Former Guantanamo detainee shares his story as Obama shuts in remaining prisoners

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by (marc), Jan 8, 2012.

  1. (marc), Jan 8, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2012

    (marc) macrumors 6502a

    (marc)

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    #1
    Echoing the case of Murat Kurnaz, Lakhdar Boumediene, a former Guantanamo detainee shares his story in the NY Times.

    Both were detained illegally, for no reason, in violation of human rights, in US detention camps (Murat Kurnaz for 5 years and Lakhdar Boumediene for 7 years). Both were given no explanation for their detainment.

    In other news, President Obama (who promised to close Guantanamo) signed the NDAA on 12/31/2011, which according to Baher Azmy, legal director of the Center for Constitutional Rights, makes closing Guantanamo "nearly impossible". This is because "before anyone can be released, the Defense Department has to certify that the individual will not engage in any hostile acts when they are returned — something that the Defense Department cannot certify".

    This seals the fate of the 171 remaining Guantanamo prisoners and other detainees throughout the world and probably locks in plenty of perfectly innocent people for the rest of their lives.

    If you do not agree with this, you can participate in an Amnesty International action.
     
  2. LostSoul80 macrumors 68020

    LostSoul80

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    #2
    They will never close Guantànamo unless some serious international verdict, which is unlikely too.
     
  3. (marc) thread starter macrumors 6502a

    (marc)

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    #3
    Unfortunately, your probably right. I'd love to see EU sanctions against the US.
     
  4. LostSoul80 macrumors 68020

    LostSoul80

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    #4
    I'd love that too, especially these times. Probably that'd mark an important non economic step in rejoining european countries as well, but realistically speaking that's as impossible as for U.S. having a chinese president at this time. :)
     
  5. Happybunny macrumors 68000

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    #5
    I was really hopeful that President Obama, would be able to keep his promise, and close Guantanamo prison. The fact that very few countries were prepared to take ex-detainees didn't help.:(
     
  6. thekev, Jan 8, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2012

    thekev macrumors 604

    thekev

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    #6
    He went back on a significant number of promises regarding Guantanamo, environmental issues, and other things. This is a problem. No matter who we elect, these issues are unlikely to be resolved without pressure from the rest of the world.

    Edit: Bleck I made a mistake at the very least on the Guantanamo issue. Note the link from Blue Velvet below.
     
  7. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #7
    I'm not trying to defend Obama but he did try to send some to the US prison system to be tried in the court system but the Republicans and some Democrats put a stop to that . I think he's just given up and kicking the can down the road for the next president/congress.

    His main problem is he gives in to the weirdo republicans way too much.
     
  8. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #8
  9. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #9
    how many of those 171 do you think are "perfectly innocent"?
     
  10. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #10
    Well according to our Constitution. Remember that ? Good times.

    ALL of them are until proven guilty.
     
  11. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #11
    so your answer is ... all of them are "perfectly innocent"
     
  12. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #12
    Under the Constitution. Yes.

    And btw. The term "Perfectly Innocent" isn't used in the Constitution.
     
  13. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #13
    I respect your opinion ... however my guess as to how many are "perfectly innocent"? ... next to none
     
  14. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #14
    What I said isn't an opinion. It's a fact. If you choose to follow the Constitution.

    We are NOT at war.

    We can not win a "war against an ideology "
     
  15. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #15
    I am not defending Gitmo ... shut it down and extradite every prisoner back to their birth country and let them deal with them.
     
  16. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #16

    Sorry, you don't think innocent people were incarcerated in Guantánamo?


     
  17. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #17
    every prison in the world has some "innocent" people in them ... I am just not prepared to believe plenty of Gitmo detainees are "perfectly innocent"
     
  18. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #18

    Your rank prejudice, utter ignorance and blindness are betrayed by the use of scare quotes. The facts are clear. It doesn't matter what you believe, since you clearly haven't got the slightest clue what you are talking about.


    Hear that? A former Bush administration official.

    Many innocent men and children were incarcerated and tortured. Some of them were sold as bounty to the Americans who never checked to see who these people were.

    Your willingness to swallow whatever crap the Chenyites — war criminals and torturers all — is morally and factually without foundation. Get educated.
     
  19. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #19
    don't believe everything you read ...

    Your rank prejudice, utter ignorance and blindness are betrayed by the use of scare quotes. It doesn't matter what you believe, since you clearly haven't got the slightest clue what you are talking about. ... and you are not helping to educate anyone.
     
  20. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #20

    Stunningly weak. Please demonstrate some evidence for your 'belief' that innocent people aren't in Guantanamo or run along and go and play in the iPhone accessories forum.
     
  21. thekev, Jan 8, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2012

    thekev macrumors 604

    thekev

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    #21
    Rewriting this. Some of them may be innocent. They haven't proven anything. If you want to see them extradited, this would require charges in those countries. If they're being arrested for crimes within the US without charges having been filed in their home countries, they should be detained within the US rather than offshore, and charged with whatever specific crime rather than just held on suspicion of fuzzy terms.

    edited wrong post
     
  22. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #22
    you must not have read my above post before spouting that I need to educate myself ... I will quote them for you :rolleyes:

    furthermore ... your "run along comment" is just plain Rude and Juvenile
     
  23. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #23

    Don't be sorry. It's a common misconception. I'm as likely to get irritated with complaints from some on the left about Obama who detest him because he didn't deliver their ponies, as I am about the crazy right who just make stuff up from whole cloth.

    This forum is detested by many. Those who participate do everyone a favour by trying to be as factual as possible.
     
  24. thekev, Jan 8, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2012

    thekev macrumors 604

    thekev

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    #24
    Rewriting this. Some of them may be innocent. They haven't proven anything. If you want to see them extradited, this would require charges in those countries. If they're being arrested for crimes within the US without charges having been filed in their home countries, they should be detained within the US rather than offshore, and charged with whatever specific crime rather than just held on suspicion of fuzzy terms.

    I agree. Also fwiw I don't think you can pin the problems in the US on any single politician or just the government in general. A lot of problems including the national debt have been problems for a very long time, but whenever things are okay and people are working, no one says much about them.
     
  25. Apple OC macrumors 68040

    Apple OC

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    #25
    As I said above ... I vote to close Gitmo and return every detainee back to their birth country ... that is my stand on Gitmo ... Shut it down.

    Could I be more clear without people trying to goad this into something.
     

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