It's called hypocrisy. It's also in incredibly poor taste.
     

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