Ford to sell Jag and Land Rover to... TATA

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by Full of Win, Mar 25, 2008.

  1. gkarris macrumors 604

    gkarris

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  2. Prof. macrumors 601

    Prof.

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  3. Zwhaler macrumors 603

    Zwhaler

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    #4
    Man, Ford really has taken a turn for the worse in the past 2 deacdes or so. But didn't everyone already know that a modern Jaguar is just a Taurus with a fancy badge? :rolleyes:
     
  4. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

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    #5
    Tata's more than just the maker of the Indica... they're a fairly large company with a significant global reach and strong growth. Who knows? Ford seemed like a terrible choice for Jag and Rover, but until Nasser was removed, they were actually doing reasonably well with Ford. It was only since then that they were starved by the Americans... Tata is at least a company with growth potential at this time. Who knows?

    Go Team India! :p ;)
     
  5. Full of Win thread starter macrumors 68030

    Full of Win

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    #6
    At least with Ford, they had technology that could be applied to the divisions. I don't know that much about TATA, but what the hell can they bring to the table other than money.
     
  6. idyll macrumors 6502

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    #7
    so what do you think, will the ford stock go up or down tomorrow? i say this is good for ford
     
  7. ErikCLDR macrumors 68000

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    #8
    Way old news.


    They've been talking about this for months.

    As a Land Rover owner and enthusiast I am disappointed, but who knows. If the Indians just give money to LR/Jag to do their own development I suppose that wouldn't be bad. The problem is Indians may be educated but they have no application of their engineering knowledge on subjects such as cars.

    BRING THE DEFENDER BACK TO AMERICA! (aka throw in some airbags)

    It would be pretty hard to make the quality of LR/Jag worse then they have been for their entire existence. :p

    Ford wasn't bad for Land Rover. I won't say they helped them but they got rid of the BMW engines in the Range Rovers. Although good engines they were ridiculously expensive. The LR3 seems to be selling very well as well as the Range Rovers and Range Rover Sports.

    Jaguar's issue is that there cars have looked exactly the same for the past 30 years and very few people are interested in them. Hopefully the XF will turn things around. Another issue is that there are no Jaguar Dealers so selling them is hard. I mean the XJ8 is a an awesome car but its an old persons car. The X-Type was too cheaply made and didn't hold up with competitors. The S-Type should have had AWD and the first version of it with the very ford interior was a joke.

    The problem they both have is that they are expensive, extremely unreliable, and extremely expensive to fix. Furthermore they are niche vehicles that only a select group of people want, basically the people that just WANT the car because it is what it is. Lastly, they have horrendous resale value so who wants a car that will depreciate 99% in 3 years.

    Land Rover is doing very well right now. I am surprised they want to sell them. From what I've read Tata isn't interested in Jaguar really, for just wants to sell them as a pair. I guess for just wants to spend money on improving their mainly crappy lineup.
     
  8. klymr macrumors 65816

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    #9
    Ummm...where are LR's currently being made? I'm not certain myself, but this guy I work with just got back last week from a trip he took for school. The group went to Dubai, India, and China. Somewhere along the travels they stopped at the plant where the LR's were being assembled. I'd like to say it was India, but I can't remember for certain.
     
  9. ErikCLDR macrumors 68000

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    #10
    I believe all of there cars are still made in Solihull, England. Thats part of the reason they cost so much. Supposidly for the time being after Tata buys LR they will continue production in England. Jaguars I believe are still made in England as well.
     
  10. klymr macrumors 65816

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    #11
    Maybe his group also stopped in England. I wish I could remember.
     
  11. mBurns macrumors 6502

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    #12
    I heard that Tata may drop the Jaguar line. Also, as Erik pointed out, for the time being most LRs (not sure about Jags) are made in England. Eventually, the plants are supposed to move to India -- Tata supposedly purchased property to create a Rover plant.

    I also own a Land Rover and I'm not too excited about the move. I think this is a turn for the worse. There is nothing like the cheapest car manufacturer making the most expensive SUV!

    One other thing I forgot to add: Although this is a sad fact, I bet Ford is dumping Land Rover because of the current increase in gas prices. I was just at the Rover dealership recently and they said there has been a slow down in vehicle purchases except for the Supercharged model. The majority of people getting Rovers are leasing and the used ones are sitting on the lot.
     
  12. ErikCLDR macrumors 68000

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    #13
    I'd be very disappointed to see Jaguar go to hell. In my opinion they make the classiest cars on the road. They elegant. They are timeless. I suppose the fact they've never really updated there style is part of the issue.

    Yea I believe Tata bought 400 acres or something in India to build a factory. It is not known though if all models will be made in India or if some will still be made in England. My guess is that they'll stay in England, then slowly start making there new cars in India, see how it goes, and eventually have everything built in India. I think they know if they were to immediately start building cars in India no one would buy them.

    I am not sure what to think about this sale. I mean Tata's dream is to become known to the world as an automaker, so they'll probably do everything they can to keep Land Rover afloat. Ford kind of ignored them, but we'll see how Tata preforms controlling Land Rover.

    Jaguar I heard wants to just get sold off again. Maybe someone like BMW will come to their rescue and save them.

    I would agree that gas prices have a lot to do with the sales too. I mean the Range Rover, Range Rover Sport, and LR3 all get roughly 14mpg. No one wants an LR2 here anyways. If they didn't make those things so heavy it would probably help them out. The LR3 basically has two chassis put on top of each other.

    We'll see, only time will tell. I am trying to remain optimistic.
     
  13. Abstract macrumors Penryn

    Abstract

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    #14
    It's true, but some of them are fantastic cars, though. ;) Stunning.

    Also, I rarely hear any complaints in reviews about the driving experience of the Jag. I only hear about the expense of fixing them, reliability, etc. If they could just make a reliable version of what they have now, then fantastic. Everyone will get what they want from Jaguar.

    I'm excited about this news. I hope Tata really does just give them money, and have Jaguar take care of themselves.
     
  14. mBurns macrumors 6502

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    #15
    Bring back the diesel! You mentioned wanting a Defender... I'd love to get my hands on a 110. :)
     
  15. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

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    #16
    They have manufacturing and business management expertise, which is really far more sorely lacking in this case than technology. Between parent Ford, Jag, and LR, at this point, there are no executives left who are skilled in anything other than running a business to the ground. I don't like to say it... I have strong sympathy for Ford, and it will always be my first industry love and the first company that took a chance on me when I finished school. I want them to do well. But their current management team are incompetent...
     
  16. scotthayes macrumors 68000

    scotthayes

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    #17
    Tata have said they are going to stick with the Land Rover and Jaguar business plan (for the moment). They will keep making the Land Rover at Lode Lane (Solihull) and the Jaguars at Castle Bromwich (just out side Birmingham)

    Remember Jaguar has just released the XF and it's a stunning car.

    You will not see a cheap Jag or Land Rover/Ranger Rover they will stick with them as high quality brands

    The unions as very very pleased with the deal


    Oh and if you think Tata can't do quality a Tata owned hotel
     
  17. Queso macrumors G4

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    #18
    This is the best outcome for LR and Jaguar once Ford declared their new strategy. TATA want to pull a Daewoo and go big time into the car industry. By buying established brands, known both in their home market and internationally they've cut out a huge chunk of the marketing and awareness cost they would have had to pay for. I think long term we'll see assembly plants remain in the UK, but manufacturing of components will be carried out in India. This is similar to how Toyota and Nissan work, as it allows them to cut costs whilst getting around EU import duties. In the short term nothing major is going to change other than more investment into new models.

    I wish TATA every success.
     
  18. smokeyrabbit macrumors 6502

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    #19
    I've owned 5 Land Rovers and 2 Fords. I have pulled the door handle off of my F-350, but never have pulled a door handle off any of the LR's. I suppose I'll have to try to get out of some TATA's whilst testing door handle breakage resistance to fully appreciate the implication of this purchase.:p
     
  19. Lunja macrumors 6502

    Lunja

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    #20
    Tata own a LOT of steel companies, including Corus who also have bases in the UK. Tata could do reduced rate deals on steel, reducing costs, which could give them more funding for gadgety goodness... Plus, India is a growing economy, and there will be greater demand for luxury goods like loaded Jags - I can't see Tata throwing money at Jag and LR without innovating along the way.
     
  20. ryannel2003 macrumors 68000

    ryannel2003

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    #21
    Ford is completely idiotic for letting Land Rover and Jaguar going. For the first time in years, Land Rover has an extremely cohesive product line up and the company has started to make money. Car magazines and consumers alike have started warming up to the Range Rovers, which is the best luxury SUV of them all.

    As for Jaguar, the company has been struggling since the late 70's for low quality and lackluster cars. The past 5 years have seen much nicer models including the XJ and the latest XK. However, offset by those cars was the slow selling and lack luster X-Type and the gorgeous, but dated S-Type. The new XF was going to changed all that, as that car is very revolutionary and different for Jaguar who is known not to sway from it's roots.

    Then again, Ford Motor itself is not doing well. Ford really does have some great cars (the Fusion and latest Taurus comes to mind) but really lacks in some areas (the new Focus is a disaster, and the F-150 is old). Another problem is the two bleeding companies Mercury and Lincoln. When is the last time Mercury came out with something the public didn't think was a warmed up Ford? They'll go the way of the Oldsmobile... Lincoln is much better with it's MKZ and MKX, but still have a way to go separating themselves from Ford.

    Funny to think 10 years ago Lincoln was way ahead of Cadillac, and many thought that it was Caddy who was gonna die. Ha, look how that turned out.
     
  21. geese macrumors 6502a

    geese

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    #22
    Well, you're right, but Ford haven't got any money at the moment. They wanted to keep Land Rover, but couldn't because LR production facilities are so closely tied to Jaguars. Shame though, as LR are making some stunning looking cars.

    But I think Tata will be good owners of JLR. They have lots of cash, lots of proven management expertise, and experience of luxury brands ( their hotels for instance). Unless they totally misunderstand their the JLR brands, they couldn't transfer production to India, as that would totally undermine their brand values.

    Think what the X-type did for Jaguars reputation. Not a bad car per-se, but just not a premium enough to warrant the Jaguar badge. It would built on the Modeo platform FFS! (not that the Mondeo wasn't a good car, but as a serious 3 series competitor???)

    No, I think JLR will continue to use Ford engines work the medium term future, probably developing their own in time. And they certainly couldn't transfer production to India without harming sales.

    Although it'd make sense to make the Land Rover Defender in India- turn it into a cheap, basic 4x4.
     
  22. geese macrumors 6502a

    geese

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    #23
    Oh god- after seeing what BMW did to the MG Rover group, that would be the worst possible outcome (they owned Rover, MG and Land Rover between 1994 to 2000). The Land Rovers were OK, nothing like as special as they are now. They managed to resurrect the MG brand on a sports car that was specially developed not to compete very well with the slow BMW Z3, and they ran Rover into the ground.

    Oh- and the new Tata factory that being built. Its for the Nanos, not any JLRs.
     

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