FBI Director Implies Action Against Apple and Google

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by AxoNeuron, Oct 17, 2014.

  1. AxoNeuron, Oct 17, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2014

    AxoNeuron macrumors 65816

    AxoNeuron

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    #1
  2. aaronvan, Oct 17, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2014

    aaronvan Suspended

    aaronvan

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    #2
    It doesn't surprise me one iota. We are living under a government that spies on it's own citizens, unleashes the IRS on political foes, and threatens reporters with legal action if they don't reveal their confidential sources inside the government.

    What he really means is the pendulum has swung too far in the direction of freedom and personal security.
     
  3. skinned66 macrumors 65816

    skinned66

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    #3


    The FBI are not used to not getting their way. I think you bring up a valid concern. Should that day ever come to pass they'll be singing the blues about how impotent they are to do anything about it more than they are today.
     
  4. AxoNeuron thread starter macrumors 65816

    AxoNeuron

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    #4
    It's all about domestic security.

    My personal view is that terrorism has killed what, less than 5,000 Americans in the last 20 years? Why are we spending $1+ trillion in order to combat terrorism when heart attacks, strokes, and obesity have killed tens of millions of Americans over the same time period? Why aren't we taking that money and pouring it in to medical research instead? It's as if you are sitting on the titanic as it is beginning to sink, and you're obsessing over not getting enough vitamin D.

    I'm sure that they will use the next terrorist attack as an excuse to take away more of our freedoms and liberties.

    I don't think that there is some evil genius behind the curtain plotting to take away our civil rights. But our current political system has certain qualities and attributes that pressure lawmakers to defend us from terrorism at all costs, regardless of the constitution. As a country, we are absolutely petrified of the thought of another terrorist attack. And we shouldn't be.

    Terrorism is called "terrorism" because the goal is to strike fear in to the heart of your enemy. The terrorists who committed 9/11 have succeeded in that, brilliantly. And we let them do it. We are tearing ourselves apart trying to protect ourselves from a stateless entity that has no army, no generals, and no hope of ever winning an actual war against us. The only way Al Queda could ever beat us would be to make us destroy ourselves. They WANT us to overreact, to destroy our civil liberties and waste hundreds of billions of dollars in order to try and defeat an idea. But you cannot defeat an idea. We've picked a war that we cannot win. My only hope is that our fellow voters come to this conclusion soon, otherwise we're doomed.
     
  5. phrehdd macrumors 68040

    phrehdd

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    #5
    While I don't agree with you 100 percent, I respect and admire your thinking.

    There is a thought that re-occurs between myself and some friends - who polices the police. What we are seeing today (my opinion) is that various departments like FBI have become victim to politics and thus remain crippled yet powerful enough to potentially tamper with our liberties.

    I am all for protecting our citizens, way of life and even can find some ways to rationalize some things various departments (like the FBI) are doing that appear counter to our freedoms and privacy. However, given the political climate, all of these 'players' remain suspect as more and more abuse cases gush out for public scrutiny. In my life, I have not seen so much political abuse of departments as we have now. What is strange is that Nixon will always be remembered for his abuse of power which pales in comparison to what is going on right now, with the lies, misuse of power and deconstruction of various departments. We are not living in a politically correct society but manipulations and machinations under the banner of political correctness - they are not the same thing.

    Btw, I am not a Republican and no longer a Democrat (for quite awhile now). I'll stick to issues to guide my vote.
    Thanks for sharing your thoughts and respectfully responding.
     
  6. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #6
    It is worth remembering that Director Comey has something of a history when it comes to surveillance: He was the Acting Attorney General who refused to sign off on some aspects of the NSA surveillance programs while then AG John Ashcroft was hospitalized, back in March 2004. This doesn't necessarily make him a paragon of privacy and civil liberties - but it puts it in perspective.

    Personally I think the FBI, NSA and the whole Govt.-sponsored surveillance apparatus have only themselves to blame. Given the revelations of Snowden and Manning its hardly surprising ordinary consumers would demand control over their personal data.

    I think that the FBI's worries about encryption are overblown. Once data it on an iPhone it might be impossible to retrieve, but there is nothing to prevent legitimate wiretaps or other surveillance from capturing that data on its way to and from criminal suspects.
     
  7. Naimfan macrumors 601

    Naimfan

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    #7
    I agree with you. Imagine if we had invested the money wasted in Iraq and Afghanistan here at home - we'd have better educated students, a better manufacturing and research base, infrastructure that isn't falling apart, etc.

    From the Time article:

    “Perhaps it’s time to suggest that the post-Snowden pendulum has swung too far in one direction — in a direction of fear and mistrust."

    No, we have yet to swing back far enough to even reach the zero point on the pendulum. In fact, we've only now just slowed the movement of the pendulum toward fear and mistrust. When the NSA does not have carte blanche to read email, vacuum up phone records and calls, etc., and the FBI actually has to do proper investigative work, complete with real and contestable subpoenas, etc., THEN we can start to have a discussion of how to access private encrypted data.

    The FBI, NSA, et al, have only themselves to blame for the backlash. And when private enterprise figures out how to make some money by preventing government intrusions, the government will really have a challenge. But that is how it should be.
     
  8. jkcerda macrumors 6502a

    jkcerda

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    #8
    That is what you get when BOTH democrats & republicans support spying on its citizens
     
  9. iBlazed macrumors 68000

    iBlazed

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    #9
    I hope Apple and Google continue in the leaps they've made in data encryption.
     
  10. Southern Dad macrumors 65816

    Southern Dad

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    #10
    It certainly has put the government is a unique position.
     
  11. iososx macrumors 6502a

    iososx

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    #11
    FBI? surely you jest.

    Life in this once free, once brilliant country is changing as fast as a certain ruler can order changes via his pen and his phone. All from the gorgeous landscape of the golf course chosen on any given day.

    As this is being written millions and millions of green cards, EAD's etc. are silently and stealthily being created. This to insure the "visitors" flowing across some imaginary border will displace Americans as they grab job after job to the delight of the head duffer in charge. How festive.
     
  12. AxoNeuron, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014

    AxoNeuron thread starter macrumors 65816

    AxoNeuron

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    #12
    A certain ruler?

    Yes, everything was just peachy before the evil black man came in to office. :rolleyes:

    Buddy, the republicans are just as responsible for this as the democrats are. They're both heavily responsible.

    It's obvious you've fallen for the right-wing brainwashing against Obama. He's an absolutely horrendous president, but not for any of the hyper-simplistic FOX News garbage and conspiracy theories you appear to believe in. All of our presidents the last 30-40 years or so have been atrocious, and it's because of something called "regulatory capture", where the fortune 500 in this country has so thoroughly corrupted the government that both the republicans and democrats need to go. As it stands, our politicians are more interested in pleasing the Koch brothers than in pleasing the voters. After all, these days, it seems that pleasing the Koch brothers will get you more votes.
     
  13. iososx macrumors 6502a

    iososx

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    #13
    Oh my you're so emotionally invested. Their is nothing you don't know.

    Immediately launching into a personal attack reveals reams about you....
     
  14. Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #14
    Basically how much liberty do you want to give up for security? And will you be happy with the people controlling your security? I'd rather take my chances in the other direction.
     
  15. jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #15
    I'm confused by the view of law enforcement on this. If we all agree to change the law and give law enforcement legal access to cell phones, then, so be it, we all know that and assume that our cell phones are not private. I guess what they want is that cell phones are not private, but, we all pretend that they are.
     
  16. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #16
    The point is that any government snooping on my business should have probable cause. Next the FBI will be requiring DNA samples from babies so that they can solve future crimes....

    Given this kind of nonsense in the US, the anti-immigration nonsense in the UK, international tensions in Europe (Ukraine) and Asia (PRC, Japan, ROC, Koreas, Vietnam, Philippines), and the second wave of the international financial downturn, everything is beginning to look very 1930's to me...
     
  17. Solomani macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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  18. AxoNeuron, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014

    AxoNeuron thread starter macrumors 65816

    AxoNeuron

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    #18
    I did not attack you. I attacked your political statements. The fact that you think I was attacking you personally reveals much more about you.

    The most vicious part of the right-wing strategy to take over the country is their brainwashing of millions of Americans. They have convinced republican voters that they are in some sort of life-or-death struggle to defeat the evil black President Obama. That is why, if you turn on FOX News or Rush Limbaugh, they are constantly railing against him at every possible opportunity. It's why Rush Limbaugh has said that Obama wants ebola to spread throughout the US as revenge for slavery :rolleyes:

    It's not a conspiracy, Rupert Murdoch is not sitting in some evil island bunker plotting the destruction of Obama, it's a situation that has developed naturally just to get more ratings. But the ultimate effect is that republican voters have been trained and conditioned like Pavlovian dogs to view anyone who questions their beliefs as enemies who must be defeated. I have always noticed that the same people who are susceptible to these right-wing messages are the same types of people who often blindly believe in religions, patriotism, and authority. These people tend to relish in black-and-white thinking. Thus, it's easy to see how the republican party has turned the right-wing voters in to their loyal little lap dogs, easy to rile up for nearly any cause.

    I'm not a democrat and I think Obama is a horrendous president, one of the worst we've ever had. But then again, I think Bush (both I and II) were every bit as bad, same with Clinton and Reagan. They are all sell-outs. Same with nearly every senator and member of congress who has bought in to our current sociopolitical system of greed and corruption. The top 1% of the top 1% own this country, and don't you ever forget it. In the Citizens United case, the Supreme Court decided that corporations are people. I can tell you this, they didn't come to this absurd decision because they actually think corporations are real individuals. When you start to analyze who benefits from these moves, you will begin to see how our government itself has become the lap dog of the international fortune 500.
     
  19. malman89 macrumors 68000

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    #19
    Stop before you make too much sense. ;)
     
  20. satcomer macrumors 603

    satcomer

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    #20
    Everyone is being disingenuous in this whole situation. NSA has hacked Encrytion! If they didn't change the NIST input then they are vulnerable! Look at this video.

     
  21. rhett7660 macrumors G4

    rhett7660

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    #21
    I would rather strike a nice balance between the two, however I don't see that happening anytime soon since the pendulum seems to swing far right or left and never a nice small swing in the middle.
     
  22. Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #22
    Is your message that many Humans make bad presidents? I might agree with that. ;) Clinton was moderate. I liked him and Bush 1 (Bush 1 for his first term until he let Lorenzo burn Eastern Airlines, writing it off as "just business".

    It can be argued Clinton had to be who he was to be elected and re-elected and no, I'm not talking about him "liking" women. ;) I remember for Bush the no-new-taxes mantra had all ready begun... And he raised taxes after he said he would not. This was before when the GOP lost their collective minds regarding taxes, hyping small government while simultaneously ballooning it, when moderate Republicans still existed.

    Who do you imagine as a good or who would be a good President?
     
  23. Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #23
    I agree, you've fallen into the right wing mindset, a mindset that tries to sell the notion that it's all Obama's fault. I want rules for illegal foreigners, I've always been critical of illegal aliens, but I'm also a pragmatist. It's ok to rail, but you also need to see the situation clearly, and if you promote an ideal, it helps greatly if you have a realistic solution to attach to it. If I could snap my finger and send all illegal aliens home, I'd do it while keeping in mind that our crops might end up rotting in the fields.
     

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