GTA:SA From M to AO

Phat_Pat

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Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. (NASDAQ: TTWO) announced today that the Entertainment Software Rating Board (ESRB) has changed the rating of Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas on all platforms from "Mature 17+" (M) to "Adults Only 18+" (AO) because of the so-called "hot coffee mod," an unauthorized third party modification that alters the retail version of the game. Take-Two cooperated fully with the ESRB's investigation.
Link

Another Link

So do you guys think its fair?
 

ipacmm

macrumors 65816
Jun 17, 2003
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Cincinnati, OH
I don't think it is really fair because it is something that can only be seen by unlocking it through codes or software. If it was something that was right there in the game that everyone can see, that something different.

Also I still believe that parents should watch what they are buying their kids and to stop blaming the publishers that it was there fault that the game is bought and/or played by kids under 17.
 

Nermal

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Dec 7, 2002
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Interesting - in NZ, M and AO mean exactly the same thing, which is that you need to be 16. The difference is that M is enforced, whereas AO isn't.

However, I'm not sure whether this applies to games or just movies and TV. Games seem to carry the same rating stickers as movies, so I assume it applies to them too.
 

keysersoze

macrumors 68000
Jan 6, 2004
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Nermal said:
Interesting - in NZ, M and AO mean exactly the same thing, which is that you need to be 16. The difference is that M is enforced, whereas AO isn't.
Man, teenagers can find out anything they want on the internet at anytime. Think a 17 year old cares he has to wait until 18 to play the game? Porn is about as easy to access as air.
 

MacNut

macrumors Core
Jan 4, 2002
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I don't understand why mature is set to 17 in the first place, It should be Mature 18, Adults Only 21.
 

ipacmm

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Jun 17, 2003
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Cincinnati, OH
MacNut said:
I don't understand why mature is set to 17 in the first place, It should be Mature 18, Adults Only 21.
I think the reason why they have it for 17 is because that is the age for R-rated movies so a R-rated game should have the same as the movies...
 

applekid

macrumors 68020
Jul 3, 2003
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Somebody needs to take a hit. Whatever to keep the politicians away. It sounds like Rockstar is re-releasing GTA:SA without the code for a rated M version. For the AO version, maybe they should just put in plain sight. Who needs mods or cheat codes? ;)

Though, the ESRB has plenty of reforming to do, as noted in the original "Hot Coffee" thread here, so I can't say I'm completely satisified, and there's no word if the politicians will still be pouncing on this issue.
 

Santaduck

macrumors 6502a
Oct 21, 2003
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Honolulu
applekid said:
... and there's no word if the politicians will still be pouncing on this issue.
That's exactly the case. It goes way beyond GTA & Rockstar if the federal government introduces regulatory oversight, something that is relatively more likely given a Republican congress & white house although it easily goes beyond party lines as a hot button issue (Sen. Clinton).

This would make the ESRB (i.e. self regulation by the game industry) obsolete.

What Rockstar did could affect all titles on all platforms. Their carelessness is inexcusable, and we may all feel its effects, regardless of whether we play/like GTA.

Let's hope the ESRB does something to calm the politicos down.

____________________________


regarding fairness:
What if the latest harry potter book had hardcore pr0n photo spread covered by a combination lock. What if M$ office had loads of password-protected pr0n video mpegs hidden away? "We never intended the customer to be able to see it" is an empty explanation. Rockstar could bring the ESRB down with this.: Whether or not you agree with the decency standards or whether or not teenager can find pr0n elsewhere in gray channels is irrelevant.
 

IndyGopher

macrumors 6502a
Nov 3, 2001
782
1
Indianapolis, IN
I can't decide which is more pathetic... losers who put porn in a video game, losers who search high and low FOR the porn in a video game, or the kneejerk-stricken buttmonkeys in Washington that think that porn in a video game is somehow going to further twist the aforementioned losers. The idea that Clinton would say ANYTHING about porn in the media would be laughable if it weren't so revolting. Everyone I know from (and in) New York state openly apologizes for her holding office in their names.
 

LethalWolfe

macrumors G3
Jan 11, 2002
9,366
119
Los Angeles
Santaduck said:
regarding fairness:
What if the latest harry potter book had hardcore pr0n photo spread covered by a combination lock. What if M$ office had loads of password-protected pr0n video mpegs hidden away? "We never intended the customer to be able to see it" is an empty explanation. Rockstar could bring the ESRB down with this.: Whether or not you agree with the decency standards or whether or not teenager can find pr0n elsewhere in gray channels is irrelevant.

That's a pathetic, sensationalistic apples to bananas comparison. It's not like GTA is a Pokemon game that was rated "E" for everyone. It was rated M, and had hidden, disabled softcore action that required a very pointed effort to find and unlock. Is M$ Office or Harry Potter rated and intended for mature audiences only?

If a kid is allowed to rent a softcore porn from the video store is that the filmmakers fault? If parent's get a softcore porn for their kid is that the filmmakers fault? If a kid downloads a softcore porn off P2P is that the filmmakers fault?

Has this whole thing turned a mole hill into a mountatin? IMO yes.

It's a mature game w/mature content, and was sold as such. But hey, what can you do when ignorant, headline grabbing politicians and pathetic, do-nothing parents get a wild hair up their @ss to save humanity from itself? I guess it's reasonable enough since before video games we lived in a peaceful paradise where everyone was always fully clothed and nobody ever had sex...


Lethal
 

GFLPraxis

macrumors 604
Mar 17, 2004
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IMHO Grand Theft Auto should have been rated AO a long time ago. It's mind-boggling that GTA could have the same rating as, say, Halo. Either that or we need more ratings.
 

TheMonarch

macrumors 65816
May 6, 2005
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Bay Area
NOOOOOOOO!!!! I was going to buy the game today!!!! DAMN IT! Those parents who buy Mature games for their 12 yearolds and bitch about it can go to hell. UGH!

I dont think that this video game should be sold to little kids, but thats why its rated "M"... M!!! READ THE RATINGS PEOPLE!!! Parents should be aware about what they're buying for their little kid, no one else.

So it was all good when you got to steal, shoot cops, kill pedestrians, with blood all over the place. But as sson as we see a polygonal boob, THINK OF THE CHILDREN! Right. The "Hot coffee" scene wasen't intended to be played anyways. Even if rockstar did put it there on purpose, so what? Its for mature people. You have to willingly mod the game in order to see it (or some cheating device). I'd be a different story if its suddenly appeared in a mario game or something, but this is GTA we're talkin' about!

I can still get the game technically, but where the hell am I supposed to find an AO rated game? EB games won't have it anymore, nor wal-mart, target. My main videogame sources. Its just not fair to the rest of us.
 

Phat_Pat

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GFLPraxis said:
removed awesome picture
lol thats great.

R* should of just came out and announced from the beginning that the code was in the final product but was choosen to be removed from the game... instead of lying and saying moders did it.... :rolleyes:

blaskillet4 said:
I can still get the game technically, but where the hell am I supposed to find an AO rated game? EB games won't have it anymore, nor wal-mart, target. My main videogame sources. Its just not fair to the rest of us.
I'm sure those places will most likely have the unedited version of the game up for sale for a few more days before reliezing that the game is now rated AO.

Its not like the label suddenly changes......

R* is also going to make an edited version without the "hot coffee" code (that will keep the M rating) and release a patch that will remove the code from the PC version....

They apparently are also giving out AO warning labels to stores that wish to continue to sell the unedited version...
 

LethalWolfe

macrumors G3
Jan 11, 2002
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Los Angeles
GFLPraxis said:
IMHO Grand Theft Auto should have been rated AO a long time ago. It's mind-boggling that GTA could have the same rating as, say, Halo. Either that or we need more ratings.
As I mentioned in the other GTA thread the ESRB has, IIRC, 7 basic ratings ("E", "M", etc.,) and dozens of content specific identifiers ("violence", "language" "sexual content", etc.,) that they use.

The inherent problem is that you have to use a simple, easy to understand, finite rating system to label an infinite number of variables in the hundreds of video games out there. I think the ESRB is very flexible, but you have to read the whole rating not just the big "E" or "M."

It's the same way with movies. You can get an "R" rating for a number of reasons. "Show Girls", "Rambo", and "Planes, Trains and Automobiles" are all rated R movies, but they are all completely different films.


Lethal
 

doppelganger

macrumors member
Jun 15, 2005
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dubbz said:
So consensual Sex is much worse than Murder and require a higher rating?
well said, i was thinking the same thing. can you imagine someone saying, "oh man, now i can't have sex. looks like i'll just have to go back killing police officers, blowing up buildings and running over people in my stolen car."
 

Doctor Q

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Sep 19, 2002
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I haven't been paying close enough attention to understand something. Why did they put the code in the game in the first place? What was the motive?
 

LethalWolfe

macrumors G3
Jan 11, 2002
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Los Angeles
Doctor Q said:
I haven't been paying close enough attention to understand something. Why did they put the code in the game in the first place? What was the motive?
This is assumption, but I think it's pretty accurate. The code was intended to be in the game all along, but the ESRB said,"Yer getting an AO rating if that pathetic softcore stays in the game." So they deactivated the code. Apparently removing the code is a royal PITA 'cause even in the "new" rated M versions to be released the code will just be locked up tighter, not removed.


Lethal
 

0098386

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Jan 18, 2005
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if it was a good game i'd care somewhat. but if it has violence, drugs, sex etc then by the system thats judged every film and game for decades now then i suppose it should be 18+. but hey, GTA is special. it needs special attention. :rolleyes:

sidetrack moment: people always say that violence gets censored more than sex, and people complain saying that sex is love and violence corrupts etc. haha. funny people. having one night stands and using vulgar terms for the opposite sex is supposed to reinforce love? people like that need to get a firm grip on reality.
 

GFLPraxis

macrumors 604
Mar 17, 2004
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raggedjimmi said:
if it was a good game i'd care somewhat. but if it has violence, drugs, sex etc then by the system thats judged every film and game for decades now then i suppose it should be 18+. but hey, GTA is special. it needs special attention. :rolleyes:

sidetrack moment: people always say that violence gets censored more than sex, and people complain saying that sex is love and violence corrupts etc. haha. funny people. having one night stands and using vulgar terms for the opposite sex is supposed to reinforce love? people like that need to get a firm grip on reality.
Agreed here; It had drugs, violence, sex, and profanity beforehand. It should have been 18+ (AO) long before.
 

yg17

macrumors G5
Aug 1, 2004
14,888
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The entire point of this game is to commit violent crimes, auto theft, drug deals, ect. The language is filthy, the storylines behind the game aren't for kids either and the GTA series is possibly the most violent game ever made, and these people are whining about a hidden sex scene, and to top that all off, I'm pretty sure the characters are fully clothed during the "sex" scene. People need to stop being so uptight. Its not like a kid would accidentally stumble across this during gameplay, and no one under 17 should have had a copy of GTA:SA in the first place since its rated M. In order to access this, you have to install that mod, so you know what you're getting. You're not just going to come across it during regular gameplay. These parents that are complaining need to first of all, **** and then maybe try doing some parenting so their 10 year old doesn't own every game in the GTA series in the first place.

I work at Target and sometimes in electronics, so I see what games parents buy for their kids. They come in with their kid who can't be a day older than 7 and buy them all sorts of violent games clearly rated T and M and a description of what got the game that rating on the back. I forgot what it was called, but a couple weeks ago, some parent bought a game for their little kid with the word "death" or "kill" or something like that in the title, which clearly showed the game was violent and had that M clearly visible on the cover. She comes back 10 minutes later after buying it to return it and said "I didn't realize the game was that violent" Well DUH! And these are the same parents that turn around and raise hell and blame the video game industry when they find out their kid thinks shooting people is fun.

And besides, its not like an animated sex scene or a cuss word is going to hurt anyone. Did the world end when Janet Jackson's tit popped out at the Super Bowl? Nope. Did anything bad happen when System of a Down's guitarist dropped the f-bomb on SNL during their performance of BYOB? Nope. Did kids turn to crime when Bono said whatever it was at the Grammys or whatever award show it was? Nope. So is a little animated sex going to hurt kids? Nope

Now before someone asks if I had kids and would want them to be exposed to that stuff, no I wouldn't. However, I'd make sure that they didn't have violent video games to begin with until they were older, and if they did see something at a young age, I wouldn't act like it was the end of the world. I'd actually take the time to sit down with my kids-something that most people don't seem to have time for or are too lazy to do nowadays-and have a talk with them so they know that carjacking someone at gunpoint is wrong.

Besides, now that many houses have digital cable or satellite TV, your kid can see some real porn on Cinemax or something. And all he has to do to get that is hit a few buttons on a remote, no complicated game hacks there.


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