Indonesian Atheist Facing Jail Time For Saying "God Doesn't Exist"

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by AP_piano295, May 3, 2012.

  1. AP_piano295 macrumors 65816

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    #1
  2. Sedulous macrumors 68000

    Sedulous

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    #2
  3. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #3
  4. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #4
    You're right we should change the laws so we can arrest Dan Savage for his behavior. Just complaining about his affront to Christian doctrine isn't nearly enough, this is a Christian nation, Christians should be protected from such hurtful remarks.

    He's gay as well, that's "un-natural".
     
  5. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #5

    Your irrational hatred of religion makes it impossible to have a discussion with you. You're just looking to fight with people.

    It's clear from my posts here that i think Dan Savage should be arrested and that I think being gay is "un-natural". :rolleyes:
     
  6. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #6
    Irrational - Not logical or reasonable

    I have a reason and I have logic, religion is counter to common sense promotes violence, bigotry, misogyny etc.

    Have you looked at gay marriage laws in this country? Have you seen how women are treated in Afghanistan?

    My hatred for religion is quite rational it is one of the greatest shackles on the human spirit that has ever been invented.

    It might not be illegal to be a racist in America, but just trying running for the presidency as an atheist and see how far you get.
     
  7. NewbieCanada macrumors 68030

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    #7
    He wasn't trying to have a discussion with you, you were trying to have one with him. And since you made it personal, i question just who is looking for a fight.
     
  8. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #8

    Dude, what's your problem? You're preaching to the choir here. I simply commented on your comment comparing it to Savage.
     
  9. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #9
    Maybe an earlier thread of his will put my reaction more in context.

    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1354493
     
  10. Mac'nCheese macrumors 68030

    Mac'nCheese

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    #10
    I'm so confused here. I like to think my sarcasm meter is pretty good but I swear to god who doesn't exist I don't know who is on what side here. Look, I'm even gonna use a smiley: :confused:
     
  11. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #11
    The truth will set you free.*

    * Offer not available in Indonesia.
     
  12. mudslag macrumors regular

    mudslag

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    #12


    So first off, you really believe he should serve time for his beliefs? You are saying it's disrespectful to others but not to him?




    Can't tell if you're trolling or just really ignorant. FTR it's not a christian nation, it's a nation made up for anyone with any religious beliefs.
     
  13. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #13
    From the OP's originally linked article ...

    If they had banned that book, they probably would have avoided the problem entirely.

    I blame the Thought Police.

    They obviously weren't doing their job.
     
  14. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #14
    Alright I'm going to try and calm down the redirect and lets see if we can have a discussion on this.

    I believe that you and I are both atheists (correct?).

    What I would say is that we occupy two very different "camps" of atheism, I would be described as a "militant atheist" or at least I would probably described that way by many.

    I would describe you as a passive atheist, (a camp that I once occupied). Putting words in your mouth here but I believe that you think atheism and religion need not be at odds and that there is nothing particularly "wrong" with being religious so long you don't attempt to force your beliefs on others.

    (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)

    Now here's an explanation of why I've become more hostile towards religion. And why I feel it's appropriate to directly attack religious thinking and doctrine.

    First let me draw my boundaries, regardless of how much I hate religion (and I really do hate religion). I do not hate religious people, and I don't condone any law or regulation which prohibits religious belief and worship.

    The reason I've become so much more aggressive towards religion is that I do not believe religion has almost any capacity to exist beside science. The reason I believe this are many but the most basic reason for it is that religion encourages thinking that doesn't reflect reality and this is a poisonous to thought. (I'll expound on this if you want to have a conversation).

    I do see religion as a threat to reasonable thought and liberty, even at its most moderate religious thought is always vulnerable to circumstance. That's why we see periods of fundamentalism springing from periods of relative secularism. So long as religion persists, the potential for fundamentalist resurgence persists.

    ----------

    I'm taking the stance of many political figures in this country including recent potential presidential candidates. There is a significant anti secularism movement in this country and I'm speaking satirically/sarcastically through my interpretation of that movement.
     
  15. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #15
    Let me see if I understand this.

    You're saying in essence, "I am an iron-stiff ramrod of conviction ... long and hard as forged steel. While you, on the other hand are soft and limp. But fear not, my friend, because I was once soft and limp too and sympathize with your wretched state."

    Was that about right? :cool:
     
  16. Ishmumrhmn macrumors regular

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    #16
    If you're an atheist----cool. But if you make a huge deal about "god doesn't exist" BS and post it on facebook then you really deserve some jail time like the guy above
     
  17. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #17
    No more like there are multiple viewpoints on how the interaction between religion and society should be handled.

    There is this feeling among some atheists/agnostics that religion is more or less benign so long as it doesn't infringe directly on their rights. There is also the incorrect idea that atheism is in itself a "religious" position, and to call oneself and atheist and/or attack religion demonstrates a high degree of arrogance.

    This is faulty reasoning. Atheism isn't a belief system any more than off is a a TV channel, atheism isn't a claim it is the denial of a claim which has provided no supporting evidence.

    Over time my views of what it means to be an atheist have changed. Issues like the evolution and climate change debate have led me to believe that even benign religion does enormous harm to one's ability to reason and think scientifically. This by extension leads to proliferation of beliefs about the world and its function that while "nice" maintain a system that is injustice, irrational, and destructive.
     
  18. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #18
    I'm not sure why Facebook makes it a jailable offense.

    What about Myspace?

    What if he tweeted it?
     
  19. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #19
    Ah so saying "god doesn't exist" is BS.

    Do explain your reasoning.
     
  20. eawmp1, May 3, 2012
    Last edited: May 4, 2012

    eawmp1 macrumors 601

    eawmp1

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    #20
    So would that make you a radical, fundamentalist athiest?






    Back on topic, I thought there was a war on religion, not atheism.
     
  21. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #21
    Not sure if this is tongue and cheek or not but no it wouldn't make me a "fundamentalist" atheist. For the simple reason that there are no fundamentals of atheism. Fundamentals require a belief system, atheism is not a belief.

    A better word would be anti-theist, I have a strong belief that religion and religious thought is severely damaging to humanity and the world. I personally believe in confronting religion and religious thought for this reason.

    Not all atheists are anti-theists, but I am.
     
  22. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #22
    I would agree with you. There is nothing honorable about lying to people to make them feel like they aren't going to die.
     
  23. Sedulous macrumors 68000

    Sedulous

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    #23
    If you are a theist don't make a huge deal about your "faith" on Facebook...

    The "public forum" is saturated with "faith".
     
  24. AP_piano295 thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #24
    Oh and in case people are inclined to imagine that this sort of think "only happens in other countries" but we in America are protected, I would suggest you read the Tennessee constitution.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_State_Constitution

    Which bans atheists from holding public office.
     
  25. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #25
    God does not exist. I just said it. Put me in jail.

    Are you ****ing serious?
     

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