iPad Pro I bought a 2018 1TB w/cell, taking it back..here’s why.

Discussion in 'iPad' started by redneckitengineer, Nov 11, 2018.

  1. redneckitengineer, Nov 11, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2018

    redneckitengineer macrumors 6502


    Oct 27, 2017
    Well, this is an interesting post to write. Maybe I can help others in their final decision to upgrade their iPad or not. I currently have the 2017 iPad Pro, in 256gb with cellular. It’s been my only “PC” for about 8 months now. I did significant research prior to purchasing that one to ensure all of my work applications and needs would be met with the iPad Pro. With the exception of being able to plug a flash drive in, it works great.

    I purchased a new 2018 iPad Pro 1TB Cellular on Friday from an Apple store that still had them in stock. After 2 days of use, I’m realizing I hate it. It’s going to be returned tomorrow. Below are my reasons for taking it back.

    1. Smart Folio is a $200 slap in the face. Having a Logitech Slim Combo on my old one for $129(sale), this was a significant downgrade. On the new one:
    • The keys aren’t backlit on Apple’s version.
    • There are no function keys above the number keys.
    • It’s not removable without taking the entire case off.
    • The keys are spaced weird compared to Logitech.
    • The keys are loud and just feel weird encased in their fabric.
    • You have 2 positions for the stand, whereas the Logitech has infinite similar to Surface Pro.
    • The keyboard has no flex, its either flat or folded behind.
    2. The pencil at $130 is $30 more, but comes with less. With the exception of not having to deal with the stupid cap, which I lost a year ago, it’s a huge downgrade.
    • The pencil definitely has a smaller battery life and it drains from just sitting rapidly.
    • The magnetic charge while a HUGE improvement is very easy to knock off. It’s not “perfectly aligned when you place the pencil on the top,” you have to ensure its on the correct set of magnets atop. It’ll clip in non charging locations.
    • It comes with no extra tips, whereas old one has spare in box.
    • It’s going to make aftermarket cases a nightmare.
    • Performance wise I found flaw where the pencil doesn’t work as well as the old version. The old version was able to basically replace a finger, but on the new one not so much.
    3. The iPad itself. While I love the smaller bezels, I think that’s where it ends.
    • The camera doesn’t have OIS anymore, a small but useful feature taken away.
    • FaceID is a HUGE improvement over the iPhone X, the range and distance are vastly superior. But it still falls into the category of requiring the perfect angle to log in. I find the home button loss greater than expected. Example: Try placing iPad on desk with folio open. Now stand at desk. Try to unlock it from standing. You have to tilt the iPad up and move in, or bend down so it can get perfect angle.
    • I’ve found several apps that have black bars on the edges even on the 12.9 model, not just the smaller one. With some developers taking forever to get updates out, it could be years to resolve this. (Looking at you Hertz, over a year with an iPhone X and still no screen support)
    • Because the iPads run the same software between model years, all you can judge in doing an upgrade is hardware.
    • USB C is useless, besides faster charging its stupid. So you can plug in a 4K monitor and mirror it. But you still have to stare at the iPad itself because it requires touchscreen and pencil to control. You still can’t plug in a flash drive. No mouse support. You need dongles and converters for everything.
    • Requires extra cables in the bag. You can’t just carry the lightning cords anymore, nope. Need that usb c to c cable and brick. Want to charge in any airport, gotta buy a USB A to C cable. Need headphones, dongle. Can’t use that Lightning to 3.5 dongle either, gotta buy another one.
    • No credit card swipers. Thanks to no headphone jack, and no lightning, where’s the square supposed to plug into?
    4. I assume that because of Apple’s crackdown on vendors leaking products, this is why we see no 3rd party cases and accessories at launch anymore. Here we are a month after launch and no one has a good screen protector for the Apple Watch Series 4, the XR has no cases, the iPad Pro has no cases, screen protectors, keyboards, etc.

    All in all, for the $1750 spent over what I’d get for selling my old iPad, I’m not left with a smile on my face, but a simple, why did I do this? And that is why....Apple lost out on $2500 from me.
  2. Greenmeenie, Nov 11, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2018

    Greenmeenie macrumors 65816


    Jan 14, 2013
    Some valid reasons. And if I was coming from an iPad Pro, perhaps I wouldn’t feel the need to update now either. But ... perhaps I still would. I LOVE that new pencil! Lol. Seriously. I do. Plus, I am coming from an iPad mini, and I gave my 9.7” to my brother. So this will be my first iPad Pro. So I feel completely the opposite.

    Here are some reasons why...

    * Again, I Love the new pencil in every way over the old one. Sure, you could knock it off. But come on...I bet more people will lose the old Pencil compared to the new one thanks to the magnetic connector. Not to mention the cap! No cap to lose on the new one.

    * I never used a smart keyboard, I prefer using the virtual keyboard on iPads.

    * I am sure with usb-c Apple will be adding support for external hard drives in the next version of iOS, so I am not worried about that. Plus connecting cameras and other devices will be faster now. I love that.

    * I always buy 3rd party cases for my iPads from Amazon. I have already found some that allow charging of the new pencil for less than $20

    * The black bars on some apps for the 11” won’t bother me. The ones I use I know will be updated soon.

    * Square added a lightning connector in addition to their headphone jack connector, so there is no doubt they will soon add a usb-c connector as well. Also, I have the AirPods and love em. No need for dongles for me.

    * I won’t miss the home button AT ALL. Lol. Seriously. Every home button on every iPad i’ve ever owned has eventually failed. Good riddance! I welcome Face ID on iPads. Especially Face ID that works in any orientation. Nice.

    * Optical image stabilization on an iPad? Really? Couldn’t care less. First of all, not taking too many pics with my giant iPad. But even when I do, the iPad is so big and much easier to stabilize in your hands than an iPhone. Makes total sense to 86 it.

    * Lastly, the slimmer bezel design is sweet! What’s not to love? The 10.5” increases to 11” in the same form factor while the 12.9” keeps the same size screen and shrinks in over all size. Love it.
  3. masotime macrumors 68020


    Jun 24, 2012
    San Jose, CA
    Since you didn’t mention it, I’m going to assume the 12.9” iPad Pro.

    The 2017 iPad Pro is 1.57lb. The “Slim Combo” is 1.41lb - that brings the total weight to 2.98lb! In contrast, the 2018 MacBook Air is lighter at 2.75lb. If the Slim Combo was my only choice, I’d rather get the 2018 MacBook Air.

    In constrast, the 2018 iPad Pro is 1.4lb, and the Smart Folio 0.9lb, making it 2.3lb - still hefty, but 20% lighter than the 2018 MacBook Air. That justifies it for me - I have no problems personally with using the Smart Folio’s keyboard - I don’t need backlighting once I know where at least one key is, don’t use function keys, spacing is good, fine with the 2 positions, not sure why I’d need flex - if you’re using it in your lap, again I recommend the 2018 MacBook Air.

    • Smaller battery life is greatly compensated for by a far more logical charging mechanism.
    • Agree that it is still easy to knock off though.
    • No thoughts about the tips.
    • Don’t really understand the aftermarket cases issue.
    • Can you elaborate on this “flaw”?
    • I am surprised people use the back camera. I guess there are use cases, like photographing documents. Is there demonstrably worse performance just due to the lack of OIS?
    • Not sure about the desk use case. I can’t imagine not sitting down if it’s not already on the desk.
    • 100% agree on the black bar edges - there is little incentive for developers to update, which is a big concern IMO.
    • What do you mean by “all you can judge”? What are you judging exactly?
    • USB-C also brings faster transfer speeds. Much faster. I do concede I would have preferred better file system access for external storage.
    • You also can use the same USB-C to USB-C cable on pretty much every MacBook now. The iPhone is the last major holdout. I think this issue is subjective.
    • Credit card swipers is an extremely specific use case. I’d rather use the cheap iPad for this - I’d very much prefer if America would just ditch the swiping once and for all and use NFC + tokenized cards for payments ala Apple Pay. Swiping is terribly outdated as a payment mechanism around the world, second only to cash / coins.
    You may want to seriously consider the 2018 MacBook Air. It appears to suit your use cases much better - maybe pair it with a cheap cellular iPad as a payment terminal / POS if you need it, along with Pencil needs.
  4. DNichter, Nov 11, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2018

    DNichter macrumors G3


    Apr 27, 2015
    Philadelphia, PA
    Everybody has their reasons, but I am surprised you didn’t realize all of these personal limitations prior to purchasing. Research before you buy next time and it will save you the trouble of returning and writing a post like this.
  5. iapplelove macrumors 601


    Nov 22, 2011
    East Coast USA
    I love mine. But then again I was coming from an air.
  6. Donnation macrumors demi-god


    Nov 2, 2014
    Sadly OP, I'm with you. I'm coming from a 2nd Generation 12.9 Pro and have also decided to return mine. I'm finding several issues with mine and I don't think it comes close to justifying its price.

    Mine has some weird proximity issues. It will randomly act like I touched the screen when I haven't touched it. When playing videos in Youtube it will randomly act like I touched the screen and the pause button will appear, and disappear a few seconds later.

    The Pencil is definitely a downgrade. Having no other way to charge it outside of attaching it to the iPad is not good. It drains the iPad and the Pencil's battery life is definitely worse. I'm baffled that there are actually no feature improvements. It writes the exact same as the previous pencil. What a shame.

    I am also not a fan of the new smart folio keyboard. It is far less versatile than the previous one. The older model allows you to mold it into a stand. Now you need a separate folio case for that functionality. My guess is that due to this model being so fragile, Apple wanted a rigid back on the new one to help support it in a bag.

    Finally, I hate FaceID on an iPad. It just doesn't work for me like it does on a phone and I don't think the two are interchangeable. I think the iPad needs a touchID button like Mac's. But that's a whole other conversation.

    At the end of the day, the only thing I prefer is the design of this one with the small bezels. My 2nd Generation does everything else better or equal to the new one, including case and pencil.
  7. Rogifan macrumors Core


    Nov 14, 2011
    Yeah pretty much everything they listed was known. I haven’t had a battery issue with the Pencil but I don’t typically use it for hours at a time. And when I’m not using it it’s attached and charging.
  8. VMMan macrumors 6502a

    Mar 29, 2009
    I use a MacBook Pro, two 12.9” iPads and two iPhones. I think a MacBook is great, but the iPad can’t be beat for mobile web access and media consumption.

    I agree though that the cost for the new iPads are insane. Apple is also skimping by not including 6gb RAM on all new iPad Pros and including an obsolete USB-C cable instead of a 3.1 gen 2 cable.
  9. Greenmeenie macrumors 65816


    Jan 14, 2013
    Everybody has an opinion, and that’s totally cool. Opinions vary. But I don’t get all this hate for the new Apple Pencil. I feel the exact opposite. To me, it’s better in every single way. I would argue that the new pencil - even if it’s battery is smaller - actually is more charged than the old one for the simple reason it’s ALWAYS attached and charging to your iPad! You’re also less likely to lose it, not to mention there is no annoying cap to lose...nor do you have to awkwardly stick your pencil out of the side of the iPad where it can snap off.

    And I totally don’t understand your statement that you’re baffled how the new Apple Pencil doesn’t actually have any feature improvements. Huh? Aside from the new convenient charging method I already mentioned...um...what about the awesome TAP feature?!!
  10. The Game 161 macrumors P6

    The Game 161

    Dec 15, 2010
    This is the thing it was always going to be very expensive certainly the 1TB. You have to find what is right for you

    Not sure why camera matters on a tablet. I certainly won’t be taking any pics on my 12.9.

    Pencil wise it’s a great improvement to me. If anything just for the charging feature. Double tap is amazing for my work flow.
  11. Newtons Apple macrumors Core

    Newtons Apple

    Mar 12, 2014
    Jacksonville, Florida
    The new iPads are awesome for me. Could not pry it from my hands.

    They are not for everyone.
  12. DeanLubaki macrumors 6502a


    May 29, 2014
    You should have known 99% of what you've written as reasons to return it. Most of what you wrote was known.

    The placement of the Apple Pencil charging spot won't create a nightmare for cases. There are magnets behind the iPad that case makers can make use of.

    If you think USB-C is useless compared to lightning, you've lost all credibility

    To finish, Square makes a card reader that's Bluetooth and more secure because it's chip and PIN (yeah I know y'all in the US still use the magnetic stripe on cards, but the rest of the world doesn't).
  13. VMMan macrumors 6502a

    Mar 29, 2009
    USB-C is definitely the future. I wish the iPhones would use it now.
  14. Newtons Apple macrumors Core

    Newtons Apple

    Mar 12, 2014
    Jacksonville, Florida
    I suspect the USB-C is just around the corner for the 2019 iPhones. I hope so.
  15. redneckitengineer thread starter macrumors 6502


    Oct 27, 2017
    I just got back from the Apple store, it’s gone. Both the clerk and their manager said I wasn’t the only person with the same complaints and they’ve had quite a few come back.

    If I have to justify my opinions to anybody, then they’re no longer opinions. I bought into the hype around the upgrade, hoping for something new and special, and found the new versions worse. I saved myself $2568.14 on that decision, and I can sleep well at night not having to fight myself over whether I should upgrade or not. I’ve concluded, the new one isn’t for me. Done.
  16. masotime macrumors 68020


    Jun 24, 2012
    San Jose, CA
    Can’t agree more. Once iPhones are USB-C, bye bye lightning - it was a crutch that shouldn’t be needed any more - one cable to rule them all - a connector for power, external storage, cameras, sound equipment and displays. No more HDMI, DisplayPort, 3.5mm, DVI, VGA, SPDIF, microUSB, USB-A, miniUSB, etc, etc.
    --- Post Merged, Nov 11, 2018 ---
    Absolutely, buy what works for you. The new iPad Pros are prohibitively expensive - I actually think most people shouldn’t get the 1TB - the 512GB works well unless you have a seriously large budget. I only wish Apple bothered to allow the ability to import files from e.g. a USB-C hard drive into apps via the Files app.
  17. dhill7 macrumors member


    Sep 15, 2016
    So... about the after market cases that support the pencil charging.... lol
  18. Marshall73 macrumors 65832


    Apr 20, 2015
    I went from a gen 1 12.9 pro to the 10.5 pro to the 12.9 gen 3 pro. Love it, Face ID was the main reason I upgraded but I I love the new size and weight. It also seems sturdier than my 12.9 was. Been using it for loads of stuff and not had any apps that have black bars, dunno why there would be with this model as it’s not a new size.
  19. muzzy996 macrumors 6502

    Feb 16, 2018
    Disappointed to hear this. Hopefully by the time I upgrade my gen 2 12.9 this will improve. As someone who had to relinquish control over screen timeout and lock settings to corporate email policies and who uses the iPad Pro for note taking during meetings frequently it’s going to be a major pain in the arse to deal with this in the future. Sitting down taking notes and having to continually type a pin will suck and I don’t think I’d want to frequently pick the tablet up to face it towards me as that will be disruptive to others. Or am I misinterpreting the implications of your example?
  20. Lobwedgephil macrumors 601


    Apr 7, 2012
    Sorry to hear it didn’t work for you OP. These devices won’t work for everyone, good thing is that you save a lot of money this year and for years to come until the next redesign.
  21. urkel macrumors 68030

    Nov 3, 2008
    Hardware kept getting better and better But it really seems that the failures of iOS11 set back the software side. And so we now have a huge gap between hardware capabilities and software limitations.

    I think many people are expecting iOS13 to be the software update that will FINALLY give large screen devices actual reasons to exist. The iPhone Max may get split screen. The iPad Pro may get a tablet UI. And that screaming fast A12 chip will get to actually be used in “pro” apps like Final Cut or... Aperture?

    All this greatness in Apples future is exactly why I cant recommend todays hardware. As we all dream of what the future will be, we should look at Apple’s past and see their history of never actually fulfilling the predictions of the users or even reaching their own potential. Smart Connector was a dud. Lightning Cables didnt take off. Photos.app never evolved. USB-C is often a modern multi-functional port that is used to power legacy dongled peripherals.

    So while I do feel that next year will be the year where iOS Tablets break new ground.... Ive been saying that for the last 4. So I’m just going to stick with my gen 1 iPad Pro because.... It Just Works.
  22. Adrianinkc macrumors member


    Sep 12, 2016
    Keyboard case I agree overpriced.
    Pencil $30 more who cares ? Tips how many have you replaced ?
    You use iPad camera? Lol
    Headphone jack is sticking it to credit card swipers I agree, mouse support really ? It’s a tablet not a computer.

    I think when people hear what’s a computer ? and laptop replacement they get over excited but in reality you will have to learn a new method of doing things, and most people don’t commit to that and bail. It’s not for everyone but for most people if they would open their mind and accept changes and can find a way around them it works great.
  23. Johnny365 macrumors 6502a


    Nov 30, 2015
    I’ve never had the home button fail on any of my devices,
  24. cambookpro macrumors 603


    Feb 3, 2010
    United Kingdom
    The Pro is a great device. But there seems to be a lot of assumptions in that list - it’s very speculative in parts. A lot of posters in this forum seem to be banking on iOS 13 being revolutionary for the iPad, but please excuse my scepticism. I’ve owned my 10.5” for a year and a half now, and I don’t really come close to using it to its full potential. Affinity Photo is the closest I get, but iOS is too restrictive to allow my full workflow to be done on iPad. What’s happened in the time I’ve owned it to help close that gap? Not a lot.

    There’s also a lot of faith in Square, app developers, and a slightly weird bending of the lack of OIS into a positive? I agree, it’s not a massive feature, but not sure it makes ‘total sense’ when I would guess a very important use of an iPad camera is document scanning, which OIS helps with. Not a deal breaker, but was an odd decision, and one I presume was motivated by the want to thin the top bezel?

    I’m not trying to hate on the new Pro - if I was in the market, it’d be the one I would go for. It’s really nice looking. But let’s not pretend this is some revolution. It’s a 10.5” with even bezels, Face ID and roundier corners. Is it faster? Yes, but put them side by side and you won’t get any more work done on the 11”. The software isn’t sophisticated enough.

    I am very, very sceptical of ‘2-in-1’ devices - but these iPads are no longer cheap enough to be thrown around as a great device for reading and watching films. It’s really not an original thought, but they need some new software to help them flourish. Is the answer macOS in ‘docked mode’, and iOS in tablet mode? I’m not sure. But it would interest me more than the current offering.

    Underneath all the new A12X and Liquid Retina and neural engines and 2x faster graphics... it’s still an iPad. (To somewhat paraphrase Bertrand Serlet...)
  25. fm_carv Suspended


    Aug 3, 2015
    Have had several iPad models since my first iPad 2 and never used an iPad as much as I’m using my brand new 12.9 iPad Pro.

    Love it !

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28 November 11, 2018