Founder, executives of drug company guilty in conspiracy that fed opioid crisis

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jkcerda, May 3, 2019.

  1. jkcerda macrumors 6502a

    jkcerda

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    #1
    https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/verdict-reached-u-opioid-bribe-180738005.html
    not a fan of the death penalty but some do deserve it.
     
  2. ActionableMango macrumors G3

    ActionableMango

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    #2
    The last time I went to an urgent care clinic, the doctor asked me about my pain level on a scale of 0 to 10. I said "zero".

    He prescribed me painkillers anyway, "just in case".
     
  3. LordVic macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2011
    #3
    the Opiod crisis hitting our countries really needs serious attention.

    in 2017, the #1 killer of Canadians between the age of 30 and 45 was Opiod overdose. Approximately 4500 Canadians in that age group died from Fentynal overdoses.

    our legal and black markets have been absolutely flooded in recent years with Fentanyl imported in large bulk.

    This is national emergency for both US and Canada.

    But for some reason, nobody seems to want to truly crack down on the suppliers. At this point, they should just ban Fentanyl. And start holding companies responsible for their role in the over-abuse of it.
     
  4. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #4
    Nice.

    We should be building walls around pharmaceutical companies.

    But I’ll admit once the employees leave the building they are hard to spot. If you can’t easily point to one then the American people won’t get behind it.
     
  5. Howard2k macrumors 68020

    Howard2k

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    #5

    There are legitimate uses for opioid based medications. Banning Fentanyl isn't necessarily the answer if there are no other better medical solutions.

    Opioid addiction is a big issue, no doubt about it, but taking medication away from those who actually need it might not be the answer.
     
  6. jkcerda thread starter macrumors 6502a

    jkcerda

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    #6
    disagree with the ban, the black market would just flourish under it.
    should nail to the wall any DR over prescribing it.
     
  7. LordVic macrumors 603

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    Sep 7, 2011
    #7
    Ok, maybe a ban is a little on the excessive side. But until its taken seriously, it's going to get worse before better.

    Any Doctor who overprescribes it, should be fined.

    Any DR who is caught accepting kick backs for it's prescription should have their license ot practice revoked. (and if it ends up with serious health consequences to the victim, than possible criminal proceedings, and at least subject to lawsuits)
     
  8. JagdTiger macrumors 6502

    JagdTiger

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    #8
    It’s funny how people can’t get natural medicine but doctors can prescribe pain tablets and not be responsible for the addiction which follows, the medical community gets away with too much.
    --- Post Merged, May 3, 2019 ---
    They get away with just about anything, the doctors won’t do anything to another one, it’s to keep they’re jobs...the only time something is done is a rare case or when a physicians family member is harmed by malpractice.
     
  9. samcraig macrumors P6

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    USA
    #9
  10. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #10
    Wait, I thought “Greed is Good” is the capitalist mantra. He was just being greedy. He should not be punished for what comes naturally.
     
  11. JagdTiger macrumors 6502

    JagdTiger

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    #11
    This is interesting, it is about a cure for cancer, a talk show with chat replay.

     
  12. A.Goldberg, May 3, 2019
    Last edited: May 3, 2019

    A.Goldberg macrumors 68020

    A.Goldberg

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    #12
    As a pharmD I can tell you I have literally never seen this drug used. It’s absurdly expensive, honestly has little-no value therapeutically, and is incredibly dangerous. The only thing more ridiculous is Lazard’s, intranasal fentanyl spray- essentially snorting fentanyl.... Rapid acting agents have very limited use, and there’s safer and far cheaper options. I don’t know what insurance or hospital would foot the bill for Subsys.

    I’m sure the punishment for this will be less than satisfying. This company seems like an absolute s*** show. Lap dances, strip clubs, and gun ranges is rather extreme. Wining and dining and paying doctors speaker fees to endorse their products is pretty standard.

    Most of the fentanyl people are dying from are from illegal labs, a lot that coming through China.
     
  13. JagdTiger macrumors 6502

    JagdTiger

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  14. Zenithal, May 3, 2019
    Last edited: May 3, 2019

    Zenithal macrumors 604

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    #14
    Up until a few years ago I'd never heard of it and as you know me, I enjoy reading about inane topics. The first time I came across the drug was a study about intramucosal delivery methods, or a lollipop. Which I'd have to say is bizarre for adults. This delivery method isn't new, as it was used for children for other drugs at least two decades ago. Sublingual administration isn't new either, but try getting a sick kid in a hospital to take medicine orally or allow themselves to be injected with it. There's patches, too. Honestly, a lot of these methods are ripe for abuse and like you I'm really curious just how prevalent long term pain cases are that require such strong opioids.

    I remember a time when the epidemic was Vicodin or Norco addiction, both the same at a surface level, albeit different in structure. And, just to sound old, I also blame shows or film that romanticize prescription abuse, like House.
    --- Post Merged, May 3, 2019 ---
    Opioids are a drug that affect everyone. It isn't like pot, crack, LSD, pcp, ketamine, whatever that may affect certain portions of the populous due to their life and activities being tied to their socioeconomic ability to succeed.
     
  15. A.Goldberg macrumors 68020

    A.Goldberg

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    #15
    Yeah, the lollipop formulation several benefits, including its far less invasive than injections but has a rapid onset of action. Lollipops can be used in a self dosing manner- I believe this is popular in the military: Basically the person could stick the lollipop in their mouth. Once they became sedated the medic could pull it out of their mouth. When they became reasonably conscious again they could stick it back in. Lollipops are essentially a lozenge with a stick, so they’re safer as they can’t be accidentally swallowed- which carries the high risk of choking given the sedation and opiates’ tendency to impair the gag reflex. If you swallow fentanyl it’s unlikely to have any therapeutic effect due to degradation in the GIT. Therefore you have to use a transmucosal, parenteral (IV/IM), or any other non-PO route (ie transdermal patch).

    Sublingual/transbuccal transmucosal products have been around for a while. Chewing tobacco and snus essentially utilizes the same effect. What’s unique with the new transmucosal fentanyl tablets/lozenges is they contain an effervescent (CO2 releasing) component. The CO2 immediately makes the oral environment more acidic. Fentanyl is a weak acid, so the lower pH will allow for better fentanyl solubility so it will dissolve into the saliva. Once the effervescent reaction completes, the environment’s pH will start to return to normal and the higher pH allows the dissolved drug to better penetrate the oral mucosa. It’s a rather genius invention. This allows for much better bioavailability.

    Re: How often are these rapid acting agents used- not very often. Typically between the use of long acting agents, PRN use of short acting agents for breakthrough pain, and using agents in a predictive manner (ie pain is usually worse in the AM, so take more in the AM), you can reasonably manage the pain. There’s also non-opioid medications that are very helpful in reducing the amount of opioids people need. Ketamine has become increasingly popular because of this. Usually oral agents work fast enough (~30 min).

    These ultra rapid agents take about 15 minutes to work, which doesn’t seem that significant given the risks and costs. If the patients pain is well managed, these should not be necessary. The number of patients who would need something like Subsys on a long term basis seems incredibly low. In most cases if people are in this amount of pain and/or are this tolerant, something is probably very wrong and they’d probably be in the hospital where you could administer drugs IV.

    The Rx abuse is directly responsible for the problems with have today with heroin and fentanyl. At least with Rx opioids people know exactly what they’re getting every time unlike street drugs where doses will vary greatly. Rx’s also less likely to be abused IV, which carries the greatest risk of OD and developing serious diseases.
     

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14 May 3, 2019