Getting fired for making stupid jokes at a conference and for complaining about it

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jnpy!$4g3cwk, Mar 22, 2013.

  1. jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #1
    I haven't seen this one brought up yet:


    http://www.businessinsider.com/adria-richards-dongle-and-forking-jokes-2013-3

    I can understand why Adria Richards reacted the way she did-- loutish behavior like that is annoying, I have sat next to people like that myself, and she was looking for a way to embarrass the people, and remind people not to behave that way. But, from there, that most insignificant of high-tech actions, the tweet, took on a life of its own. Perhaps all the facts, when they emerge, will make sense of all this, but, at the moment, it looks like a massive overreaction by the employers of the people involved.
     
  2. eric/ Guest

    eric/

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  3. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #3
    I would rather she have given them an icy stare or just moved.

    I doubt she intended to get people fired, but posting photos and accusations about what people (may have) said is a pretty serious thing to do these days.

    That's a taint that doesn't wash off easily.

    It's a power that I prefer people not indulge in so casually.
     
  4. Mac'nCheese macrumors 68030

    Mac'nCheese

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    #4
    Wait, I keep rereading the story and then the posts following it. The woman who was offended lost her job, right?
     
  5. balamw Moderator

    balamw

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    #5
  6. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    Agreed. There is no right to not be offended by someone. As citizenzen said she should have given them the stink eye, said something directly to them, or moved.
     
  7. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

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    #7
    So as long as it is a joke, it doesn't matter if it is discriminatory? A racist joke is ok because it's just a joke?

    Have no problem that she tweeted it, but I wouldn't have posted a picture of the guys doing it. That went too far, IMHO.
     
  8. jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #8
    The following long-ish blog post explains it in more detail, and, appears to be one of the best summations. Bottom line: "We all lost."

    http://amandablumwords.wordpress.com/2013/03/21/3/
     
  9. Mac'nCheese macrumors 68030

    Mac'nCheese

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    #9
    True. But.....if -big if- your employee sends you to a conference and decides that you are making your company look bad by being u professional, shouldn't they have the freedom to fire you?
     
  10. JohnLT13 macrumors 6502a

    JohnLT13

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    #10
    Im at a loss here, How can someone be offended by a statement not directed at or to said person. Typical example of people minding other peoples business.:confused:
     
  11. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

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    #11
    Wow. If that is indeed accurate, I don't pity her. She sounds like a person looking to be offended so she can play the victim in a male dominated industry.

    Though not saying she deserved the ridicule( death threats, rape threats, etc) due to her how to put it, oversensitivity.
     
  12. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #12
    Of course the company can do that. And ultimately, I think that is why one person from the company did get fired. That said, based on the second link, I think Adria goes through life looking for reasons to be offended and make mountains out of mole hills.
     
  13. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

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    #13
    Excellent point of view. And I completely agree.

    I'm a woman, and a programmer - I think this is going to hurt more than help those of us in the field. It is true that we work in a field dominated by men. It's also true that, unfortunately, we have to deal with this kind of thing regularly (offensive behavior-though I don't believe that was the case here). However, I believe she could have done this in a different way. We've all been in the position where we have to make a choice to "say something" or "ignore" - there's a fine line between making jokes and trying to be offensive or cause embarrassment. I believe in saying something - just let them know that you aren't a pushover and you like to joke as much as everyone else, but there is a line, and in most cases we're all better off for it.

    In this instance, the comments weren't directed at her and were probably misinterpreted. Had she gone up to them and said, "hey, not cool", they probably would have apologized and talked much more quietly. Instead, 2 people have lost their job. She got the notoriety she was oviously looking for - and it went further then she probably expected.
     
  14. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #14
    Agreed. When my family goes to the Broncos games, there is usually a few drunk people around us. And as can be expected, the language sometimes gets a bit colorful. My son is 12 and I usually don't say much until the f-bombs start flying. I ask them politely to just top using that particular word. And it has worked every time.
     
  15. jnpy!$4g3cwk, Mar 22, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2013

    jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #15

    I guess this is where I am having the problem. Social media in general, and, Twitter specifically, encourage people to make an equivalence between the two things -- turning around and making a comment to the people, and, tweeting about it. And yet, as it turns out, she and one of guys were one tweet away from getting fired, so, they aren't really equivalent after all. But, if she had tweeted something meaningless, it would have vanished into the ether, forgotten, as it should have been. We expect Presidents and Prime Ministers to watch every single word at a state dinner, but, can we really expect a billion people to use social media everyday without messing up occasionally? Where are the mods to prevent people from making fools of themselves constantly?
     
  16. Mousse macrumors 68000

    Mousse

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    #16
    I've always been the live and let live sort. I usually ignore other folk's idiosyncrasies, unless it crosses into my personal space.

    So you've met the Missus. My wife is easily offended, which by proxy, makes me easily offended.:rolleyes: A man has got to do what a man has got to do.:p I've lost count at the number of confrontations (and (_!_) kicking I've taken as a result) I could have easily avoided if I had remained single.
     
  17. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #17
    Adria chose to make a private comment between 2 people into a public affair. She is an adult, and should realize that sometimes there are unattended consequences to our actions.
     
  18. eric/ Guest

    eric/

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    #18
    No, it doesn't matter. Unless you're in the work place, and you're being harassed by these jokes.
     
  19. jdechko macrumors 68040

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    #19
    Being discriminatory isn't cool. But when you make a sex joke and then complain when someone else makes a sex joke, it's a double standard.

    Like another poster said, if she had just politely asked the guys to refrain from making comments, this whole thing would have blown over with no fall out. Instead, she overreacted and decided to go on a crusade "for all women". Really, though, it was just for her (reading the Ars Technica articles, that's how it seems anyway).
     
  20. balamw Moderator

    balamw

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    #20
    Most professionals would argue that representing your employer at a professional conference at the employer's expense makes this "in the work place" as to the harassment aspect, unfortunately that is somewhat subjective.

    B
     
  21. eawmp1 macrumors 601

    eawmp1

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    #21
    The problem is technology has advanced more than our common sense.

    People have been saying and doing stupid things forever. However, in the past, it was heresay resulting in a nasty look or a comment.

    When you record and broadcast something, it is now in the open. This public shaming (ala the scarlet letter) fans flames, ignores context, and is overly punative. It also reflects on the character of the person reporting it. Something that could have been dealt with in the moment is now passively-aggressively put out for others to "do the dirty work."

    Both sides reflect poorly on the employer and they had every right to fire all involved.

    That having been said, deliberate harrassment has no business in the workplace.
     
  22. eric/ Guest

    eric/

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    #22
    Well yeah, I would tend to agree, and apparently so did the employer who fired that guy.
     
  23. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

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    #23
    Oh no doubt. Read my second post replying to a person wrote in their blog about her. She is a person on a crusade who will look for anything to be offended about and further her cause. That is when I lost pity for her. I don't mind that she tweeted about two guys being sexists in her mind. But, posting a picture of them was wrong even if she wasn't an oversensitive, overeager, etc person bent on pushing her, " Everyone is against women" agenda.

    As I said as well, she and her ex-employer doesn't deserve the response she got though. DDOS attacks, death threats, rape threats, etc. And by these people doing what they are doing, they are giving her ammo and further making herself out to be the victim of the sexist tech industry, etc.
     
  24. Puevlo macrumors 6502a

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    #24
    Professional victims doing what they do best.
     
  25. balamw Moderator

    balamw

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    #25
    So how do you reconcile that with your earlier statement:
    Does the First Amendment also give you the right to yell "Fire!" in a crowded theater?

    B
     

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