Illegal immigration is America's fault

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by nbs2, Aug 23, 2007.

  1. nbs2 macrumors 68030

    nbs2

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    #1
    Because the US allows people to cross the border without documents, America has broken it's law and thus shouldn't be allowed to deport illegals.

    So says an illegal immigrant.
     
  2. PlaceofDis macrumors Core

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    #2
    interesting point of view.
    and indeed one that should be considered, no?

    i haven't quite decided where i stand on the whole immigration issue, but i do agree that reforms and changes are necessary.
     
  3. Desertrat macrumors newbie

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    #3
    :D:D:D

    It's a thought process called "rationalization". Any parent is quite familiar with it. Kids work the heck out of it, to get what they want when they know full well they shouldn't.

    'Rat
     
  4. dswoodley macrumors 6502a

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    #4
    Indeed, seems like pretty childish reason to me.
     
  5. calculus Guest

    calculus

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    #5
    Is the whole concept of illegal immigration not highly ironic in the context of America?
     
  6. jczubach macrumors 6502

    jczubach

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    #6
    Yeah like didn't your forefathers start it a couple of centuries ago? Smarten up already.
     
  7. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #7
    It is, especially considering how difficult we've made it to legally immigrate to the US. All the time I hear people say, "Why don't these people come legally?" The answer is, because it's become virtually impossible.
     
  8. dswoodley macrumors 6502a

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    #8
    I'll admit the process isn't easy, but "virutally impossible?" Come on. I know at least dozen people who have become citizens over the last 5 years. Hard, yes, but doable.
     
  9. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

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    #9
    It is, and the most vocal anti-immigrant people either have no clue or are ignoring history to suit themselves.

    In my opinion, the only people who have absolutely any right to complain about immigration are Native Americans.
     
  10. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #10
    I'll stick with virtually impossible, especially for people without education, skills, and money. It can take years and require hiring lawyers even for aliens married to US citizens to be granted resident status by the Immigration Service.

    As for becoming a citizen, that's an entirely different story. But you have to be a legal resident alien first. That's the virtually impossible part.
     
  11. longofest Editor emeritus

    longofest

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    #11
    I used to work with a guy who was an immigrant. He was the most vocal person I know against illegal immigration. His view was that he went through the process and paid his dues... so should everyone else. He is very against any kind of "amnesty" program (sorry for using a loaded word).

    On the same hand, I do believe he is for expanding current immigration policies to allow more immigrants into the US.
     
  12. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #12
    I do too- some were Iraqi citizens. If they can do it, so can everyone else. Mexico needs to fix it's problems, we shouldn't be their dumping ground.
     
  13. nbs2 thread starter macrumors 68030

    nbs2

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    #13
    I do think you have different contexts. People coming into your land and usurping your land - yeah, only the indigenous peoples have pretty much exclusive jurisdiction. But, until recently, people coming over had to rely on themselves and people who cared - not the government. Immigrate if you want, but the government shouldn't be expected to take on support responsibility for more than it has allocated resources. If I budget for 4 people to come to my house for dinner, expecting me to feed 6 is going to be tough.

    And far be this country from being impossible without the handouts. The number of times that I've heard my dad tell his story of coming to the states with $8 in his pocket, $2 of which he lost in Germany because they wouldn't let him bring food on the plane, probably exceeds the grains of sand in the sea.
     
  14. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #14
    Depending on how you want to split hairs the whole concept of illegal immigration could be seen as highly ironic in the context of any country not located in the "cradle of civilization". Of course the text book definition of immigration is basically moving from "country A" to "country B", but if you move from "country A" into a sparsely populated land that is not a country is that immigration or human migration?

    Getting back on point, I don't think the defense of "you didn't do enough to prevent me from breaking known laws" is a very solid one. I mean, if Mick Vick stood up and said, "I think I should be cleared of all charges because state and federal law enforcement did not do enough to prevent me from fighting and killing dogs" would anyone not wonder if was suffering from NFL related head trauma?


    Lethal
     
  15. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

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    #15
    I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong) he was referring to the fact that many of our European ancestors illegally immigrated to this country.
     
  16. TheAnswer macrumors 68030

    TheAnswer

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    #16
    Ironically enough, México once tried to deal with an illegal immigration problem, in the state of Tejas. This was met with financial and military backing of the illegal population by the U.S. Government, incursions by the U.S. army onto Mexican soil and eventually the occupation of the northern 3/8ths of México.
     
  17. jczubach macrumors 6502

    jczubach

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    #17
    Yeah, except for their cheap sweatshop produced products!:mad:
     
  18. dswoodley macrumors 6502a

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    #18
    payback?
     
  19. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #19
    I assumed he was talking about Columbus and the lot that follwed coming over, killing Native Americans and putting up houses. Which is why I raised the hair-spliting (and mostly rhetorical) question of human migration vs immigration. If calculus was talking about after Europeans slapped the name "America" on a map then my post is irrelevant. ;)


    Lethal
     
  20. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #20
    Please don't confuse ordinary immigration with political asylum. It may be difficult to accept, but the US has become openly hostile to immigration. The spirit of your remark is sadly reminiscent of the 1920s, when the current attitude towards immigration began (when we were being called "Europe's dumping ground"). Few people seem to appreciate how difficult immigration become since that time -- by design.
     

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  21. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #21
    IJ- It wasn't political asylum for the Iraqis I know. They came here in the late 90's. Please don't put words in my mouth. I do know what I'm talking about from time to time. And I'm sorry but, there is indeed a lot of racism that exists in Mexico against people of American Indian descent. I've gotten that info from Mexicans themselves. I don't see why we should be solving their problems by taking anyone Mexico discriminates against.
     
  22. TheAnswer macrumors 68030

    TheAnswer

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    #22
    If the Mexican government had the resources to back their immigrant population here that were equal to the support that the U.S. government gave to the illegal population in Tejas, I'd probably be posting this from California, E.U.M.

    A further ironic twist is that because of racism in Mexican society, many of the illegal immigrants are those with a majority of Native American heritage, i.e. from native populations by-in-large unsullied by the Conquistadores and their descendants.

    So, you could consider it payback by México for territories lost in the Intervención Norteamericana en México, or consider it the repopulation of Native American territories taken from them by the Caucasian invasions.
     
  23. dswoodley macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    Yes, this is what I was getting to.
     
  24. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #24
    Haha- didn't think of it that way. Interesting POV.
     
  25. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #25
    It's your own words to which I am responding. The "dumping ground" argument is precisely the same one which has been used for nearly 100 years to rationalize immigration restrictions. Why do you think people came to the US 100 years ago, because they were well treated in their home countries?
     

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