How to: Bluray to Apple TV with Forced Subtitles on a Mac

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by jschonert, Feb 28, 2011.

  1. jschonert macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2010
    #1
    Im really really sorry if this has been posted before, but I felt like I did a pretty decent search on this forum looking for a good solution to converting Bluray to Apple TV with forced subtitles on a Mac and didn't find anything. I loved the automation software that is stickied to this forum, but I always had terrible results with Blurays and definitely no forced subtitles.

    I found this quick guide on a Handbrake forum randomly and it has worked perfectly for all my movies that require Forced Subtitles to make any sense (Inglorious Basterds, District 9, etc..).

    Programs you Need:
    MakeMKV
    MKVtools
    BDSup2Sub
    MKVtoolnix
    Handbrake

    1: Load up the Blu-Ray disc in MakeMKV. Locate your track; uncheck the master level Subtitles option, but leave the forced only option checked. Then rip.

    2: Extract the subtitle track out of the rip using MKVtools (this option is found under the EDIT tab). (If there is no track available, you will likely need to select the whole subtitle in Step 1 and then check "Forced" on Step 4)

    3: Load the extracted .sup file in BDSup2Sub (don't select any of the conversion options initially presented). Once loaded, set the Output Format to SUB/IDX, then Save/Export from the File menu.

    4: Using Mkvtoolnix, under Input, add the rip you made from MakeMKV, then add the IDX file. De-select the original subtitle track (should be labeled S_HGMV/PGS, or something similar). Select the VobSub track and under track options, set the language to whatever is appropriate. Then Start Muxing.

    5: Once muxing is complete, load up the new file in Handbrake, set your options, and be sure to select your new subtitle track before hitting Start. DO NOT select the Forced option.

    A couple notes: this guide was written with the intent that the subtitles get burned in for MP4 compatibility. There's no need to use the "Forced" flag if done this way because only the forced subtitles will get ripped to begin with. Just burn them in as if they weren't forced. If you try to use the "Forced" option in HandBrake, this presumably will fail (unless you happened to enable the "forced" flag while in step 4). If you plan to make an MKV file in the end with HandBrake, but don't want the subs burned in, be sure to set the "Forced" flag for the VobSub track in step 4, and (obviously) not use the "Burned In" option in HandBrake but do use the "Forced Only" option.

    Sometimes when you select the forced subtitle file in MakeMKV, nothing shows up in MKVTools. I found I would just select the whole subtitle and then with Step 4, I add the only Forced Subtitle option. Works just as well.

    Hope this helps. I may not be the best assistant with your questions since I basically just followed these instructions from "Lifeisabeach" on the Handbrake forum.
     
  2. blairh macrumors 68030

    blairh

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #2
    Would really appreciate a definitive answer to this:

    I'm contemplating purchasing an external BD drive and ripping using MakeMKV. I'm concerned about forced subtitles. In my research online I've come across a bunch of forum postings where users are having trouble locating and making sure they included the forced subtitles with their rips (for the movies that feature them). Is it always obvious which line corresponds to the forced subtitle? Especially important when you rip a movie and you don't even know for sure if your movie features them.

    As for everything else, I'd purchase a 2 TB external drive and keep the mkv file intact, even if it's pretty big. And then I'll play with VLC. If I run out of room I'll buy another external drive. WD sells 2 TB ones for a touch over $100 on Amazon.

    Also looking for a good BD external drive. I'd like to spend $100 max. Does anyone have experience with this one?
     
  3. jschonert thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2010
    #3
    The easiest way Ive found is when using MakeMKV, I select the first English subtitle file. Using the branching hierarchy, its pretty easy to pick out the subtitle files. Deselect the other languages or other English files.

    When you use MKVtools, there should only be one file available that is the subtitle file. If there isn't one at all and all there thats available is the video and audio file, then you'll need to redo MakeMKV again. With all my Blurays I have, this always worked. Like I mentioned, there were a few when I would try selecting the "Forced" english subtitle in MakeMKV and nothing would be available in MKVtools.

    As for Bluray player, I purchased this Bluray player on Amazon with this external case. Ended up being about $100 total. With the external drive, I couldnt actually play the Blurays, but my iMac could see the disc and MakeMKV could find the data off the disc.

    Hope that helped..
     
  4. blairh macrumors 68030

    blairh

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #4
    The thing is though that I don't plan on using MKVtools. Not really sure what that does in itself. I'd just be ripping with MakeMKV and just playing that with VLC. Is it clear when you insert the BD and fire up MakeMKV which box needs to be checked for the forced subtitles? Does it actually say "forced" in the line?
     
  5. gunthermic macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    #5
    Not sure why, however using the automation scripts sticky in this forum do encode and have subtitles in BD movies. I have done several with no issues myself. Believe it or not what you describe is basically what those same scripts do. Nothing magical about it. That is why you mus thave all those programs installed for his scripts to use.

    HB will do subtitles for DVD's no problems. It's built into the last full release and the newest nightlies. BD's from my understanding is being worked on, but right now, you it must be pulled out and converted and be mux'ed back in.
     
  6. rayward macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    #6
    When you load a BD and fire up MakeMKV (doesn't matter which order), the app will pull up all the files on the BD. You can select options for it to automatically ignore files of less than a certain length (trailers etc.) to keep your list short, but that's up to you. Obviously the movie file is the largest one on the list, so deselect any other files you don't want.

    Then click the movie file's triangle to open the drop down list of all the tracks in that file. It will show you the video track, all the audio tracks and all the subtitle tracks, split between full and "forced". Deselect the tracks you don't want, making sure to leave the movie, at least one audio track, plus the subtitle track(s) you do want. Then hit the "MakeMKV" button!

    This should work with any external Blu Ray drive (which has to be capable of at least burning a DVD). I have this one, for which I didn't pay $550!! (Don't know what happened to their prices, but this seems about double what I paid a year ago). It's good, but I do recommend getting the AC adapter as I had a few problems with powering the thing trying to run it off either the single or double USB connection only. (For that much money, the adapter should be thrown in for free!)
     
  7. blairh macrumors 68030

    blairh

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #7
    Thanks for this reply. So are you saying that for the subtitle tracks it is clear which one is full (I'm guessing that means subtitles running throughout the film?) and which one is forced? Does the track actually read "forced" at some point? (If the movie contains forced subtitles, of course.)
     
  8. rayward macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    #8
    Yes, it's very clear. The track listing will show all the subtitles, grouped so that the "full" English is listed and the "forced" English is immediately underneath, indented, and marked as forced.

    I'd load a screenshot but I'm at work. It's really obvious when you try it.
     
  9. blairh macrumors 68030

    blairh

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #9

    Okay thanks. That's really important. It would be so frustrating to sit back with my new MKV on my HDTV and then find out the forced subtitles were missing.
     
  10. blairh macrumors 68030

    blairh

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2007
    #10
    Out of curiosity, is there any specific audio track I should make sure I keep checked? Also, on average how large are the raw Mkv files post rip? I've read they are usually 20 GBs but can hit 35 GBs on some titles.
     
  11. gunthermic macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    #11
    The audio tracks really depend on your stereo setup and where you plan on playing these as well.

    using a iPhone or iPad, you on need the ACC or Stero 2.0 (Ithink that's how it's labeled) vs 3/2, HD, THD for Dobly Digtal type of sound for a 5.1 sound out of Stereo/TV setup.

    And yes they can hit anywhere from 15-35 gig depending on the movie. And of course what you select for audio/subtitles.
     
  12. stormtrooper030 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2012
    #12
    Mac User

    I have tried everything and there is so much out on the internet that it gets confusing for a novic as myself. I have all the tools needed except for the BDSup2Sub as this will not run on a Macintosh. What other tool can I use for this step on a Mac so I can complete my subtitles to be forced in?
     
  13. peterjcat macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    #13
    BDSup2Sub does run on the Mac. You may need to have the right version of Java installed.
     
  14. stormtrooper030 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2012
    #14
    BDSup2Sub

    What version of Java do I need and where is the BDSup file so I can begin this process. Be trying to locate for over 3 weeks now. No luck.
     
  15. omni macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    #15
    What error does it give you? I don't remember needing any special version of Java - I just clicked on the file and ran it.

    It doesn't install itself or have a .dmg or anything - just open it up

    (but i've had it running for over a year now so maybe I remember wrong but i honestly don't' remember doing any work to make it run)
     
  16. hipnetic macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    #16
    It has been stated in this thread a couple of times that if you don't get a separate forced subtitle track extracted out of MKVtools that you may need to re-rip the movie with MakeMKV, but my experience has been that if you don't get a separate subtitle track, it's likely because there actually aren't any forced subtitles. MakeMKV will *always* have a "Forced subtitles" checkbox, even though most movies do not have forced subtitles. So you need to check this off during the MakeMKV rip *just in case* but when you then go to demux that subtitle track, if you don't get a separate subtitle track extracted, that's probably because that movie didn't really have any forced subtitles. If someone thinks I'm wrong on this, feel free to correct me.

    One other note...If you use XBMC and if the movie you're ripping was encoded as MP4 (on the Blu-ray disc), then you can possibly get away without needing to use Handbrake to downconvert the movie to a more compressed MP4 format. You can keep the subtitles separate and XBMC will let you overlay them onto the video. My experience has been that the video might pause briefly when the subtitles first appear, which I chalk up to the ATV2 not having a super-powerful CPU/GPU, but overall it works fine. Now if the video was not encoded as MP4, but rather one of the other two video encoding formats supported by Blu-ray discs, the ATV2's GPU can't natively decode those, and the CPU isn't powerful enough to do it, either, so with those movies, you'll need to re-encode the MKV into an MP4 using Handbrake.
     
  17. rayward macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    #17
    Of the movies with non-English subtitles I have ripped with MakeMKV, none have had forced tags on subs within the main subtitle track. They've all had an entirely separate track which contains just the non-English subs.
     
  18. stormtrooper030 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2012
    #18
    Forced subtitles only

    I have all the necessary tools as suggested in this article. I have done everything that was advised. Here is my problem:

    I follow all the steps exactly how suggested. I then handbrake to downsize the file which works great. When I play the movie (2012 is the movie I am using this for) it puts in all the subtitles in english, even when they are speaking english. I do not want this. I only want the subtitles when they are speaking in a foreign language.

    I purchased Pavtube Blu-Ray Ripper for this feature. It works great except for one thing. When I go to play the movie on apple tv(2nd Gen), it is choppy every 2-3 seconds. I followed their instructions and it does not work. I am frustrated to the point that I am contemplating on just rebuying the movies from iTunes, but do not want to do this as I already have the movie.

    If someone can please explain step by step how to only get the subtitles when they are not speaking english with this process and then handbraking, it would be greatly appreciated.
     
  19. stormtrooper030 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2012
    #19
    Forced Subtitles to Handbrake from mkv file

    Ok, I have been able to get all of the required tools to rip the bluray to an mkv file. I am able to get the subtitles when I rip and then complete with handbrake, but I get all of the subtitles. I do not want them all. I only want the subtitles when they are not speaking english. I have tried for over 3 weeks now to do this with 2012, but I keep getting the subtitles even when they speak english.

    I purchased the Pavtube Bluray Ripper for this exact application, but when I try to do all of the required settings they suggest, the video plays choppy on the apple tv.

    If someone can please explain what I need to do to get only the forced subtitles only when they are speaking a foreign language and being able to complete this with handbrake, it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thank you for any replys.
     
  20. stormtrooper030 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2012
    #20
    Ok, I have been able to get all of the required tools to rip the bluray to an mkv file. I am able to get the subtitles when I rip and then complete with handbrake, but I get all of the subtitles. I do not want them all. I only want the subtitles when they are not speaking english. I have tried for over 3 weeks now to do this with 2012, but I keep getting the subtitles even when they speak english.

    I purchased the Pavtube Bluray Ripper for this exact application, but when I try to do all of the required settings they suggest, the video plays choppy on the apple tv.

    If someone can please explain what I need to do to get only the forced subtitles only when they are speaking a foreign language and being able to complete this with handbrake, it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thank you for any replys.
     
  21. rayward macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    #21
    Regarding the non-English "forced" subtitles, look for more than on English subtitle track on the disk and set all of them to rip with the movie. In my experience, one of those will be the non-English subtitles only, and that's the one you extract, convert, remux and burn in. You can (usually) identify the correct track pretty easily when you open it in BDSub2Sup, because it will not have every line of dialog in it - look at the time stamps for the subtitles.

    As for choppy playback, make sure that you are using an ATV preset, and that you are using the correct one for your version of ATV (1st or 2nd gen.). If you are using the Universal preset or other non-ATV setting, you may be creating a file with parameters outside of the ATVs somewhat narrow range. Stuttering and choppy playback is the classic symptom of a file that's "too much" for the ATV.
     
  22. shortcut3d macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2011
    #22
    I'm using DVDfab Blu-ray Ripper to mkv.remux and extract all the English subs to idx. Then I remux the subs back in with MKVtoolnix MKVmerge GUI. Handbrake 0.95 can read all the subs and its been easy even with complex subs like the Star Wars saga. The problem is I get sound hiccups after processing through Handbrake. They are in the same spot on all devices (Xbox 360, 2011 Mac mini, 2011 15" MBP, 2010 27" iMac, iPad (3rd gen), iPhone 4S) every time I play the movie. If the MKV never goes through MKVtoolnix, then its a perfect H.264 m4v. I am using Handbrake 0.96 Apple TV 2 preset. I also tried the nightly builds. Is there a setting I'm missing in MKVtoolnix? I read about compression header issues, but that usually means no sound.
     

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