G5 in 2 flavors?

Shrek

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Jul 23, 2002
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Nashville, Tennessee USA
I'm willing to speculate that the next generation of PowerPC processors will come in two flavors:

  • 64-bit G5s without Altivec from IBM based on the Power4 design

    AND
  • 32-bit G5s with Altivec from Motorola based on 90-nanometer technology
    [/LIST=A]

    Wanna make a bet? <--- j/k :D

    EDIT: To put it into perspective, splitting the chips between two companies is the way things have been done at Apple for years now, so this is probably the most likely thing to happen. ;)
 

P-Worm

macrumors 68020
Jul 16, 2002
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Salt Lake City, UT
While I have no idea, i don't think I like the idea of splitting the computers by making some have certain companie's chips and some have others. it seems to me that companies make their chips differently, so they should respond differently to the OS and the apps.

Is this true, or am I just saying stuff to raise my post count? :eek:

P-Worm
 

MacsRgr8

macrumors 604
Sep 8, 2002
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The Netherlands
Well there's one dramatic difference:
64 - bit only OS X 10.3.... so no more Mac OS 9 boot (just Classic mode).
32 - bit should still be able to boot OS 9
 

Shrek

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Jul 23, 2002
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Originally posted by MacsRgr8

32 - bit should still be able to boot OS 9
That's not gonna happen given the news that Apple will be dropping the ability to boot into OS 9 in it's next version of OS X, but Classic Mode will still run inside OS X. Sorry dude. :p
 

MacsRgr8

macrumors 604
Sep 8, 2002
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Yes, I even heard Steve himself say this at the Paris keynote....(good to be there!)
But I think that the 32 - bit version, will only be "firmware hacked" so that the bootloader will not allow you to boot OS 9. This could be Steve's ultimate attempt to make the rest step over to Mac OS X.
Try xlr8yourmac.com to post a patch to fix this:)
 

Shrek

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Jul 23, 2002
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You know what I think would be good for Apple? I'd like see them completely skip over using G4 chips in the iBook and go straight to using G5 chips from Motorola in the iBook. This would likely sell more iBooks which would benefit Apple and consumers (considering that the iBooks are already way behind in technology).

That's my $0.02 ;)
 

Shrek

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Jul 23, 2002
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Originally posted by P-Worm
While I have no idea, i don't think I like the idea of splitting the computers by making some have certain companie's chips and some have others.
Well, frankly, that's the way things have been done at Apple for years now, so this is probably the most likely thing to happen. ;)
 

MacsRgr8

macrumors 604
Sep 8, 2002
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Yes that would be gr8!
This could give Apple alot of options:
All pro-Macs: 64 bit IBM (maybe even quads:) )
All consumer-Macs: 32 bit Moto (maybe even duals)
A very flexible line up. Mhz no issue. I believe that Apple is not using the 1GHz Saharas for the iBook just for the reason that "it sounds more" than an 800 MHz G4. (so much for the MHz-myth campaign
:( ). Being able to sell 64 bit- Mac's will sound gr8, no matter the Mhz.
And this would also settle the score for being totaly dependant of one chip manufacturer.

I like your bet, so I will not bet against it!
 

Mr. Anderson

Moderator emeritus
Nov 1, 2001
22,407
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VA
you guys are all talking like the G5 chip is here. Am I missing something or is all this just hopeful speculation and talk out your ^ss?

Until we actually see the damn thing, its really not even worth worrying about - how long has talk of the G5 been going on now anyway, years!?

I'd wait until IBM's little talk in October, that at least might shed some light one way or the other about what the next CPU will be.

D
 

Shrek

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Original poster
Jul 23, 2002
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Nashville, Tennessee USA
I would also like to see Apple put a G5 from Motorola in the eMacs as well. The reason why the eMacs are so much cheaper than the iMacs right now is because they have CRT displays, and boasts slightly slower system bus and slightly slower memory.

The eMacs should have the same G5 processors as in the iMacs and run at the same speeds but have slightly slower system bus and slightly slower memory just like they are today.

That's my $0.02 on future eMacs. ;)
 

theranch

macrumors 6502
Jan 3, 2002
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Atlantic City area
yeah but...

Originally posted by Shrek
Duke, why do you have to talk so negative about this? Besides, this is a rumors and speculation forum. We have the right to speculate here. :p
I agree with him... the talk about a G5 has gone on way too long. Nobody has an idea if there's going to be one or when it is coming so let's drop it until some solid evidence is shown. 2 cents given.
 

Mr. Anderson

Moderator emeritus
Nov 1, 2001
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VA
Before we get into a flame war, lets all settle down.

My point was there will be some new info coming out soon (in October) that could change things. There have been dozens of threads on the G5 this, the G5 that. Wouldn't it be great to have a G5. Of course it would! I was so hoping for a G5 this year, but things just didn't work out and we'll be going into 2003 still on the G4 platform.

I've seen too many what ifs, I'm just waiting to see 'what is' - any speculation is just spinning our wheels. If you want to speculate, go right ahead, but I'm allowed my opinion and you shouldn't take offense at it becuase it differs from yours.

I'm not exactly negative either - I'm just resigned in knowing that there is nothing we can do until they actually deliver the next gen chip - which I hope kicks butt. However, saying that it should go right into the iBook/iMac/eMac just isn't right - if a new chip comes along its going to go in the PowerMacs first and then slowly filter its way down into the other machines. Look at things realisticly here, at least, since we're speculating. Apple is not going to redesign all their machines for a new chip at the same time - it just won't happen. Retooling the manufacturing process is no trivial matter in time and money. Nope, look for the new chips in the high end machines first.

that's my 2¢!

D :D
 

Shrek

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Jul 23, 2002
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Nashville, Tennessee USA
Originally posted by MacsRgr8

This could give Apple alot of options:
All pro-Macs: 64 bit IBM (maybe even quads:) )
All consumer-Macs: 32 bit Moto (maybe even duals)
A very flexible line up. Mhz no issue. I believe that Apple is not using the 1GHz Saharas for the iBook just for the reason that "it sounds more" than an 800 MHz G4. (so much for the MHz-myth campaign
:( ). Being able to sell 64 bit- Mac's will sound gr8, no matter the Mhz.
No, I don't think it's very smart to use dual processors in consumer computers. That's makes it look like Apple is trying too hard to manufacture faster systems. Besides, only workstations use more than one processor--consumer machines do NOT.

Instead, Motorola should take advantage of 90-nanometer technology and manufacture chips at clock speeds that easily rival Intel/AMD processors; that would mean pushing for 3GHz and beyond.

IBM has said it wants to hit 2GHz by the end of 2002, but I think they're going to be a little late releasing it since Apple's next OS (10.3/Panther) likely want be here until January 2003 as Apple has indicated; if IBM's 64-bit G5 is truly coming in January then I expect Apple's next OS to be 64-bit/32-bit backward compatible.

That's my $0.02 on that. ;)
 

dethl

macrumors regular
Aug 28, 2002
246
0
Austin, TX
Motorola has its motor in reverse

Seeing how Motorola has been slacking off as it would seem, I wouldn't expect the G5 chip for a long time, possibly until late 2003. I looked at a PDF of Motorola's PPC processor chart, made in November 2001, and it then was talking about the G5. I was in Austin, TX attending a computer camp and heard that some guy leading the tour group talked about not only a G5 chip, but a G6 chip as well, and this was about 2 YEARS ago.

Unless theres something being hidden from public eyes, like what the new power macs will be sporting in Jan 2003, I don't see the possibility of a G5 chip yet. Though it is a possibility that there are gonna be some faster (much faster) chips now that OS X is gonna dominate.

My 2 cents as well.
 

Mr. Anderson

Moderator emeritus
Nov 1, 2001
22,407
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VA
How's this for speculation -

http://www.macbidouille.com/niouzcontenu.php?date=2002-09-09#3391

translated at altavista-
- IBM and AMD with Cupertino! - Lionel - 06:01:53 According to an American source, that we will keep anonymous, the future of G5 are compromised. Financial difficulties and of production of Motorola return its exit for difficult January trés. People from IBM and AMD were seen on several occasions in the buildings of APPLE with Cupertino. obviously, nothing did not filter meetings which were held. One would however say well that APPLE is actively seeking a substitute in failing Motorola.

doh!

like I said, wait until after October to start your speculation.....
 

Shrek

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Jul 23, 2002
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Nashville, Tennessee USA
I'm not getting into this argument. My only excuse for this is that I'm pretty new to the Apple world and talk about the G5 is new to me, so I like to talk about it. If the G5 doesn't come soon, then eventually I will get tired of it. 'Nuff said.
 

King Cobra

macrumors 603
Mar 2, 2002
5,403
0
Duke's got a point, guys.

And, let's take it a step further...

Remember back to Jan. 2002 when so many people thought the G5 was coming out because of all the news reports on chip updates and this Apple countdown? (Two separate instances, I know...) Motorola has only provided sht on a stick for Apple to use in the PowerMacs, especially, the new updates. Why would there be such a radical design?

This time, we have a conference to decide what is going to happen with Apple and future processors. If Motorola doesn't have anything for Apple, then f***ing ditch them for high-end processors and use them for the slower G4s (eMacs, iMacs, etc.).

:D
 

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King Cobra

macrumors 603
Mar 2, 2002
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Shrek:

When you posted a thread about your sending suggestion messages to Apple (copyright-protection for CDs, which failed miserably, is one example), they were rather unintelligent suggestions and not researched well, if at all.

Second, you just happened to pick a wrong time to discuss the "rumored" G5. Maybe it's Murphy the lawmaker speaking :rolleyes: but this just isn't the best time to spark such radical ideas for controversy. After the conference you can start posting threads about the G5 (IF, at all, it is brought up) and make rumors from there that have not been widely/generally discussed.

I think some posters think they're high on themselves for deluding themselves to thinking that they can bash others on the forums around like this, but I think (and I'm not deluding myself to it) those people need to learn respect.

On the other hand, someone has to get screwed over with every new thread. It's just society. :D