ICE is out of control

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by NT1440, Mar 3, 2017.

  1. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #1
    https://www.democracynow.org/2017/3/2/asylum_seeker_battling_brain_tumor_removed

    So, Trump tells the joint session: "As we speak tonight, we are removing gang members, drug dealers, and criminals that threaten our communities and prey on our very innocent citizens. Bad ones are going out as I speak, and as I promised throughout the campaign."

    How is a woman with a brain tumor a gang member, drug deal, or criminal?


    Now, to the TREATMENT of this woman:

    "Doctors diagnosed her with a brain tumor, more than half an inch in diameter, and said she needed surgery. It took eight days before she was given permission to call her relatives to tell them where she was and the state of her health"

    " And we were very concerned about the sort of break in her healthcare, where she was going to have to go back to the detention center, where the care is extremely limited. She’s visited only once a day by a nurse in the detention center. She’s receiving Tylenol for a brain tumor. And we didn’t know how urgently she needed the surgery at that time."

    "But then what happened was, ICE put her on what they called a no-contact list, which is something I’ve never heard of before. But it basically keeps the location of the patient a secret, and so she’s not even registered at the hospital. So, when her family tried calling the hospital to ask for her, they would just say, "There’s nobody here by that name." And so, as somebody locally in the area, I was asked to go and see if she was there, and I found her there. But I was denied access by those guards in the room, who actually, you know, yelled at me and said no one’s supposed to even know she’s here."



    So she has a brain tumor, which she's getting tylenol for. She was kept secretly at the hospital where no one was allowed to know she was there. She was not allowed to contact anyone for EIGHT DAYS about her location or medical condition.

    I don't care who the president is, how can America justify this kind of inhumane treatment of people? They essentially disappeared a woman. How can we proclaim our moral superiority to anyone who will listen when this is how we treat medically ill people?
     
  2. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #2
    Was she in the country illegally and did she have health insurance? Canada won't even let you in if you have a serious ailment like terminal cancer.
     
  3. zin macrumors 6502

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    #3
    Got another source? I'd like to read both sides of the story, not just her lawyer's. What is her immigration status? The article appears to allude to an illegal crossing but is vague.
     
  4. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #4
    My god. Who the **** cares? Is your notion that if someone came here illegal they forfeight human rights?

    So you're fine with a government agency being able to disappear people and forcing hospitals to lie to family members about whether a patient is there or not? Is there any type of authoritarianism you're not ok with? .
     
  5. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #5
    You want to force tax payers to pay for the medical treatment of an illegal.

    Taxes are collected at gunpoint.

    That's authoritarian!
     
  6. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #6
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...her-family-pays-15000/?utm_term=.1a6785803aeb
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/24/sara-beltran-hernandez-texas-detention-brain-tumor
    http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/family-attorney-denied-access-hospitalized-asylum-seeker-45645611 <AP source quoted

    Let's get real here, regardless of her immigration status:

    Should an American agency ("land of the free" which holds "law and order" as a core value) be able to disappear people and force hospitals to lie to friends and family about whether a person is there or not?
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2017 ---
    ...is disappearing people without disclosing their location NOT authoritarian in your book?
     
  7. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #7
    I'd rather they do a speedy deportation to her country of origin, but democrats have likely put up red tape around that.

    People don't realize that even in countries with universal health care it's not a free for all health system. If you don't have a OHIP card and are from a foreign country with no insurance and are in stable condition they aren't going to operate on you. A shady member of my wife's family came from Portugal to try to get a surgical op from a local hospital here for stomach cancer, they basically told her if she didn't have insurance they wouldn't do the operation.
     
  8. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #8
    Do you have any valid sources besides her lawyers?

    What's happening in the US is outrageous.
    Try to get "free" treatment anywhere else as an illegal immigrant.
    See how that goes for you.

    And if you are really that upset you are free to go over there and pay for her treatment out of your own pocket.
     
  9. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #9
    I'll ask again, specifically regarding her being secretly held at a hospital and not being able to contact a lawyer or family for eight days:

    So you're fine with a government agency being able to disappear people and forcing hospitals to lie to family members about whether a patient is there or not? Is there any type of authoritarianism you're not ok with? .
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2017 ---
    Post #6.
     
  10. DrewDaHilp1, Mar 3, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2017

    DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

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    What kind of care would she have received in El Salvador? And don't forget she was detained over a year ago.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2017 ---
    The hospital wasn't lying. HIPPA; that and even US citizens that are prisoners are rarely allowed visitors while in custody and hospitalized.
     
  11. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #11
    Depends on the situation and if it was lawful. We don't have the details about why she was put on a no contact list. Either way no laws have changed from the past 8 years, so it's either illegal or Obama didn't do anything to stop this type of detainment.
     
  12. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #12
    Those articles are all just repeating the same claims by her lawyers.
     
  13. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #13
    Visitors are different from not disclosing a patient is there. I know that happens a lot with prisoners, but how is that not ****ed up? What justification is there in this country for such a practice? It's just cruel to family.
     
  14. webbuzz macrumors 65816

    webbuzz

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    #14
    Trump sure does get a lot of use out of that DeLorean.
     
  15. zin macrumors 6502

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    That's not what happened, though. According to the AP report, visits are permitted but only if the attorneys follow the proper procedure and receive approval from ICE and the appropriate consulate in advance. The AP report doesn't mention anything about ICE agents lying.

    It appears they didn't follow the proper procedure. I don't blame them on the publicity, though. It is their job to make the situation sound as bad as possible for their client.
     
  16. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #16
    So what the **** is a "valid source" to you?
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2017 ---
    Who said a ****ing thing about Trump, I used his quote to lay out the supposed goal of the agency and then started discussing TACTICS? ICE has abused countless people over the last 4 administrations, why is everything a partisan game to you people? My whole framing of this thread was to be a discussion of ICE tactics (hence the title) and the fact that they are now ramping up deportations under the GUISE of gang members and drug dealers. Is this woman one of them?
     
  17. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #17
    Donald J Trump
     
  18. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

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    #18
    She was in federal custody, therefor she was a prisoner. A hospital I am very familiar with leases a section to the State Bureau of Corrections, someone comes looking for a patient of that ward they get told the same thing, "I can't tell you if they are here." What they can do for you is to contact the Corrections and let them know that you are there. Still doesn't mean you are going to get to visit.
    There a world full of sob stories, it sucks, The United States can't take in every person at the heart of those sob stories.
     
  19. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #19
    My god.

    This is why I hate this board sometimes. The Hospital was told not to let family or attorneys KNOW THE PATIENT WAS THERE. WHAT DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH VISITATION??
     
  20. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #20
    You should get a new CPA. I've never had a gun pulled on me at H&R Block.
     
  21. DearthnVader macrumors regular

    DearthnVader

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    #21
    This is the kind of anecdotal story that liberals largely ignored when Obama was in office.

    ICE has been out of control for sometime:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/08/immigration-ice_n_5951970.html

    Only now liberals, looking for something, anything, to blame on Trump, his policies, and administration, can pretend to be outraged.

    It's funny how that outrage goes away, as soon as a liberal takes office.
     
  22. webbuzz macrumors 65816

    webbuzz

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    #22
    The article in your OP mentions him a few times.
     
  23. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #23
    Bwwahahahahahaha.
     
  24. NT1440 thread starter macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #24
    Please read.

    Please read.

    Please read.

    This thread is not about the ****ing president, his statements were there in the OP to outline the supposed focus of ICE, but people with medical conditions are a high enough priority apparently.
     
  25. Meister Suspended

    Meister

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    #25
    Anyone but her lawyer?
     

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