I have already tried to discuss this but it got derailed. So I hope the title is clear. This is not an I/P thread. I am mindful that Muslims in the West complain that they as a whole get lumped in with the nutter terrorists. That because of the media, ordinary Muslims feel they get perceived as supporters of terrorism just because they might wear a burkah or pray at a mosque. On the whole I think it's a legitimate complaint. The muslims I know are just like any other Australians I know, including my Iranian landlord who I just converted to mac. (So now he has a dual religion.) But when I see that their top religious leaders give sermons in the biggest mosques, that say the most provocative statements that they can legally get away with, and this is reported and it's only ever excused, then I really wonder how these people are able to get such respect from their community. Respect to the point where there is no opposing voice. Hilaly (the No1 Mufti in Australia at the time) for example deliberately picked a recent case where some Lebanese Muslims were convicted of a pack rape that fell under the category of the "Worst Case" which is how judges work out sentencing. These people were given jail sentences of 54 years, that's how bad it was, but Hilaly used this as an example of Muslim victimisation, he said the sentence was unfair and in the same "sermon" made his famous accusation that women who stray from the house or are not covered top to toe are like "uncovered meat" "you can't blame a cat for eating meat you leave out". I don't believe that Hilaly is a fool. And I don't believe his audience are fools either. People like Hilaly are the 'face of Islam' if you like, here in Australia. What is the average Australian (Muslim or not) supposed to think when he finds out that this is the sort of sermon that a Mosque full of people are listening to. Now take that weirdo in Finsbury Park mosque, who I now believe is in Jail, British Muslims were quick to disassociate themselves from him. But this doesn't happen in Australia, the most we usually get is that "he was mistranslated" but this wears a bit thin after the 10th time. Now we have the new Top Immam in Australia saying that Hamas do not use terrorism even though Hamas themselves claim every single school bus they blow up. In other words he deliberately gives the sort of impression that is the precise opposite of what he claims is true. OK we can all see that this is some sort of game whereby one tries to say one thing while in fact saying the opposite, and there's nothing wrong with that if he wasn't one of the people who represent the face of Islam to the media. Why do not the Muslims who attend the mosques put up with people who create such divisiveness.