Guns in the home raise suicide, homicide risk, review confirms

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by lannister80, Jan 21, 2014.

  1. lannister80 macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #1
    http://www.nbcnews.com/health/guns-home-raise-suicide-homicide-risk-review-confirms-2D11950306

    New data is always good.
     
  2. edk99 macrumors 6502a

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  3. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #3
    That's your first reaction?

    You're more concerned about "gun bashing" than suicides and homicides?

    ----------

    Yes. New data is good.

    Funny how it keeps coming out on the side of guns in the home being a danger to personal safety.
     
  4. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #4

    That should be a statement, not a question. ;)

    I am far more concerned about Homicide than Suicide.

    Suicide is free will (segue to another thread), but Society does not/cannot endorse it.
     
  5. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #5
    I agree with you regarding suicide (euthanasia) as an alternative to terminal illness/end of life issues.

    But suicide is often driven by a moments of profound but temporary despair.

    Society doesn't condone giving into that despair because we understand that once those episodes pass, one rediscovers the desire to continue living.
     
  6. nebo1ss macrumors 68030

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    #6
    There was a rather unfortunate case recently where a Father accidently shot and killed his Step-Daughter who had sneeked out for the evening and was sneeking back in. Its just another potential risk of guns in the home.

    I assume he thought it was someone breaking in his home. Although making a call to shoot first and check later says a lot about the situation.
     
  7. Droidrage729 macrumors 6502

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    #7
    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/19/us/19chemical.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 I remember when this was occurring in the us a lot there were no movements to ban.......detergent or....... Cars in fact I think tall buildings and prescription medication are still around. Blaming guns for suicide makes as much sense as blaming guns for starting wars. The person holding the gun is making the decisions the gun doesn't leap into the persons hand use common sense. I have a bunch of guns all of which are locked in a huge heavy secure safe.
     
  8. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #8
    We would require another thread to delve into this topic.

    There are many nuances to uncover in Societies disdain for Suicide.
     
  9. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #9
    But..but… "shall not be infringed!"

    :rolleyes:

    Seriously, though.. this is good data to weigh options on. I really do worry about the rise in suicide/homicide in the home from this.. to the point where I had to turn the local news off last night because there were two stories regarding this very thing happening in my area; one was to a 4 year old.. my son's age.

    I can't and don't want to imagine what could happen.. I just can't.

    BL.
     
  10. lannister80 thread starter macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #10
    Detergent, cars, and tall buildings are all quite useful in the day to day life of our society. Guns are not. Guns have the worst "danger:utility" ratio of just about anything you can legally get your hands on.

    Suicides happen in a temporary moment of desperation. The goal is to get the person through that period without killing themselves. Having a gun handy is like having a big red button you can press to instantly kill yourself. Easy to press in a moment of desperation.

    So yes, I do blame the presence of guns for many suicides that would not have been successful otherwise.


    Good.
     
  11. elistan macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    From what I understand, that doesn't protect you from suicide. (But it does protect others, assuming only you have the ability to unlock it.) If you ever experience an episode of severe acute depression, you still have the ability to quickly access a method of suicide that's 80% to 90% effective. (From Wikipedia, which unfortunately references a journal article behind a paywall.) Of course, you still could attempt suicide by some other method, but since all those other methods are less effective you'd have a greater chance of surviving through the episode of acute severe depression.
     
  12. Technarchy macrumors 603

    Technarchy

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    #12
    Sorta strange that all these guns are laying around, and the USA still has far less suicides than japan which has almost no guns.

    Strange how that works.
     
  13. CalWizrd Suspended

    CalWizrd

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    #13
    I guess truth really is stranger than fiction.
     
  14. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #14
    As the person said above, the presence of a gun can change the end result drastically. Let me ask you, do you think a guy who's thinking of robbing a convenience store will have the same motivation whether or not he has a gun?

    Same goes for suicide. If some guy had a really bad breakup and is sitting there miserable and thinking his life is over, will having a gun accessible to him change the outcome, as opposed to having a belt to hang himself or a razor to slice his wrists?

    Do you think there is no difference?

    Whoa. So the data proves that having more guns prevents suicides!!!
     
  15. lannister80 thread starter macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #15
    Imagine if there were guns laying around in Japan...it would be even worse.
     
  16. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #16
    Okay, so "Having guns in the home triples the risk of suicide and doubles the risk of homicide". Then what? where is this going?

    Meanwhile in Detroit...

    link

    Secure your weapon you ****ing idiot!!
     
  17. LIVEFRMNYC macrumors 603

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    #17
    If someone really wants to kill them self, they will find a way without a gun. Isn't purposely overdosing the most common suicide?
     
  18. Moyank24 macrumors 601

    Moyank24

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    #18
    I know I posted statistics on this a while back, and IIRC guns accounted for about half of suicides. I'll see if I can find it, and if I can I'll post.
     
  19. lannister80 thread starter macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #19
    Most people only want to kill themselves for a short period of time. If you can get them through that crisis without killing themselves, that's a suicide prevented.

    Not having the tools to easily kill yourself is a critical part of getting through that period without actually killing yourself.

    75% of attempts are overdoses/poisoning, but the person survives that type of attempt 97% of the time. So only 3% of poisoning/OD attempts are successful.

    Suicide attempts with a gun, however, are successful 90% of the time. 3% success vs 90% success.

    2004 stats on actual successful suicides by method:
    Firearms: 16,750
    Poisoning/OD: 5,800

    Even though 193,333 people tried to poison/overdose, only 5,800 succeeded.

    Only 18,611 tried to commit suicide by gun (9.6% of the number who tried to OD), yet the actual number of deaths (16,750) is nearly 3x that of ODing.


    http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_index.php?idx=119&d=1&w=5&e=28649
    http://www.suicide.org/suicide-statistics.html

    ----------

    51.6% in 2004.

    http://www.suicide.org/suicide-statistics.html#2004
     
  20. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #20
    That seems to be the case for the dad of rapper Professor Green.
     
  21. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #21
    I'm with you partner, I don't want any bothersome so-called facts to muddle my perception of what it takes to be free. Kind of like Doc Holiday, I want to be prepared for the likes of the Claibornes and Clantons when they appear! :p
     
  22. lannister80 thread starter macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #22
    As they say: "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem".
     
  23. chown33 macrumors 604

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    #23
    This thread is turning into a virtual duplicate of another one:
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1684154&page=3

    The suicide issue comes up around post #74 or so.

    There's also this thread:
    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1646401

    Both should be a goldmine of reusable citations, links, and well-used arguments.
     
  24. LIVEFRMNYC macrumors 603

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    #24
    Thanks for the stats. IMO ... What's to stop someone who lives many stories high in an apartment from jumping if they don't have a gun? Or jumping off a high bridge? I know the psychological fear might be greater but the rate of success is probably similar.
     
  25. iJohnHenry, Jan 21, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2014

    iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #25
    If only the problems of some were temporary, that could be true.

    But it is not.

    Speak to someone who is suffering terribly due to a terminal disease for which there is no known cure.

    Then there are terminal conditions that show no physical pain. Say, as an extreme example, ALS*.



    *Please don't reference Stephen Hawking, for there are still arguments as to whether he has ALS or not.
     

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